Work night out problems - sorry - extremely long!!

[Charlene1]

Boss paid for my office to go out for a night out this month as we were all fantastic at sales etc and he wanted to treat us all. Was supposed to be on Friday night, but he asked us to change it to Thursday and then he couldn't make it. He told the office manager to book somewhere - her choice. She chose a restaurant in the next town. She never bothered asking how anyone was getting there or back - we were left to make our own arrangements. 3 of us can't drive, so I asked my colleague (A2) I she wanted to share a taxi home, to be probably no later than 1am. She said yes.
We were all looking forward to going out and having fun.

In the restaurant, A2 hardly ate anything (didn't like food) and had 2 double vodka and cokes. A1 asked if we were getting a taxi, we said probably - they didn't offer us a lift, nor the other non driver (who was offered a lift by my other colleague). No one else offered us lifts.
Then A1 and A2 decided to go to nearby bar - others all left, and me and A2 went to the bar, as we were looking forward to having a bit of fun and a nice night out. They bought A2 2 more double vodkas and cokes. A3's housemate turned up and took them home (in the company car again), we walked to bus station, but had missed last bus (gone 11pm), so called a taxi back to our town. Both felt we didn't want to go home just yet as it was too early, so stopped near work to find a pub to have another drink in - most were closed, but we found one and had 2 drinks in there each (she bought them!). I really did not see any problem with going to an extra pub for a bit(apart from making sure I didn't buy alcohol for her - it was up to her if she wanted to try her luck getting served etc with being underage - she is 17).
Then she "copped off" with 2 separate lads and got their numbers. We left at 12.30pm and we were heading towards the taxi rank when she suddenly decided no way in hell was she going home yet, and rang one of the lads to come and meet her to "go somewhere" - I tried for 20 mins to talk her out of it thinking she will get attacked or murdered if she went off with them, she ran off to meet this lad and his friend. I was left on my own in the street, and could have been mugged or attacked by anyone passing. They came walking back with her saying they were going home as everywhere was shut. Luckily they were decent and I told them she had to get home as we had work next day and I felt responsible for getting her home as it was an official work night out. I then had an argument with her for the next 1/2 an hour nearly with her saying "you're not my manager, I was spoiling her night, I'm not going home, I'm going the shop to get some booze and sit in the park". I said in the absence of A1 then yes, I was her manager, and she couldn't behave like that on a work night out - she had to go home. She said she didn't care about her job - I was definitely bothered about mine though!!

I eventually got her in a taxi, but she got out her side near her house, whilst it was moving saying she felt ill and she wasn't going home, but started walking to her house. I could not force her back in as that is assault and kidnapping - I didn't know what to do. She was falling in the hedge and staggering everywhere.
Taxi refused to wait to see if she actually went in her door safely and told me to either get out with her or carry on home - I had to go home as there was no way I could have risked walking from there and didn't have enough credit to ring another taxi. Texted her when I got home - no answer, she eventually rang me at about 2.15am (being sick as she was talking to me) saying she was home. I went bed, DP went mad next morning as I was in so late, as dd had been ill, and he didn't believe where I'd been and why - said I was "out slagging it" (I most definitely wasn't!) So we have rowed over it.

I went work, got in 15 mins early - found out she had rung in sick, saying she had been up all night being sick from too much drink. No idea what she'd had told A1 on the phone - they didn't tell me, apart from "Bosses were "not impressed" with her" - my boss hardly spoke to me, just kept throwing work at me all morning (usually ignores me, so I knew he was pissed off).
Colleagues (who I thought were my "friends") and DP have said it's my fault she didn't turn up, as I was responsible for her - I argued with DP that A1 and A3 had arranged the night out for work, and should have made sure we had taxis etc he said that's not the point - I should have left her on her own to go off and be killed etc. Colleague said I shouldn't have gone to the pub after. I really don't see how that makes me the one in the wrong - no one forced her to go and drink - she wanted to go, then wouldn't go home. If she had turned up with a hangover it would not have been so bad - the problem is because she went off with me and didn't make it to work. I used to go out and get plastered every night as a teenager, and alway made it in work next day, so I assumed everyone else is the same - after all A1 and A3 spend their lives going out in the week, getting bladdered, and boasting how bad they feel at work next day.
It is "expected" and encouraged to drink as much as possible on these work nights out - it is not a good night if you go home sober.

If I thought for a minute she was going to behave like that, I would never have offered to share a taxi - I would have just gone home on my own after the meal.
She is getting a verbal warning on Monday, I am not in until late Mon morning, so I will not be there to give my side of it or hear what goes on.
I like her, but she has lied about things before - e.g. she asked me for work to do as she was bored, then told the other manager I had "told her she had to do it".
She doesn't remember what she does when she drinks, so A1 and A3 could tell her anything - and she will believe them e.g oh I left her to walk or got her drunk etc.

A1 and A3 will make out it was my fault to the bosses and everyone else probably - DP says they have deliberately set me up as they don't like me and I fell for it, as they know what she's like better than me.
At the xmas party, A2 got out of the minibus home on the motorway and refused to get back in - everyone had to leave her at the services on her own and she rang her mum to come and get her ( I wasn't with her then).
When we went out last month, she came in work hungover next day and had to be sent home.
Before xmas she went out (I didn't go) with work - got drunk and they put her in a taxi home - she phoned in sick next day.
She has phoned in sick a couple of other times as well, due to drink.

If anyone has got this far reading - well done!! I would appreciate some advice on how to come out of this on Monday without the entire company turning against me. Dp says I have damaged my reputation/career now forever in the eyes of my bosses/colleagues.

I am hoping on the next night out, if I don't go out; she will do the same again and they will all see it is her that is the problem, not anyone she is with.
But this means I can't go out again then - cos if I do, I will get lumbered with trying to get her home - and if I leave her to make her own way home, they will all blame me if she does get murdered or something. Or A1 and A3 will make a big show of giving her a lift home to make me look bad e.g "oh she's safe with them, but look what happens if she stays out with me"
If I take the blame for her not turning up for work, I will get a warning probably - and I really don't feel I should.
DP says at his work I definitely would face disciplinary and she would be sacked as we carried on the night out after the official "work night" had finished - which is grounds for disciplinary as misconduct. I don't see why we should have to go home at half past ten when I rarely go out (hardly ever since having kids) - I want to make the most of being out, and not get all dressed up to sit in a restaurant for an hour and then go home to watch telly until bedtime - if it had been Friday when we went out, as originally planned, then she'd have had all weekend to recover and we would all have laughed about it on Monday morning. I don't feel I can ever be the same with her again after this.
I really think I am doomed whatever I do.
Help!!

I think it's quite an odd thing to say actually Charlene, so what are these women supposed to do? Once their children leave school they have to resign? Or say no to looking after their grandchildren while their own children work full-time as you do, because they have to work all year round so the 'mums' can have the term-time jobs?

Cam, I did say that I meant people of over 60 / retirement age etc - that's why I said to them and on here, I wasn't meaning to offend.
I have known people who worked in schools and did resign when they no longer needed those hours so they could get a full time job with full time pay. Not everyone realise you get less because you are NOT paid for school holidays in most cases. If someone is looking after grandkids then that is different, I was on about people who don't have any dependents etc - the ones I knew in the past moaned about not getting paid and holidays being too long - that's why I have the opinion that they shouldn't work there if they don't "need to", as term time jobs are rare and I just didn't think it was fair for people to say they don't like working like that!

And have you ever watched someone over the age of 50 try to get a job? I have. My dad was made redundant, in the end he had to go right back to being a warehouse lad, at the age of 53, because trying to get a job once you are over a certain age is very difficult. Not the way it should be perhaps but the way it is. Maybe you need to get all the facts before making sweeping statements to those that obviously aren't your biggest fans in the first place.

I was reading your post with much sympathy until I got to this last bit.

What a silly thing to say - thoughtless and offensive. No longer people in the office are no longer speaking to you. What right do you have to say who should/shouldn't have a job where they want to?

But to answer your earlier posts:

Don't bother going out with your work colleagues - what is in it for you apart from some booze?

Go out with your husband - your relationship sounds as if it needs some attention. If you haven't got a babysitter, get one. Agencies are very good and worth checking out.

Actually BecauseI'mWorthIt - you obviously haven't read my posts properly (well I know you haven't as you put husband in your post and I have always referred to my partner as DP). I am certainly not the only one that has ever thought that women who have kids should get priority for term time jobs, as most of the people I knew whilst I was a SAHM thought it wasn't fair either that there were so few opportunities - doesn't mean they or I are "prejudiced" or being offensive -
as regards to your suggestion of a babysitter - I did say we don't trust strangers so going out together is NOT an option - we can't just "get one".
It may have been silly to say what I did in the way it came out, but the main point I was making is that I am not "allowed" to have an opinion on anything at work, unless it agrees with the others. They have not spoken to me for 2 days because I didn't fancy the same sandwiches as them for lunch - how petty is that??? I only speak to A1 and A3 now if I have to - I have been emailing them where possible.
By the way Pillock - my own parents were made redundant in their fifties, and had part time jobs - my father working term time. They did nothing but complain about school holidays every time - "can't go away cos it costs too much, kids everywhere etc", can't get into work as you are not there every 6 weeks or so. No one forced my father to get his job - he had a choice of 3 different places, but chose that one and complains about it. Your father may have found it hard to get a job equal to what he had left - how many people on here (myself included) cannot even get an interview because the employer knows you have kids and want loads of time off in the summer?? So please don't attack me for my posts.

Do you not perhaps think my parents complaining and my ex colleagues complaining has influenced my way of thinking as well?
Yes, my opinion is that someone who is trying to get back into work after staying home with their kids should have a chance at a basic admin job in a school if they need the hours and cannot afford holiday club fees - I worked in a school as I said, and I was very grateful that it gave me the "recent work experience" on my CV to get me my current job - even though this is going down the pan. I gave it up because there was no work for me there at the time and I was unhappy, but if there had have been a replacement, I would like to think they would have chosen someone else who had young kids and was desperate for those hours - and not someone like my mother/ ex colleague who had just seen it advertised and thought "that'll do for a job". There are hardly any ever term time jobs here - in a population of 100,000 people - so I don't think it makes me a bad person to think that - and I certainly don't think "no wonder people aren't speaking to me". I am not "ageist" by any means - but obviously there are bound to be people that tell me I am wrong to have my own opinion on something - just like my present colleagues!
I should be offended then that I am "a mother who can swan off to assemblies and they can't swan off shopping" (my colleagues words) and make the time up - as they don't see that I have to come out of work to go to such things, get there, clock watch, go back, and then work the time up after everyone has gone - so I am exhausted when I get home from having such a long day - because I can't use annual leave up as that is for the school holidays. I would love to have 6 weeks unpaid this year but A) we can't afford it, B) my boss would not allow it.
And it doesn't change the fact that I am being ostracised in the office for anything from disagreeing with my colleagues on important issues to wanting a jacket potato for my dinner when they don't, because they can't "control" me.

Hi Charlene, are you still around? Read your other thread and your job sounds like hell Feel so bad for you having to endure those witches everyday. Do the directors not like you? I know you say that they love the 2 making your life a misery, but really they have to take your complaint of bullying seriously and be neutral in their approach to you all. I do hope you get it sorted. Good luck

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Thanks Lola - yes the Directors think I'm wonderful - unfortunately they think everyone is!!! They don't get involved in daily staff problems really - my boss is so stressed he doesn't really take it in what I am saying. The two women I originally offended have not held anything against me (as far as I know!) and I did apologise to them - one is now suggesting we stick together against the two horrible ones, and raise a formal grievance as she has her own issues with them as do most people! I know I will have back up from the other office, but I dread to think how bad things will be if they get disciplined because we've complained. I have been looking carefully at employment websites and WE could get fired for not getting on with them as they have been there longer and have a more "integral" role to the company - one of the reasons I think for them to try and make life unbearable is so I'll leave and they won't have to learn or use the computer system.

MotherFunk, let me answer your post - I am not going to go into who should work in a school and who shouldn't - if you misread my posts and get uppity because of that that's your problem. And you should hear how some agencies talk about who should be in jobs and who shouldn't - that'd really piss you off!! So I don't think I'm an ogre.
You said "I have never had that much sympathy for you from the start actually" - well as I said you need to read people's posts properly and not try and twist things.

"No matter how you justify it, it is a ridiculous thing to say. Nonsense."
Yes, I said I'd screwed up, so let's drop that bit shall we?

"where the hell do you live that you think that being alone outside at night means you will be attacked/murdered/mugged/killed? You are a little over-dramatic there don't you think! Especially with 'attacked or mugged by anyone passing'.. calm down dear!"
I have actually been attacked (in different ways, which I'm not going to post about on here) more than once walking down the street, both in daylight and at night in a busy area - not just pub related either. I know plenty of others who have been attacked (male and female) so yes there is a danger in my town and I do feel afraid going out on my own, but I cannot stay in forever because of this. Obviously I'm not going to say where I live, but murders and stabbings are quite regular. I used to know of plenty of people who have done time for gbh/murder and don't care. Oh, and A2 had already been attacked a couple of years ago as well - there used to be a rule with my old friends that you never leave the people you go out with - you make sure everyone gets home. A1 and A3 only care about themselves getting home - same as they only care about themselves at work.

"You took an underage girl to a pub, and drank drinks that she bought. You broke the law, not to mention behaved very irresponsibly. Yes, she has a job and is responsible for her own actions, but she is underage, and you should not get involved"
Er no - I did not "take her anywhere" - she wanted to go more than I did - no one forced her, and I did not break any law by drinking alcohol she bought - the pub broke the law serving it to her - she could have bought cokes. Buying booze for someone under 18 is illegal, and I would never do it, but them going in a pub isn't if they aren't drinking - it's up to the licensee who goes in - and there were door staff who obviously didn't think she was a child.
Getting into pubs from about aged 13 onwards here is the main attraction for teenagers - there's nothing else to do except sit on the streets and drink - no bouncers there if you need help.
So I was not irresponsible - and plenty of others don't think so now either now they know the full story. I was "involved" as it was a work night out - any other night out is her own affair - I probably would have just got my own taxi and let her go off with the lads - and at least I tried to look after her whereas the others swanned off and didn't care how she got home. They were lamenting the other day that they haven't got her for "entertainment" on the next night out - a colleague came pasty and said to me "at least you won't be set up and lumbered with A2 anymore now!".

"Without meaning to sound too mean.. you sound a bit strange, the people at your work don't talk to you, you have no other friends.. I think maybe you need to work on your social abilities a little."

Well - that is mean. You have obviously not read earlier posts saying why I don't have friends outside of work - I am not "strange" - how rude! Saying no one talks to me is ridiculous - of course they do - just not the 2 I am having trouble with. I talk to everyone - the ones I had the argument with can be hard work sometimes as I said, but I don't hate them and they don't hate me - they certainly still speak and act professional. I just have to choose my words very carefully sometimes to play office politics. It is beyond that with the other two. I do have someone I class as a "friend" at work and have started talking to a few more people in the playground - but they are like me - can't get out at night because they have kids etc. Doesn't make people strange - just different lifestyles.

So, how can I work on "social skills" if I don't go out socially????

I think you need to work on making your posts sound more "social" or you run the risk of offending people.

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