Any lawyers in the GLD here?

[GLDadvice]

I’m an 8pqe solicitor (litigation), currently working at a US firm in London having trained and spent the first 5 years of my career in a magic circle firm.

Ive got 2 small children (4 and 2) and I just don’t think I want to do this anymore. Partnership doesn’t appeal (other than the £!) and I’ve always been interested in the GLD. There are a few G6 roles advertised atm and seriously considering it.

Can anyone give me some insights into the job, especially anyone who moved from private practice (especially after a solid chunk in PP)? Would I regret it?

I don't work for the GLD but have done work for GLD and know a lot of people who have worked for them.

I know several women who have moved in exactly the circumstances you describe. The trade off for lower pay is more flexible working and really interesting work. I got the impression that - like all public services - they are hugely understaffed so people are busy but as an employer they are very open to flexible and part time working. That said this info could be very out of date.

I know four I think maybe five women who left the Bar when their children were young to go to the GLD and all really liked it and said it suited their circumstances better than private practice. Three of them came back to the Bar when their children were older so make of that what you will.

I'd see if you can get in touch with someone who works there. If you do magic circle litigation, I expect you have friends who are barristers in chambers where there are people on the AG panels - they are bound to know some people in GLD who have done what you have done. I mean real friends as opposed to random work contacts as I expect you want to keep a potential move quiet!

I know someone who made the move and loved it. It's very flexible.

Some more ideas from a fellow litigator who hated the never-ending pressures of partnership and just wants an easy life with flexible working hours and pretty close to zero responsibility (but still decent-ish pay):

Lecturing at university (pm me if you want to know more as there is one that is always recruiting) - if you do it as a freelancer it's much more lucrative and much more flexible than if you agree to a work full time. You can easily earn £450 per day as a freelance lecturer (that's if you cover 3 classes so not even a full working day) and I only agree to lecture their online classes or (if I feel like it) once every few weeks I agree to go and lecture in person in central London. You can make your own schedule and it's completely up to you how much or little you're prepared to take on.

Document review - if you enjoy disclosure it's the easiest job in the world with almost zero responsibility 😂and can be very well-paid.

Thank you! Sounds quite encouraging. The pay cut is terrifying (I’m the breadwinner) - I earn more than 3x the salary currently - but unbelievably we might be better off financially if we also relocated.

I love work and need the intellectual stimulation but increasingly feel like the life maths don’t add up. Ideally I’d go part time or be able to compress my hours as well - assume this is very possible?

I'm a current GLD lawyer and have been for years.

Loads of people are refugees from private practice looking for a better work life balance.

The good things:

• Really interesting work. Even new/junior lawyers get involved in very high profile work. A lot of the work is totally unique to GLD - advising ministers, taking Bills through parliament, drafting SIs etc.
• Great colleagues - supportive and a good sense of cameraderie.
• Flexible working patterns are completely normal. PT, job shares, compressed hours etc. Also pretty flexible on working from home/office. And easy to take extra unpaid leave if you need it.
• Lots of opportunities to move around and work in different areas. It's a big organisation with a lot of variety.
• Public sector ethos is strong - you feel like you're contributing to wider society not just making money for big corporations.
• There is a pretty decent payrise in the pipeline. It's not been signed off by the unions yet, but it is very generous.
• The working hours are reasonable compared to private practice (but see below). We usually do work longer than contracted hours but it's not seen as a good thing to work long hours.

The bad things:

• Pay. But see above.
• There has been a recruitment/retention problem which means we are understaffed and as a result the hours can be longer than they used to be. Don't expect to always be able to work 37 hours a week on the dot. Fingers crossed the improved pay offer will improve things.
• Working for this Government can be challenging depending on your political views. As Civil Servants we implement the Government's policies regardless of our own views, and that's a really important thing. But some of the more extreme policies of this Government do test the limits of that.
• Morale isn't great at the moment, but I think a big part of that is the years of no pay rise.

I get itchy feet from time to time and think about leaving, but the work is so interesting and the flexibility so good that nothing else really appeals. I love public law - I work on really cutting edge issues of human rights, equalities and public law. When I was a law student I had grandiose plans to be a "human rights lawyer". And by working at GLD I am just that, even though I'm not representing the little guy against the state (which is what I imagined at law school).

Hope that helps.

Thank you so much @Thewayweare - really helpful post - the pros sound really appealing and the cons mostly surmountable!

What does the career structure look like at more senior levels? How do the grades work - what is the G6 role? And at more senior levels do you lose the flexibility and work life balance?

Ok so that is another potential downside.

There is a pretty flat hierarchy which in some ways is a good thing but it does make it hard to progress beyond G6.

Most people join as a G7 unless there's a specific G6 campaign. A lot of people with years of experience in PP join as G7s.

At G7 level within a short time you can expect to carry a largish caseload of interesting stuff. As I said in my original post, even relatively new lawyers get a fair amount of responsibility.

To get promoted to G6 you have to go through a promotion round (about once a year) which to be honest is a bit of a palaver - full application form and interview.

At G6 you do all of the above, potentially get the more high profile work and usually line manage a small team.

Between G6 and G7 I wouldn't say there was a big difference in hours worked.

The next level up (G5) is a bigger jump in terms of responsibility but the pay increase is negligible, particularly as the new pay deal doesn't cover G5s. G5s typically manage a largish team (10-30 lawyers) and are part of the senior leadership team. There may be more pressure to work longer hours but the overall ethos of work life balance remains.

There aren't that many G5 jobs and the expectations of what you need to do to get promoted are really quite demanding so a lot of people stay at G6 either by choice or because they can't get through the promotion process.

Have been wondering how this works with the freelance lecturing (assume this is with one of the two main 'professional' law schools). Are you essentially covering absences? Is there a sign up portal each week or do they just drop you a line when they need teaching assistance in your area and you say yay or nay?

They give you the option to cover a fixed number of classes as they have so many different groups doing various courses at the same time. So you will have your regular core groups several times per week and then you receive daily emails about other classes that need urgent cover that week. All the materials are provided to you so you don't have to prepare any of your own material. It's up to you how much you want to take on, but if you wang to, you can end up teaching 3 or sometimes even 4 classes in a day at £150 per class.

want to*

Thanks - the adverts are a bit opaque, so useful to have a real life view.

And sorry to highjack the thread a bit! Clicked through as I have also been contemplating leaving private practice for a while, and swinging between either civil service route or some combo of freelance legal writing / editorial (I do some of this already and could do more) plus teaching.

Lack of financial security makes me twitchy, but I think it's potentially workable! Need to get through remortgage at the end of the year and childcare costs will start to lessen soon too. Then will be looking to reassess...

Thanks @XelaM and @Peeeas - interested to hear this too!

Hi @GLDadvice and @Thewayweare this is really helpful. I am in the exact same position as you @GLDadvice . @Thewayweare - what is your typical working day? Is it 9-5 pm? wondering if I can cut childcare costs to help the pay cut. Thanks!

Bumping this thread as I'm another lawyer in private practice considering moving to the GLD. I'm 6PQE and work in the regions. It would still mean a significant salary cut, although one that I could potentially make work with some changes to childcare and one which might be a decent trade off for more interesting work and an actual 37 (or even 45) hour week.

@GLDadvice @Brislaw I'd be really interested to hear if you went for it in the end and how you got on.

Anyone else who works for or with the GLD, I'd also be keen to know what the working hours are really like and how much flexibility there is - are things like compressed hours possible, perhaps to allow for a school pickup or two in the week?

And how much specific public law background do you need to be a serious candidate? My current work is in an advisory area and I do work quite closely with one government agency in particular, but not sure if that helps much. The work sounds fascinating, though.

@89redballoons I didn’t go for it in the end - the pay cut was too big to justify at this point when we’ve still got massive childcare costs. It would only have made sense if we’d also left London to downsize and there were just too many variables to contemplate, plus my current job hasn’t been too intense recently.

Im still really interested in it for the future and would be keen to see the other responses you get here! Good luck!

When looking at drops in salary remember GLD has a defined benefit pension scheme. It’s career average and works on 2.32%. It increases each April usually by September CPI.

£50 k x 2.32% = £1,160 per year or £11,600 after 10 years
£60 k x 2.32% = £1,392 or £13,920 after 10 years
£70k x 2.32% = £1,624 or £16,240 after 10 years

Working hours - definitely not just 9-5 - everyone does work longer than the contracted hours but nowhere near as long as in (some parts) of the private sector. I reckon I normally do around 39-41 hours per week.

It is genuinely flexible. Mostly people are trusted to work in a way that suits them as long as the work gets done so there's a lot of informal, ad hoc flexibility. Plus a lot of formal flexible working arrangements. In my team we have part timers, term time only, job sharers, compressed hours.

People do come in without public law backgrounds but it would be advisable to swot up before applying.

Hope that is helpful.

I work for gld and i really enjoy it. I made the move from private practise in the regions into a grade 6 role. It is a steep learning curve but generally supportive colleague. I love my job! Although currenrly they are bringing in a 60 per cent work i. The office mandate which you would need to factor in. Please feel frew to messafe me directly

Thanks for this thread OP.

Anyone know how the GLD feels about post SAHM returners …?

@minipie they are open to applications from everyone who meets the criteria. They promote people on Mat leave and take older newly qualified etc.

Go for it.

Thanks Sister I just might.

Hi I am considering a move from Private Practice to GLD. I’m a family lawyer and my experience of private practice has been challenging throughout my career. I’m paid well below the salary of the average GLD lawyer (well under £40k) and I’ve experienced bullying cultures and lack of progression throughout my career despite working long hard hours.

One of the main reasons I’m considering a move to the GLD is I’ve read a lot about the flexibility it brings. However, what does concern me is I’ve also read that there is a bullying culture and poor pay. My understanding is the first part of the 16% pay increase for GLD lawyers is coming into effect in April meaning the average GLD lawyer in London will be paid a minimum of £61,200, whilst some may consider that low, that would be £30k more than my current salary and would change my life.

Is the morale just low because of these pay issues or are there wider considerations as to bullying which have made lawyers want to leave the GLD?

The other question I forgot to add to that is I have read there’s now a mandatory 60% office attendance policy. Is this strictly enforced or are there opportunities for flexibility say if there are train strikes etc.

Hi i have found the culture to be generally very supportive. The 60 per cent policy has not cone into force yet (it does on 1 april) the guidance was issued this week. They shy away from usinf the term enforce so i dont know how it would be monitored but i get the impression there is some discretion but it would very mich depend on your manager