Given too much annual leave

[sandberry]

I work for a large employer where the leave year runs April to April.
Last year in June I cut my hours significantly and my annual leave was recalculated. Annual leave is only calculated on an eroster system so clarifying whether it was correct was difficult so I and my then manager who I discussed it with thought it was right. I had no letter regarding change of contract, annual leave entitlement etc.

I have taken most of this annual leave now however a new manager has now decided they have miscalculated and therefore has left me with less than a day’s annual leave for the entire new leave year.

I assume they can do this (or reclaim the pay) but I just want to clarify that this is lawful and reasonable or should I be challenging this.
I genuinely had no idea the leave calculation was wrong (leave calculated in hours and the change in the year plus leave carried over etc makes it difficult to keep track of and the error was theirs as the change of contract is recorded on the same system)

Maybe the leave calculation wasn't wrong.

You'd probably notice if you were suddenly getting twice as many weeks off work as normal.

What was the calculation/your fraction/fte leave?

They can't take it out of the next year but possibly can make you pay it back. On a low payment plan of course. Annual leave must be taken though, your company cannot not allow you the right amount next year. Its about sickness and mh I think.

I dropped from 22.5 hours a week to 9 hours a week. I actually worked overtime (bank) during the leave as they wanted me to take it and it was a lot of leave! I queried it at the time so haven’t noticed at all. I mostly do Bank for flexibility hence such low hours.

I also had 64 hours carried over to last year because of sickness related to my child’s death so the calculation was very unclear. I suspect they’re right but could ask them to confirm

I think it might be in my interest to just accept low leave rather than pay it back if those are the two options, that’s exactly why I want to know.

I don't think legally they can take it out of the next Yr but I don't work in hr anymore.

I don't think they can cut your holiday entitlement next year.

I'd be very unhappy with this - if you were told by your organisation how much holiday you had, surely it is their error?

If you tell us what your entitlement was on 22.5 hours for the year then we could work out what it should have dropped to at your new hours so you can compare?

So a full time employee (37.5hrs) is entitled to 33 days plus bank holidays (days are 7.5hrs)
Leave year is 1st April to 31st March
I worked 22.5 hours a week from 1/4-26/6
9.5 hours from 26/6-31/3

I carried over from the previous year 37.8 hours They are saying I had 153.9 hours of leave available and I took 208.5

and that leaves me with 17.8 hrs leave for next year.

So a full time worker is entitled to 307.5 hrs per year? From the end of June you have only been contracted 9.5 hours a week and have took 208.5 hours for the year. I’m surprised your previous manager thought your annual leave (as calculated by e roster?) was correct -even with the carry over hours it just sounds completely wrong when comparing to a full time worker. I think you should speak to your HR dept about what your options are with regards to this.

There was an extra bank hol last year for the jubilee - did you get extra holiday hours to cover that?

Yes but there were 2 extra bank holidays last year so 322.5 hrs for a full time employee

I calculate my pro rata entitlement as 138 hours
plus 37.8 hours carried over = 175.8 hours entitlement

According to their records I have taken last year 5 days at 7.5 hours and 20 days at 9.5 hours at their insistence so 227.5 hrs.
so I think I owe them 51.7 hrs. So less than they think.

Did your calculation include a deduction of bank holiday entitlement? For example , full time worker would get 8 (7.5hr) bank holiday days but on reduced hours would only be entitled to 2 ( 7.5 hr) bank holiday days for example ? Or do you all get the same bank holiday entitlement regardless of hours worked. In the nhs bank holiday entitlement is reduced as per contracted hours.

I know there were two extra bank holidays for the year but I’m wondering if generally speaking you have included bank holiday entitlement as if you were working full time rather than pro rata?

No I’ve included it pro rata in hours. I think I’ve undercalculated it if anything as bank holidays April-June, should be higher at 0.6%

How do you get to 138 hours as that is equivalent to about 43% of full time holiday hours but you only worked about 33% of full time hours over the year.

No you’re right I’ve added the 37.8 twice
back to the drawing board
think this might need a sit down with HR
will contact ACAS and the union in the morning

Might be easiest just to repay. Hope to leave this year anyway.

If you've overworked overtime you'll get the leave for that too.

I suspect that's where the discrepancy's come in

No it’s bank and the leave pay is part of the pay eg £24 an hour plus £2.63 AL pay

Annoyingly I have taken absolutely zero holiday and had to change all my shifts into bank to accommodate all the leave I was told I had to take and now here I am

There is a statutory minimum amount of annual leave you are allowed. It could be 20 days including bank hols (pro rata) but you’d have to check. They can’t have you working all year with no annual leave.

So a full time employee (37.5hrs) is entitled to 33 days plus bank holidays (days are 7.5hrs)
Leave year is 1st April to 31st March
I worked 22.5 hours a week from 1/4-26/6 (25/6?) = 86 days + GF, EM, MD, SBH, JD Bank holidays
9.5 hours from 26/6-31/3 = 279 days + ABH, QF, XD, BD, NYD Bank Holidays.

I carried over from the previous year 37.8 hours They are saying I had 153.9 hours of leave available and I took 208.5

and that leaves me with 17.8 hrs leave for next year.

• 33x7.5= 247.5 hours /365x 86 days = 56.315 /37.5 x 22.5 = 34.989 hours
• 5 BH x 7.5 = 37.5. /37.5 x 22.5 = 22.5 hours
• 33 x 7.5 = 247.5 hours /365 x 279 days = 189.184 /37.5 x 9.5 = 47.926 hours
• 5 BH x 7.5 = 37.5/37.5 x9.5 = 9.5 hours
• Gross leave = 114.92 hours.+ 37.8 hours = 152.72

153.9 seems right to me given people use different methodologies.

Your statutory entitlement is 4 weeks (Reg 13) and 1.6 weeks (Reg 13A) plus occupational leave of 2.6 weeks (2.8) for 2023 due to coronation). Statutory leave can, and normally does include some or all BH. It is usual to take (use up leave) in this order Reg 13, Reg 13A, Occupational.

As a minimum your employer must let you take Reg 13 and Reg 13A leave (5.6 weeks) but this can include all 9 BH in your 2023/24 leave year.

In one post you say you carried over 64 hours and in another 37.8, which is it as that makes a difference.
Write to HR pointing out that:

• you were told in June/July 2022 your leave was 208?
• you took leave in good faith based on this
• Managers encouraged you to take leave and work Bank - this may be unlawful as nothing must be done to prevent you taking leave. Whilst choosing to work for another employer is fine, asking you to take leave but work Bank is not in the spirit of the legislation. Attach emails where you are asked to take leave and work Bank
• in March 2023 told leave entitlement was 153.9 hours and you have taken 227.5 hours (does this include BH if not you need to add on any BH falling on a working day when you didn’t work?)
• For 2023/24 leave year you are entitled to 4 weeks Reg 13 leave = 38 hours + 1.6 weeks Reg 13A leave = 15.2 hours plus 26.6 hours occupational leave. Legally you must be allowed to take 53.2 hours leave.
• You accept that you took (227.5 - 153.9) 73.6 hours leave more than your entitlement. Given that you took the leave at the request of your manager and in good faith you are willing to effectively repay the leave by:
• giving up half of your occupational leave (13.3) for the next 5.5 years
• giving up your occupational leave (26.6 hours) for the next 3 years, less in 3rd year.
• working one hour extra each week for no pay = c47 hours in 2023/24 and 27 weeks the following year.
• a combination of giving up occupational leave and working unpaid hours.