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Original poster

Unreasonable adjustments

26 replies

sandycloud · 17/10/2022 17:59

My sister has a language disorder. (DLD). She went to special school. She work in admin for nhs and her manager is saying that she has to answer the phone. She's part of a team and this is only a small part of the role dealing with any enquiries. I think most are by email now. She really struggles on the phone but HR are saying that it is not a reasonable adjustment for her not to answer the phone. I feel this is discrimination against her disability? Can we say this to them?

OP posts:
ithoughtisawapuddycat · 17/10/2022 18:02

Was it part of the job when she took the role or does it say it in her job description?

LIZS · 17/10/2022 18:02

If she only has to take a message if no-one ejse is available, is that doable for her? Not sure it can be reasonable for her not to do so. Are they fully aware of her issues?

Original poster
sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:04

The person who interviewed her said they could work round it but they have moved departments and has a new manager who isn't very sympathetic. I have asked her to find her job description.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 17/10/2022 18:05

She needs to ask for a referral to occupational health.

TheSausageKingofChicago · 17/10/2022 18:06

I think a referral to occupational health would be a sensible next step. They may be able to advise.

Original poster
sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:10

Occupational health have assessed her and wrote a great report but this was when the previous manager wasn't expecting her to answer the phone. Do they have to follow OH or is it just advice. It's very frustrating when they say on their website how the welcome disabilities.

OP posts:
AndSoFinally · 17/10/2022 18:17

Reasonable adjustments must place the person into the position of being able to do the job that non disabled employees do, not remove parts of the job.

A reasonable adjustment might be to ask for one of those telephone machines that speaks whatever you type if she has difficulty with verbalising?

Original poster
sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:19

Thank you. That really helps. We are looking into equipment too.

OP posts:
JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue · 17/10/2022 18:20

I would suggest that she speaks to her HR department about the formal process for asking for reasonable adjustments. Notwithstanding what a previous poster said about adjustments rather than removal, if she is part of a team then changing the allocation of responsibilities within that team could be possible. But she needs to do this formally, and that may involve another OH referral to confirm what parts of her role she can and cannot do without adjustment.

WorrieaboutFIL · 17/10/2022 18:21

Can she contact her union or occupational health? Sounds really unfair.

Original poster
sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:26

I've found an independent speech therapist who has said she can do a workplace assessment. We have also contacted the disability network in the trust but no has yet responded. She isn't a union member. Can I ask to go to meetings with her? I am actually a speech therapist myself but they don't seem to listen to me.

OP posts:
Quveas · 17/10/2022 18:34

AndSoFinally · 17/10/2022 18:17

Reasonable adjustments must place the person into the position of being able to do the job that non disabled employees do, not remove parts of the job.

A reasonable adjustment might be to ask for one of those telephone machines that speaks whatever you type if she has difficulty with verbalising?

That is untrue. A reasonable adjustment may remove aspects of a role that a particular disabled lesson cannot manage to do provided that the employer is still able to conduct their business. So, for example, if there are four people in an office, three might cover the phones whilst the fourth does extra emails. In law, anything might be a reasonable adjustment. The only arbiter, in the final analysis, is an employment tribunal. If agreement cannot be reached with the employer then employees have the right to make a claim and ask the tribunal to determine the matter.

In this case, based purely on what the OP had said, she notified the employer upon taking up the role that she struggled using the telephone, OH appear to have supported that view and suggested suitable adjustments, she had been doing the role and the only change is a new manager who won't allow it - I suspect HR really don't want to test that in a tribunal, beefier the chances are that they'll lose.

Quveas · 17/10/2022 18:34

Because not beefier...damned auto correct

Quveas · 17/10/2022 18:38

sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:26

I've found an independent speech therapist who has said she can do a workplace assessment. We have also contacted the disability network in the trust but no has yet responded. She isn't a union member. Can I ask to go to meetings with her? I am actually a speech therapist myself but they don't seem to listen to me.

In law no, you can't accompany her. But you can ask for it to be a reasonable adjustment. They don't have to agree. But again, they may be unwilling to test that. One this is finished she needs to join a union.

Original poster
sandycloud · 17/10/2022 18:48

Thank you everyone. It's very useful.

OP posts:
JenniferAlisonPhilipaSue · 18/10/2022 21:25

@JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue please stop using my username and choose another one. I am an HR advisor and also a disabled person who trains organisations on disability and I do not want my advice confused with yours when I am using this board. Great song choice though.

Quveas · 18/10/2022 21:29

JenniferAlisonPhilipaSue · 18/10/2022 21:25

@JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue please stop using my username and choose another one. I am an HR advisor and also a disabled person who trains organisations on disability and I do not want my advice confused with yours when I am using this board. Great song choice though.

I thought it wasn't possible to choose a user name already in use? But why not speak to the site admin if there is a problem instead of posting here?

Quveas · 18/10/2022 21:30

PS - just noticed it isn't your user name actually.

Soontobe60 · 18/10/2022 21:33

JenniferAlisonPhilipaSue · 18/10/2022 21:25

@JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue please stop using my username and choose another one. I am an HR advisor and also a disabled person who trains organisations on disability and I do not want my advice confused with yours when I am using this board. Great song choice though.

Oooh this could make a great AIBU
”Another user on MN has an almost identical username as mine. I think she should change it so people don’t confuse us. AIBU?”

JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue · 18/10/2022 22:04

JenniferAlisonPhilipaSue · 18/10/2022 21:25

@JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue please stop using my username and choose another one. I am an HR advisor and also a disabled person who trains organisations on disability and I do not want my advice confused with yours when I am using this board. Great song choice though.

I'm not using your username. I'm using my own. What, you think I'm going round stalking you, just because I appear on the same thread as you? I had no idea there was anybody else with the name. I have no idea which of us used the allmost-identical name first (and I'm definitely not into post-stalking to find out). But if it makes you feel any better, i will consider changing it. Have a nice life, twinnie.

JenniferAllisonPhillipaSue · 18/10/2022 22:04

Soontobe60 · 18/10/2022 21:33

Oooh this could make a great AIBU
”Another user on MN has an almost identical username as mine. I think she should change it so people don’t confuse us. AIBU?”

Show quote history

😂

JenniferAllisonPhillippaSue2 · 19/10/2022 22:09

Can I join in as well?

IamJenniferAlisonPhillippaSue · 19/10/2022 22:12

But I am JenniferAlisonPhillippaSue

JeniferAllisonPhillipaSue · 19/10/2022 23:32

It’s me!

StellaGibson2022 · 20/10/2022 00:34

Quveas · 17/10/2022 18:34

That is untrue. A reasonable adjustment may remove aspects of a role that a particular disabled lesson cannot manage to do provided that the employer is still able to conduct their business. So, for example, if there are four people in an office, three might cover the phones whilst the fourth does extra emails. In law, anything might be a reasonable adjustment. The only arbiter, in the final analysis, is an employment tribunal. If agreement cannot be reached with the employer then employees have the right to make a claim and ask the tribunal to determine the matter.

In this case, based purely on what the OP had said, she notified the employer upon taking up the role that she struggled using the telephone, OH appear to have supported that view and suggested suitable adjustments, she had been doing the role and the only change is a new manager who won't allow it - I suspect HR really don't want to test that in a tribunal, beefier the chances are that they'll lose.

Show quote history

Absolutely this. Your sister will be covered by the Equalities Act so has a sound base to have a robust conversation with the new manager.

also see if her place of work has a Workplace Adjustment Service and Workplace Adjustment Passport.

I suspect new manager isn’t aware of their duties, on behalf of the employer, to consider what is reasonable using OH advice and speaking with your sister.

Good luck