Dh in dilemma about new job offer, we would appreciate a listening ear and a non biased opinion!

[OverworkedAndUnderpaid]

Sorry, this is long & complicated & I have namechanged & I will change a few details as I think my SIL posts/lurks on here from a few things she has said & I really need to get some advice before dh does anything.

At the minute dh is a self employed joiner, we have 3 children. Has been self employed for about 14 years now & he's fed up with it. He doesn't enjoy going to work anymore. About 9 years ago dh's dad decided he needed a job (had been doing odd jobs/farm labouring up til now) & MIL told dh that his dad would go & work for him.. (didn't ask if he had enough work for 2.. just informed him that his dad would start with him on Monday morning)

anyway, after a week or two dh's dad realised if he became SE also then he could more wages from dh... it ended up that they do a job & split the money. Also they employed a labourer (dh pays him, his tax, his national insurance contributions etc...) Which means that out of the same wages each week dh's dad has far more take home pay than dh but at the end of the day I have told him it's his own fault as he never says anything about it.

Dh's dad loves his time off. He takes about 6 weeks holiday a year (not including his Xmas break) He jets off to foreign countries & leaves dh in the lurch if they have a lot of work on.. 1 man & 1 labourer doing the job of 2 men. Anyway, dh got pissed off with it this time last year as his dad booked himself a winter holiday & jetted off whilst dh was snowed under....it resulted in them losing the contract they were working on as the guy had employed 2 men & a labourer... fair enough! But they then were out of work for weeks... dh would ring round looking for work whilst his dad would call dh every day to see if he had got anything yet

So come last Summer dh applied for a job with a well known company. He would be employed.. have paid holidays.. work clothes provided.. company pension etc.. in short, a bit of security & a pension (the main things he/we needs)

he attended all the interviews without his dad knowing as he had been on holidays on 2 of the occasions.

Today they told him he has been offered the job... this is great for us!! But when I called him to say the letter came in, he told me to open it & then said he wasn't sure about the job...

a) less pay per year, about £2000 so not a lot in the grand scheme of things. (but it is paid weekly instead of lurching from pillar to post for months wondering how the mortgage will be paid) As well as paid holidays, sickness payment scheme, and a lot of perks...

b) he reckons his dad will fall out with him as it's dh who looks for work/prices jobs/knows the contacts. (I think it's time his dad stood on his own 2 feet & realised dh needs to do what's best for the whole family, not just his dad, dh does agree but feels bad)

What would you do? Sorry for the length of this.. I wanted to include as much detail as possible.

It sounds like either way he needs to make the break from workign with his dad

either going it alone or taking the job

Gut reaction, I would take it for the moment, suck it and see. He can make up £2k or part thereof in overtime perhaps? If he doesn't like it, he can pack it in after a bit, meanwhile, Dad will have had to stop taking the mick. DH is experienced at running his own business, so can go back to it if he fancies it later. Feel worse for the labourer tbh

I'd want dh to take the regular job tbh. What do you want?

As far as the job goes I think it is a no-brainer. I now have Selp emp DH (only self emp for last 2 years) and the stress is so much more than I thought and whenever I even mention holiday he is all stressed about not working and bringing in money. I would have thought go for it straight away. Also in that sort of business I imagine the worst case would be you go back to being sel emp if it doesnt work out which wouldnt be so difficult if you had to.

But I can see the problem with the PIL. Partly because it will seem like you have been secretive about it. Maybe you will have to come up with a "guess what someone has asked if I would be interested in working at X" and then sit them down and explain how DH wants more settled work/family life etc. But it isnt fair to you both to run your life around the FIL and also suffer financially because of it. Is there any way he can make it easier by keeping on a bit of self emp work for FIL to do for a few months so he cant say he was left in the lurch?

The labourer is a single lad, no ties & dh has already discreetly asked his joiner friend that if his dad pulled the plug would he employ the labourer & he said he would, so that's why I haven't really mentioned him.

Dh feels as if his dad/mum family etc will be angry with him for 'going behind their back' to look for other employment.

Last summer when he applied for the job, we had no money, no savings etc.. were worried about paying the mortgage.. his dad was on a beach in Miami

Anyway now it looks like I am jealous of his holidays, which I'm not, as we have young children we do local holidays & day trips etc..

He has to accept the job by the end of next week & at the minute he has about 3 joinery jobs lined up, enough to last until the summer roughly, so he won't be leaving his dad in the lurch with no work or anything.

Yes, dh can make up the £2000 by working evenings/doing a few part time joinery jobs that's why I am encouraging the employed job... it just means more security, no more accountant bills, bo more tax bills etc.. no more farkin hassle!!

I would take the job.

Just the fact that they split the money from the work they carry out but your dh then has to pay the labourer out of his share is outrageous.

Your FIL has been taking the piss (and the lions share of the income despite his lesser role in the business) for 9 years. Your dh is a mug saint to have put up with this arrangement for that long.

HOWEVER.....

This is family we are talking about so it will need to be handled with the utmost tact and diplomacy.

Your dh could say that he realises that this is an awkward situation so he "will not ask his father to buy out his share of the business, which he has been told is worth £xxx, and he will pass on all business contacts etc free of charge"

BTW how old is your FIL, is pension age looming at all ?

Sorry, crossed posts with a couple of you, yes Waltzingmatilda, he has some jobs lined up that fil can take on.

And I do want him to take the job.. I have seen how stressed he is when he comes home in the evenings... he can go a couple of months without being paid for a job... this weekly pay cheque would be great, not that we're big spenders, we're very frugal, but by the time the mortgage, tv licence, bills, kids' clothes etc.. come out of it, there's not much extra. It just needs to be in the bank on time, at the minute it never is & we are having to go into the overdraft, raid the savings account, use the kids' money to tide us over until his next cheque arrives. Then when he rings the company he has to put up with a snooty arsed secretary telling him it's "not raddy yet"

FUWW, yes, he's about 62 I think.

I told dh to tell them he had applied for it that long ago he thought nothing would come from it & it's a shock to finally hear from them now.

I'm afraid it's not possible to say "Someone offered me a job.." as by the kind of job he will know it's an aptitude test/medical test etc sort of process..

((I am so so proud of my clever dh that he got 97% in the apitude test & passed the medical with flying colours, this time last year he was so overweight he would have failed it.. but that's an aside!))

Bluntly, I don't think Dad has a vote. He seems to be easy come easy go, so leave him the jobs in the pipeline, and let DH get on with the nice new job. Its not a question of "Family" , its a question of sticking up for yourself/wife /kids, your real family. There should be no emotions at all, he is just doing what is best for you lot.

Definitely take the job - his immediate family comes first. His father should be taking care of himself and pulling his weight not freeloading off your DH. I can't believe your DH has to pay for the labourer out of his half.

Would DH be prepared to carry on with the self-employed work if his father took a more equal share of cost of the labourer, made more effort to find work, didn't leave him high and dry everytime he fancies a holiday and generally pulled his weight?

FUWW's post is spot-on I think.
It sounds perfect and a few months down the line you could be kicking yourselves if he doesn't take it.

Just be honest and say to FIL "you were on holiday when the interviews came up and we thought that nothing would come of it anyway, so we didn't mention it"

Good luck - sounds like a great opportunity for your dh. Surely his own father can't begrudge him that?

I don't think so Neicie. He's fed up with it all. And tbh I doubt very much if his dad would want an equal share of the workload. His dad wants to turn up, do a bit, get paid & go home.

wheras dh has to sort all the materials out, price plans, go over plans, help the people with the kitchen/bedroom/roofing plans.. I know he's very good at what he does & comes highly recommended by builders etc he has worked with but it has just become too much for him & he's pissed off with having no security/paid holidays etc.

We have been planning on him having a vasectomy & he has been putting it off as he would need time off work & he wouldn't get paid for it... when I said last week I wonder if there's a sick pay policy he said "I hope so, I can afford to get the snip then!!"

Your dh is paying the labourer out of his half of the profits? His dad is taking the mickey bigtime.

I would say firmly to his parents that whilst they were on holiday, you were worried enough for dh to look at his alternatives. As they were away, you didn't mention it, as nothing came of it.

However, now the opportunity has arisen, you would be mad not to try and secure your future.

Presumably he could still work from time to time with his dad, to make up the £2,000?

Good luck.

He probably needs to open up to his father and mother and let him know how stressful life has been for him and his family in recent years and perhaps lie a little hint that the doctor advised him to opt out of self-employment as it was getting too stressful for him. Point out that it is better for him to be able to leave your father with several months of contracts lined up than to unexpectedly leave him in the lurch one day by going off ill with stress during a period when ther is no work lined up

Lay it on the line that you both lay awake at night worrying about getting from day to day without a financial crisis getting the better of you.

Your dh has many years of his working life/family responsibilities ahead of him and your FIL is only 3 years away from retirement with his child raising expenses behind him.

I would encourage DH to take the job, go together to inlaws and let them know in a calm way that this is what is going to happen.
It is the future that you have to focus on the future for your children and if your FiL is 62 he will probably not still be working in 10 years time and it is something that you have to plan for.
getting Dh working in this firm means that there aren't going to be any more hairey moments financially.
His parents may be cross but they will come round.
Good luck - sounds great news!

Definitely think he should take the job. Apologise to FIL but say, firmly, that dh's health has been suffering and that this job just came up suddenly and at the right moment. Point out that there is enough work to see him right over the summer until he can start to generate more.

If FIL is never involved in business generation it may not just that he is lazy but that he doesn't enjoy this side of being SE - and then he will have to make the decision as to whether he carries on or not. But he will have to stand on his own two feet and not rely on your dh to butter his bread for him.

Thanks all.

I am going to show this thread to dh when he comes home. I can see that he would be mad to turn down the job, but my dh is so odd shy that he hates offending people. he would rather stick at something he hates rather than upset his dad.

Fwiw I think his mum will think dh is doing the right thing. She knows the worry we are under & i told her recently about a huge tax bill & she was v.concerned. Hopefully she will see, if dh takes the job, that he is doing it for our future.

Good luck with this. Seems like it couldn't happen to a nicer guy. you and dh deserve the peace of mind of a regular 9 to 5. Your fil has had the life of riley for too long.
Have the discussion soon and get it over with. It maybe that fil may be secretly relieved at the prospect of working by himself or using this an excuse to retire (sounds like they have plenty of wonga!)