Unable to use annual leave + one more

[Userxxxxx]

Hi,

I've got another thread but that is on a different topic.

I was informed yesterday there probably is no scope for me taking any holiday before the current holiday year which ends on 31st March which from date of starting I make a loss expected of at least 7 accumulated whole working leave days from using an online calculator, reading the company intranet of course it mentions 5 days ONLY at least can be carried over so which makes 2 days pay I'd not be paid out over come end of March and effectively kiss goodbye to?? Am I best proving that I've tried to take leave and then been declined? (not been in this situation normally I've fought to get the leave granted but appreciate impossible here)

I've also wrote a brief query (not grievance) to the Customer Service Manager who intimated an annual salary increase before I even started at interview (thinking it was 2 or 3% it turned out to be £1,500 which again they no longer want to honour a month later having emailed me about it too but happy to offer new starters next month, there has been a public job advert citing the very new salary for the past 26 days so I wasn't letting it go easy) one of my company friends had called tonight to say they can't poke the stress of the job and have been accepted for reduced working at the 5th week in, so I'm thinking it might well go in my favour in at least being awarded the higher salary - how long should I give them to respond?

I know people say ooh don't fight for rights, but I've nothing now to lose.

Speak to HR- if it's impossible to take your leave due to business need, and impossible to carry it over, they should be giving you additional pay for the days you'll lose.

And v sorry, I'm just too tired to figure out what's going on in your second query. Hopefully someone else be be along shortly.

Legally you are entitled to take four weeks leave each year, this includes the 8 BH. An employer is is breach of the Working Time Regulations if they don’t allow you to take this leave.Any leave above four weeks can be carried over.

Does the 7 days you calculate include the 3 Christmas/New Year BH?

The carry over of the additional leave is not a legal requirement. Lots of places won't let you carry holiday over (days over and above the 20 minimum days).

With your holidays, have you tried to take them throughout the year and every time been told no without given alternative dates?

They legally need to let you take your holidays but they can dictate when you take them. Some companies you can choose to be paid them rather than take the day but that should be your choice. I'm not sure who you would speak to about it though but I'm sure someone will be able to help with that.

Your second query I'm not sure if I get - so at interview they told you that after the first year (I think?) your wage would go up 2-3% but that hasn't happened? We don't know how much £1500 is in relation to your wage.
Was it just the person doing the interview mentioning that that's usually what happens or was there something written in your contract about annual increases?
If it was just mentioned but no guarantees then there's no harm in asking for the increase but they don't need to give you it

Sorry I don't known if I've grasped the details here.
Have you not been able to take any holidays at all? Have you tried to take and had them declined over the course of the year?
How long have you been in the job? I'm assuming around a year? If you've tried to take leave and been declined over the year then check company policy and then take it up with hr to see what your options are.
Re the pay increase, how does the £1500 relate to your salary? Unless it's on writing then you don't have much to work with, ask for it and if you need to make a case then look for things like industry standard wages and alignment with colleagues in the same role. It's not guaranteed and if you're unhappy you can look for a new job.

@Fungirls

Legally you are entitled to take four weeks leave each year, this includes the 8 BH. An employer is is breach of the Working Time Regulations if they don’t allow you to take this leave.Any leave above four weeks can be carried over.

Does the 7 days you calculate include the 3 Christmas/New Year BH?

Wrong. It’s 5.6 weeks a year (minimum) including bank holidays.

@WouldIBeATwat
Regulation 13 gives 4 weeks leave that must be taken in the year. This comes from the EU regulations.

Regulation 13A gives an additional requirement of 1.6 weeks which is a UK addition and there is flexibility for this to be carried over.

As the OP said they couldn’t take any leave the breach is Regulation 13.

@Fungirls, 4 weeks is the annual leave amount, the 1.6 weeks is the bank holidays - 5.6 weeks total including bank holidays as a minimum under UK employment Law, as set by HMRC.

OP, when did you start? how many holidays a year are in your contract? Were you paid for Xmas day, Boxing day and NYD?

[quote QforCucumber]@Fungirls, 4 weeks is the annual leave amount, the 1.6 weeks is the bank holidays - 5.6 weeks total including bank holidays as a minimum under UK employment Law, as set by HMRC.

OP, when did you start? how many holidays a year are in your contract? Were you paid for Xmas day, Boxing day and NYD?[/quote]
Please read the legislation, no mention is made to Bank Holiday it just grants 1.6 weeks leave (see extract below). Typically some BH are Regulation 13 leave and the others Regulation 13A.

[F1Entitlement to additional annual leave

13A.—(1) Subject to regulation 26A and paragraphs (3) and (5), a worker is entitled in each leave year to a period of additional leave determined in accordance with paragraph (2).

(2) The period of additional leave to which a worker is entitled under paragraph (1) is—

(a)in any leave year beginning on or after 1st October 2007 but before 1st April 2008, 0.8 weeks;

(b)in any leave year beginning before 1st October 2007, a proportion of 0.8 weeks equivalent to the proportion of the year beginning on 1st October 2007 which would have elapsed at the end of that leave year;

(c)in any leave year beginning on 1st April 2008, 0.8 weeks;

(d)in any leave year beginning after 1st April 2008 but before 1st April 2009, 0.8 weeks and a proportion of another 0.8 weeks equivalent to the proportion of the year beginning on 1st April 2009 which would have elapsed at the end of that leave year;

(e)in any leave year beginning on or after 1st April 2009, 1.6 weeks.

(3) The aggregate entitlement provided for in paragraph (2) and regulation 13(1) is subject to a maximum of 28 days.

(4) A worker’s leave year begins for the purposes of this regulation on the same date as the worker’s leave year begins for the purposes of regulation 13.

Thanks all. Sadly I'm just past a month of service so aware I've very limited rights, as much as the job seems comfy, I am begining to wonder if the TL is being funny because of the issues that have now cropped up.

Basically I work for a business where I'll work 7 of the 9 bank holidays this coming year anyhow. When I attended my 2nd team meeting of the year it became apparently there is no time available to be booked before current year ends on 31st March and I'd worked out from time of starting to this date there is 7 working days that I'll have built up of which the company policy via their intranet allows only 5 days carried forward to new hol year, so which I've read 2 days they can refuse to pay? Admittedly it makes no sense someone from another team with same length of service can just chop their hours hunky dory when the company could be telling some of us no holiday you can take.

The situation of the salary was I attended an interview, heard the salary was £18,600 but was assured this would go up on joining due to annual salary talks in the month of joining (there is no union) and I just remember smiling to myself when it got said, thinking it won't be a lot! (I was shocked to learn what it did go up to)
On starting in my 1st or 2nd week, there was a department round robin email that the salary (compared with other roles of a similar nature) was going to to £20,010 and looking over the pdf attachment at that point it didn't disqualify me, only exception noted in that being if you were an Employee on disciplinary, 1st team meeting, again lead to believe all good, it took again at that 2nd team meeting to learn actually the company aren't now allowing me the pay rise due to now not having 6 months service under my belt - with the salary increase came higher targets and responsibilities which I still have to adhere to, which is why I'm approaching the department manager informally. (but yet to hear)

It's especially hard as they have a new job advert for the latest batch of trainees starting in March who will apply to a job advert for the 20k salary if that makes sense. Again looking over the ad, there are no restrictions and they blatantly list the new salary.

I know I shouldn't be bothered what the other person makes but everything I've heard so far it just making me distrust anything the company now say's.

You have lost me, how have you built up 7 days of annual leave when you have only been there a month?

Basically I work for a business where I'll work 7 of the 9 bank holidays this coming year thats not an issue though, as long as they're accounted for in your annual leave allowance to use at other times in the year.

Sadly I'm just past a month of service on a stat minimum then , if you started the 4th January, you'll accrue just under 7 days leave by the end of March, how have you had so many declined in only a month of working? Company policies allow carry over of 1 week usually, however if you have not had the opportunity to take the leave then you can argue this, have you actually asked HR the procedure when you are unable to take the leave days?

Did the round robin email/PDF document advise that the raise would be for employees who have successfully completed a probation period? That's usually the case. Does the advert state OTE of the increase? rather than a basic salary of it?

@Aprilx

You have lost me, how have you built up 7 days of annual leave when you have only been there a month?

Working out the from actual starting date to the 31st March??

I think the online calculator said 52.5 hours in holiday time

7.5 days works out as it shall be 7 days amounting to come the 31st March.

Did the round robin email/PDF document advise that the raise would be for employees who have successfully completed a probation period? That's usually the case. Does the advert state OTE of the increase? rather than a basic salary of it?

It's a basic salary. No the email did not state terms beyond being an Employee on disciplinary. Why did they even mention it in an interview situation is what annoys me, it was sold as incentive to take up the role. Added they they've had 4 weeks to talk to me in private about it. I could have coped with that far better then knowing come 7th of March, a load of new colleagues who appear as higher paid.

The probation is 3 months apparently and as it turned out two members of my team got awarded with just 2 months service so how they remember to apply it at 6 months I guess again I've no belief.

Ah knowing my luck payroll will e'f up the wages and then it'll be a saga of oh dear, we've overpaid.

Rereading all of your posts, you’re doing a lot of guessing and assuming - In one month of working there have you actually asked anyone directly about either the holiday carry over or the wages queries?

Have you actually tried to take holidays and been refused or just been told that there's not much scope for taking holidays before the end of the holiday year?
If you haven't actually requested any holidays, try put some days in. They may accept, if not they may offer alternative dates.
You're entitled to your holidays so if you're only allowed to carry five over they'll have no choice but to give you the two days leave.

Wrt the salary increase, I would think it would maybe be after your probation period?
The job may be advertised as basic salary of that now but it doesn't necessarily mean new starts will be on it right away, they may be told at interview that that's what it will go to once their probation is up if they pass.
Speak to HR or your manager about it, try get their answer in writing so you have it as evidence. You've only been there a month so it does seem strange that you would get more than the salary that was advertised so soon unless it is subject to passing probation which is really common.

Either way, you won't know for sure without actually trying to put in holiday requests and/or talking to someone about it and the raise - formally, in writing rather than just in passing to people who say things may or may not happen

Thanks again, I'm in an employment world where people really don't have verbal conversations. I'm wrong on that leave so completely hold my hands up there! I should have known better on that but I've just done another calculate and it would only be 42.6 hours holiday not 52.5.

I can get about the whole requiring of passing of probation of course but it really does not sit easy when you see the exact job advertised for a upcoming start which would make applicants think and believe they are coming in on such a higher wage. I'm sure they would not be best pleased or accepting of then being hit that in fact their wage is only £18,600.

The only other solution is I request to at least get pension conts started earlier than 3 months which is a possibility and perhaps feel less out of pocket.

HR just bounce anything back to the Manager. I was told by the team leader (aka line manager) about the holiday not being accepted now only earlier this week during a team meet, I'm going to try last week of March which now I've gained access to the holiday tool it indicates there is availability then.

Thanks for listening to me prattle on.