How can I be taken more seriously in work?

[Valdes]

I am late in my late 20s and been in my industry for 7ish years.

I'm really struggling with making myself heard and I've realised that I get dismissed quite frequently. An example, last week I was on a call with 3 senior leaders and 4 of my colleagues at my level. All 5 of us had contributed to a presentation that I had been asked to take the lead on. Approx 5 mins into my presentation, 2 of the leaders started a conversation about how they would handle the issue. I was still in the "setting out the issue" part and I took this as a sign I was going too slowly so jumped to solutions. One of my colleagues suggested something completely left field which was based on incorrect info. When I spoke up to say I thought there had been a mistake, I was spoke over and the outcome was to go away and effectively do the work I'd already done.

As soon as we got off the call, the others at my level agreed with me and one apologised.

I'm so frustrated. I work with a lot of big personalities and have taken examples like the above as an indicator that I still need to prove myself.

But I'm working 60 hour weeks, getting involved with a wide range of projects (some outside of my area to help out) and doing self funded training in my own time to learn more about the areas I don't know a lot about to understand more.

I've put one to one's ins with other people in my wider team and people either cancel them last min or just don't show. I don't know what else I should be doing.

What am I doing wrong? Any tips on improving would be greatly appreciated.

Well, senior leaders can be like that. Sometimes you'll be working with people who take over - this is where a workplace mentor and champion who knows all the personalities involved can help.

You should probably try some assertiveness, facilitation and stakeholder workshop training.

Be prepared to interrupt a train of thought and steer a group back to topic; speak calmly, keep talking even if someone else talks too to make a full statement.

So if it starts going sideways, don't think "ooh I should rush ahead!" Speak into a gap when you can:

"Really sorry to interrupt the flow, because those are great ideas, but I think we might be jumping to solutions too soon as there are a couple of things you need to know first. Can I just steer us back to the research quickly, and then you can see our suggested solutions?"

Or, after you've been told to go and do the work:

"Thanks, I think there's been a bit of confusion though, I've already done that. We perhaps leapt to solutions a bit too soon just now - the research actually suggests XYZ and we think there might be two good solutions..."

Thank you, some really useful phrases here. I think that's what I struggle with, knowing what to say that's diplomatic but holds some kind of authority.

How frustrating,@Valdes In the incident you relate there could be two separate things going on.

One is a question of pacing. I am very sympathetic because I have a hard time with this myself. Seniors especially may feel that if you are still laying things out after 5 mins you are over complicating things. They often prefer an overview of the key points with detail introduced as needed. Not saying this is right, but there it is. Bringing people into the conversation earlier while retaining control may help. The wording from @tackling is good.

It isn’t necessarily easy but when somebody suggests something based on incorrect info I think we as women need to politely correct their assumptions, otherwise we look either incompetent or weak. (Not trivialities, of course). Others may disagree and I certainly don’t always manage it myself. Depending on circumstances I might wait for privacy and I would always try to be very, very constructive

Thank you!

This is it, I knew he was wrong, I tried to say "I think there's been a mistake here" but the outcome was still that we were sent away to do the work I'd already done.

Some stock phrases would be useful I think and definitely looking at some assertiveness training. It's odd as I'm the go to person in my personal life with family and friends but in work, I'm really struggling with getting taken seriously and I really need to work out why. I'm not making mistakes in my advice, I triple check all my ideas before I air them publicly and I always seek feedback on content from a few trusted colleagues before big meetings.

The common denominator is me though, so it's definitely something I'm either doing or neglecting to do

Don’t say “I think there’s been a mistake”, say “There’s been a mistake.”

When you were doing the presentation, was it clear at the start you were going to do 1. Issue, 2. Solutions, 3. Next steps or whatever? I find I get people to listen more if I start by explaining the structure – “I’ll present on this for 15 minutes after which Susan will do 10 minutes on X topic, then we’ll open the floor to a discussion, but I’d appreciate mics muted until the Q&A.”

Really good tip!

I started with a "purpose the session" and an overview of the structure but maybe I should make this clearer.

Thank you!

Do you use screen sharing and slides etc? You can open with a bullet point agenda with speaker names, etc. Really formalise it to make clear you’ll be speaking now, thanks, so pipe down big boss.

I also encourage people (and remind them) to use the Zoom/Teams “raise your hand” icon if they want to ask a question/make a point, rather than having a free-for-all.

It is really hard, though, with people who just don’t listen, and it sounds like your senior leadership don’t use their listening ears. I’m fairly shy and introverted but I just put on a persona for work, especially for presentations, and key to this is don’t wait for them to pause to get your “There’s been a mistake” in: you won’t get a word in edgeways.

You need to wade in the way they did and say, “Excuse me, I need to interrupt here to address this” – even if you can’t get to what you’re addressing for a bit and have to keep saying “Stop, let’s pause that discussion” over and over until they stop yapping. Sometimes I think I need an air-horn

I do screen share and use slides. But I tend to keep them fairly bare, just the essentials. I think I may need to think about what actually is essential...

I definitely do wait for a gap and last week during the example in the OP, even I ended up doubting myself which I'm sure ends up coming across. So frustrating, at myself as much as everything else!

An air horn would be very useful!

Hi, again OP -

Laying out the structure of your presentation, then giving it uninterrupted, is a great idea if you can manage it. It sounded originally like your Big Bosses were too impatient for that. Maybe I misunderstood. I did wonder whether you might have a tendency to include unnecessary detail (as I can do), because I know this is one thing that can make people impatient.

Confidence helps everyone to present better so there is a vicious/virtuous circle. I don’t have personal experience of this and I know it sounds corny, but perhaps it would be worth considering a short course or Toastmasters? Lots of honest but constructive feedback from others with the same struggles. I have heard good things

Good luck

Taking from your example I would agree you need to look at developing your assertiveness and maintaining control of the conversation. When the 2 leaders started to derail I'd have jumped in and said something like 'really valuable thoughts there, I'm just going to jump back to the presentation because I think you'll see how we've considered those issues and I'll be able to take you through what we've found'.

Each time anyone interrupts, find the opportunity to take the control back, do it quickly and remain polite but determined.

' Great contribution Bob, sounds like we're aligned in our thinking, I'll be getting onto that topic in a couple of slides'

'Thanks Steve, the team and I found the same thing which I'll be able to show you later on, as per the agenda'.

'That's a very interesting thought John, we went down that same path but actually found some contraindicating factors which I'll talk about in the next section'

'William, I really appreciate your input, we're actually looking at this from a different angle as you'll see when I go through our findings, but I will make a note as what you've said will be useful to a follow on project..'

Thanks everyone - really appreciate honest views and I'm noting all these tips down

Stock phrases sound like a good way to go, and the assertiveness is 100% something I need to work on. I've mostly been focusing on the "work hard, deliver outcomes and prove yourself" but that doesn't seem to be working.

I am surrounded by big personalities in work and im more introverted but that's never bothered me. Now I'm thinking about it, I don't see many introverted leaders and there's probably a reason for that.

Does anyone consider themselves introverted and manage to come across assertively in work?

I'm wondering whether having a 'working persona' as someone mentioned above would be a good way to go or whether there's another way to do it.

Senior people generally have very limited time, so more than 5 mins of setting out an issue they probably mostly grasped already seems like too long. Do you know or can you ask for examples of recent presentations that went well, so you can see how they did it?

Earlier in my career I certainly got a lot of feedback on this

One thing that helped me earlier on was considering it more of a persona / focusing on success as achieving the goal vs about me as it’s easy to get distracted by head thoughts vs jumping in with the various phrases above as if person X derails then the initiative is in trouble

It has got easier yet interrupting / being heard can be challenging

To progress it’s partly good work, but also whether people see your good work and believe in you - and communication helps here - don’t be the person who everyone dumps stuff on as you’re the quiet solid worker

introversion is where you recharge / get your energy - not necessarily how loud / quiet you are - and it’s ok to change on that front even if your recharging approach stays the same

The other thing is meeting strategy

• if you know you have senior leads who are going to derail can you meet 1-1 before / bring them in earlier
• having your game plan as a team on what good looks like for the meeting / who will help keep it on track

Actually there are some famously successful introverted leaders, although sadly the only ones I can think of are men. Susan Cain has a book about the power of introverts. I’ve read it and found it interesting although the title escapes me at the moment

I usually get positive feedback on presentations thankfully (asked to train others etc), the issue seems to be wider for me, the presentation is just a recent example.

@pitterpatterrain thank you for your comment, a lot of it has really chimed. I tend to work in the background and I think if I'm completely honest, I am more comfortable there. I'm not at a level though where I need to be able to get my points across confidently and be taken seriously - working hard isn't enough.

My meeting strategy could also definitely be refreshed.

Thank you all!

Don't stop talking because someone starts talking over you. It's one of those 'easier said than done' things.

Other useful phrases are ' you've read my mind' ' I'll cover that in a minute' and ' yes I'd thought about that and my solution is to.......'

Could you get an invite to a senior leaders meeting where you can just observe how they interact. I attended a board meeting to present a bit and was admitted early and they were running late so got to observe for a bit and it was eye-opening

Really good suggestion! I knew those on my level and one of the senior leaders well. But no real exposure to the rest of them and the dynamic was definitely differently.

I think I also need to tackle the "being taking seriously" bit with colleagues too - the person who suggested an option based on incorrect info completely blindsided the meeting. He'd contributed to the presentation, we'd done a prep slot just before and yet he still either felt he couldn't share his idea before the meeting with me or didn't feel I was doing a good enough job in the actual session. I've come away frustrated, feeling like I've let the rest of my colleagues down and incredibly annoyed at myself.

All the tips are massively helping though, I'm keen to improve on this as quickly as I can and you are all helping - thank you so much!

having your game plan as a team on what good looks like for the meeting / who will help keep it on track
Oh, yes: my manager is forever calling a pre-meeting then she does what I can only describe as in impression of a giant crab as she tasks us with pincering off the notorious interrupters and side trackers.

With the guy who suggested incorrect info, and with the senior leads taking over: are they all men, and is the work issue all men, and are you a woman? And if so, is it a company-wide culture problem? It might be you don’t need to change much except your work environment.

Be the crab Valdes!

Yes, all men. And yes, I'm younger than everyone else by approx 15 years. But I'm trying really hard to focus on the bits that I can do something about - I find it too depressing to think of it any other way!

Do you have any coaching/mentoring relationships with any of the senior leads? (Not sure how your work dynamic is)

If not - do any of the guys of your role / tenure? Sometimes a gap - where you feel different to them it slows down your ability to connect and get insights into what really matters in the business

And: is this the company you want to be at if all the senior team are male? Just a thought - how is the overall feel towards women - are you going to have a chance as you get more senior or is their idea of leader = a guy

There is one woman on the leadership team and she is my current mentor thankfully. Very male though, and I take the point that I may get to a glass ceiling.

Given that the issues seem to be happening with my peers though too, I'm not sure that can be the issue here.

Thanks again for your thoughts!

The more I think about this, the more worried I'm getting. Has anyone got any recommendations for books to read?

Added Susan Cain to my basket!

I haven't read her books, but I've heard Viv Groskop speak on podcasts about "owning the room" especially in the current age of video calls where problems with meeting culture are amplified - she had some good stuff to say. This one was a good listen

Good luck!

Added to the list, thank you!