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Original poster

Is it best to say nothing?

33 replies

mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 10:05

I am a contractor at a company working directly for someone I really respect and have worked with previously. They recruited a junior person permanently at the same time as me and the idea is that I will get us through the annual busy period in September-December, leave and she will manage everything. By next September she will be fully fledged.

I am not her manager and to be honest I kind of carved out the roles so she would be accountable for her tasks and there would be transparency. From day one I kind of cautious of her, just little things she didn't deliver on.

The dilemma is...

This girl just hasn't grasped the fundamentals of the role, she is really letting clients down by not following through and not achieving what she should be.

Our collective manager is aware the output isn't what it should be and trying to manage it but the new girl is kind of making excuses and pulling the wool over her eyes... because I know the job I can tell she is bluffing but the manager is falling for it.

The new girl is now saying her downfall is that she needs to shadow me to understand advanced stuff... I have tried to help her but she doesn't actually follow any of my advice on getting the basics right, which gets the job done well enough to not hit the radar. I find teaching her frustrating because they only have a set budget for my time so I end up working for free to get my own work done.

Should I tell the manager? I am mindful that she is an expert at excuses and my role is directly related to how fast she gets up to speed and I worry the manager might think that is my agenda....

OP posts:
henrylmosley · 05/11/2021 10:18

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Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 10:36

@henrylmosley

The manager would say that I have to upskill her because she is doing it alone from mid- jan. So if she doesn't get it I look bad.

The issue I have with the junior girl is she has no follow through, you break it down and she just doesn't do her part. The following up with her is exhausting because then you get her part late and wrong. I don't know if it is an effort gap or an ability gap but something isn't clicking but she is not being honest about it.

OP posts:
henrylmosley · 05/11/2021 10:47

So your manager thinks she can do it better? And it will be your fault, because you seem to have "badly" explained, right?

Triffid1 · 05/11/2021 10:51

But you're a contractor? Why on earth do you need to work additional unpaid hours? And why do YOU look bad if she fails - you'll be gone.

I think you absolutely should be discussing this with your manager. Not in a tittle tattle way (and please, don't refer to her as a "girl" in your conversation unless she's 16), but in a professional, "I have serious concerns about whether this person is going to be able to meet the targets once I'm gone and in the meantime, I do not have time to continue to cover for her and meet my own targets" kind of way. If this person is not learning, the manager needs to come up with a new plan to help her get the skills she needs - whether that's paying you for more time, sending this woman on a course, giving her a different job or whatever.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 11:31

@Triffid1

I know I shouldn't do extra hours but I am given the job of making sure one of her clients doesn't fail and that means I have to micro manage her. Which kills my time. Now the client will not leave me out of any Correspondence and chases me by name in mails with her only on cc. So essentially I have gained her role... she won't respond to any mails unless she writes them with me on the phone. Exhausting.

Don't worry I would refer to her as a girl to the manager, I would call her by her name. She is young but actually not that young.

She has told the manager it is because she doesn't understand how her work fits into the bigger picture, l so now I have to have her on teams watching me consolidate all the financials when she can't even manage producing accurate financials for an individual entity. The manger seems to think that is a genuine reason for her issues but it is actually not..... before someone says that detail is outing it actually isn't because I have changed the industry.

OP posts:
Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 11:34

@henrylmosley

Correct our manager thinks I need make sure she understands before I leave.

I have been at great pains to explain to the manager she needs to get to step one, which is correct individual accounts before she can take the can jump to consolidation. She can't manage step one so step two will just confuse her.

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raspberrymuffin · 05/11/2021 11:45

It sounds like she's not going to get it, if she thinks it's ok to just ignore client emails, and there's probably nothing you can do about it. If you want to preserve your reputation you need to think about ways to make it obvious you've done everything you can. Could you do some written documentation, not just on the technical stuff but also basic client care stuff eg 'aim to respond to client emails within x hours' (whatever is normal for your industry)? That way you can't be accused of hoarding information, and she might actually pick things up faster if she's got written instructions to rely on.

I actually grasp things a lot quicker if I understand why I'm doing something so that part might not be excuses.

Triffid1 · 05/11/2021 11:52

I still think you need to formally, and calmly, explain the issue to the manager. And offer a proposed solution. But ultimately, it's not your problem to do significantly more hours etc and if she's not learning and it IS seen as your responsibility then you have to fix it - and you can't fix it by yourself so you need to get help.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 11:52

@raspberrymuffin

I totally get you need context. Lots of people do and I am ok with giving it .....but before you do the job the grade above you need to be reliably delivering on your key deliverables. She can't see the importance of actually delivering on her role. So I end up having to take elements of her day job and she sees absolutely no problem with that set up.

I hate being the person that cc's in the boss but she just isn't stepping up. I kind of hoped the clients would be more vocal but they are pretty polite.

OP posts:
Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 11:55

@Triffid1

I think I do need to be more direct. I guess I am not really asked for my opinion. Just told there are struggles with client x can you step in and resolve. Then client x will not leave me alone and she is totally ok with that.

I have also not been able to get any 1:1 time with the manager without the person in question. She adds her to every single meeting.

OP posts:
girlmom21 · 05/11/2021 11:58

Honestly I'd go to your managers manager if your manager just isn't getting it either.

They've got time to get someone competent in if they're aware now. The alternative is it all falls apart for them in the new year, the project goes to shit and your reputation takes a hit. Nobody wins in that scenario.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 12:57

I think the challenge I have is I keep saying she needs to get the basics and the manager keeps saying she needs to get the whole thing..... what I don't want to say is I don't think she will ever get the whole thing because it sounds so harsh...... and nobody is really asking me. But surely it is inferred from what I have said?

The manger sees herself as the manager and not me (even though the manager is not an expert in this field). It is pretty hierarchical and I need to know my place

OP posts:
girlmom21 · 05/11/2021 13:01

@mumtoallbhoys

I think the challenge I have is I keep saying she needs to get the basics and the manager keeps saying she needs to get the whole thing..... what I don't want to say is I don't think she will ever get the whole thing because it sounds so harsh...... and nobody is really asking me. But surely it is inferred from what I have said?

The manger sees herself as the manager and not me (even though the manager is not an expert in this field). It is pretty hierarchical and I need to know my place

Honestly just say it. If they don't like it, they don't like it, but they can't put it back into you if you've told them how it is.
Triffid1 · 05/11/2021 13:24

If you can't get a meeting, then you should email. Brief, professional, polite. Don't complain about the new woman but rather highlight how the is making your role difficult...

"I am concerned that because mary has not been able to get on top of x, y, z, it's delaying her ability to understand ABC. What this means is that I am spending additional time handling x,y,z on her behalf, and at the rest of the clients, and I don't have time to manage F,G,H. "

Then offer your solution - eg that Mary needs to focus on x,y, z for now or that you need to be paid to do more hours or whatever. Then offer to discuss on a call as needed.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 14:54

@Triffid1

Thanks for that I could probably get 1:1 time if I said it was to discuss person x exclusively.

I guess the other context is I am coming to the end of my contract they know and I know.... I fear they might feel I am only saying she isn't great to get myself extended.

I really do feel she was set up to succeed and I have actually never known such patient clients. In other roles they would have been shouting down the house!

OP posts:
Triffid1 · 05/11/2021 17:28

IT's incredibly difficult. You're in a situation where you are responsible but don't have any power. But I think the trick is to make it clear that while your'e happy to do the work, it may not be possible under the current set up etc.

Good luck!

Glasspen · 05/11/2021 19:26

Dh has just been put in the same situation - he tried to help them, his first approach was "they need more support to get their head around the work". Four weeks later and many frustrating episodes where he has had to work weekends and late nights to fix problems created by them - he just said quite bluntly it's not going to work - they can't do the job, you need to get someone else - I cannot continue to carry their mistakes, I need my life back, not sure what the outcome is going to be - he has offered to do the job while they look for an alternative but he won't continue to work with the underperformer. We'll find out what the manager decides next week, dh would rather walk away - he has plenty of other options and working 80 hour weeks is not one of them.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 19:50

@Glasspen

Out of interest was he asked for his opinions or did he have to escalate something cold?

I have said quite a few times "it is unusual for this issue to be showing up if a checking process has been followed?" Or with her level of experience you would expect to see xyz. All on deaf ears but I think that is pretty clearly pointing out an issue

OP posts:
Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 20:11

@Triffid1

That is it in a nutshell. They only have a very fixed budget for my time and I have to prioritise the f*ck ups over the work I am meant to be delivering.

It wouldn't be so bad if she would pick up my admin so I could get some time back, but she never offers and even if she did im not sure I could trust her. Even scheduling meetings she can't manage without help on things like time zones.

OP posts:
Aprilx · 05/11/2021 20:38

I think you are getting too involved, you are coming across as an employee not a contractor. My husband has been in a similar position to you a few times, he is the consultant / contractor but they permanently hire somebody more junior (and cheaper) that he has to train. He will do so, but he won’t do it in his share time and he only offers feedback if he is asked. As far as he is concerned it is their hiring decision to make. I think you should take a step back.

And stop referring to her as a girl, it is condescending, I am sure you would not say boy if this individual were male.

Aprilx · 05/11/2021 20:39

*spare time

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 05/11/2021 21:01

@Aprilx

I would never refer to as a girl in real life... I would just use her name.

Normally as a contractor I have never ever got involved or given feedback, it has never been part of the remit to be honest. Usually I have worked for bigger companies with a finance team. Other people would call the BS.

In this role I ignored the BS until it massively impacted my day to day work. Like having to reschedule meetings because there is a drama that needs immediate attention ..... or the absolute persistence that she has to shadow me doing specific tasks, so I have schedule, screen share and talk her through it, knowing she doesn't understand the real basics. Usually when you give people that much time, they pick up some of the more basic admin burden... so it is at least you get something out of it too.

OP posts:
Glasspen · 06/11/2021 09:59

[quote mumtoallbhoys]@Glasspen

Out of interest was he asked for his opinions or did he have to escalate something cold?

I have said quite a few times "it is unusual for this issue to be showing up if a checking process has been followed?" Or with her level of experience you would expect to see xyz. All on deaf ears but I think that is pretty clearly pointing out an issue [/quote]
Dh is a consultant- he could never not say anything - when he sees something that would lead to failure in the delivery of a task - he will either plug the gap or make someone else aware - his sense of “doing the right thing” regardless of it being potentially unpopular is one of his guiding principles and it’s what helps him build trust with his clients. He’s very good at delivering difficult news without upsetting people - it’s what clients value in him.

Bluntness100 · 06/11/2021 15:58

Op, if you could get yourself extended would you stay? Is the choice for them to terminate you theirs and not yours? In an ideal world for you, would she leave and you just carry on?

Becayse if the answer to these is yes, or they think they are yes, then you’re In a difficult position, it’s in your interests to make sure she fails.

Original poster
mumtoallbhoys · 07/11/2021 08:53

@Bluntness100

I definitely would not take her exact role, it is 2 grades back from my level. I doubt they would want to pay my rate to do it either. I would love to stay at the organisation in a different role though.

It would more be that they would need to recruit a new person in her role and I would need to stay on until that new person started and got up to speed. So probably a 6 week extension

OP posts: