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Original poster

Need references for job application and don't know who to ask!

29 replies

snowflakesfalling · 16/11/2020 13:20

I was at university for four years and graduated last November. Since graduating I have volunteered at a family member's business and have been unemployed.

It has been a really tough year as a new graduate. I now feel held back from applying to jobs because I need references that cover the last three years. One will be my university tutor. But given that I cannot ask a family member for a reference, I can't provide a reference for this past year.

Should I ask a second lecturer at university to provide a character reference or is that inappropriate? I don't know what to do.

OP posts:
OnlyFoolsnMothers · 16/11/2020 13:21

Anyone external you work with at the business? Could you have a family member provide a personal reference ?

Original poster
snowflakesfalling · 16/11/2020 13:23

@OnlyFoolsnMothers

Anyone external you work with at the business? Could you have a family member provide a personal reference ?
Unfortunately not, it's a very small business. It says we are not allowed to have family members or friends provide references.
OP posts:
Original poster
snowflakesfalling · 16/11/2020 13:30

I feel so down and hopeless about this. This year has been the worst year of my life. Graduating is difficult let alone graduating just before a pandemic hits. I finally had a glimmer of hope that I was starting to get my life together again and now I just feel like it's impossible and this gap in employment will have permanently ruined my life.

OP posts:
majesticallyawkward · 16/11/2020 13:37

Could you approach the potential employer and explain your situation? If the relative just happens to be the business owner they'd be providing a professional rather than personal reference- it's not uncommon to work or volunteer for family businesses.

You could offer to give a second lecturer as well.

IME a potential employer would see you being proactive and problem solving by contacting them. It's not hopeless at all.

I recently had to give references for the last 3 years, was with my last employer for 4 years and asked them not contact my current one (as I haven't been there long and didn't want them knowing) so called the recruiting manager and explained the situation, offered to give the manager and a HR contact from my last job and 2 personal references from people I have previously worked with and have known me during the 3 year period (old colleagues I've stayed friends with) and they were more than happy with that.

Palegreenstars · 16/11/2020 13:38

If you are working for that family member in a professional - even volunteering capacity then that’s fine. They need your reference from then anyway. They just can’t give the reference as a family member but for you as a volunteer in the progressional capacity.

DianaT1969 · 16/11/2020 13:38

Do you have time to volunteer at a charity in the run up to Christmas and explain to them in advance that you are doing it (1. to help) but 2. for a reference?
If there's a charity in your chosen sector, all the better.
Did you have any part-time/holiday jobs while you were studying?

DianaT1969 · 16/11/2020 13:39

I assume there were no work placements in your course?

MissSmiley · 16/11/2020 13:44

I worked in a business with my husband for 20 years before retraining and he gave me a reference as my colleague, we worked together for someone else before we set our business up, it helps that different last names but it was perfectly acceptable

Original poster
snowflakesfalling · 16/11/2020 16:25

No work placements in my course, no.

The employer is the NHS so I think they are pretty strict. This job is for an immediate start so I don't have time to get anything else first. It's a temporary role too.

OP posts:
majesticallyawkward · 16/11/2020 16:33

@snowflakesfalling just use the family member as a professional reference and explain it's professional and they are the business owner. It's not a problem. They mean you can have your mum write a reference saying how wonderful you are with no context but a family member providing a reference as your employer-even for a voluntary role- is a professional reference.

The role I needed references for was also nhs- its not as bad you've built it up to be. Honestly, job searching is stressful enough, just speak up and they'll appreciate it.

majesticallyawkward · 16/11/2020 16:34

*can't have your mum.

One day I'll learn to proof read

Ffsnosexallowed · 16/11/2020 16:35

Just use the family member- they are giving you a reference as employer, not just your mum, dad, uncle, aunt whatever

Spied · 16/11/2020 16:39

Your relative's reference will be fine in professional capacity.

BendingSpoons · 16/11/2020 16:40

Have you been offered the job or are you applying? If you are applying, I would just put your lecturer and a family member from the business. If you have been offered the job, speak to HR and/or the person offering you the job. Our trust want a 3 year history. It is ok to have a gap but you can't omit a reference, so if you have worked somewhere you have to put it down. If you get offered this job, they will find a way round it I'm sure.

Original poster
snowflakesfalling · 16/11/2020 18:08

Thank you all for your replies. I feel a little calmer now. What do I do about a period of unemployment? Surely with COVID they will understand?

@BendingSpoons Just applying at the moment.

OP posts:
ShipOfTheseus · 16/11/2020 18:13

Use your family member. They are your employer. Lots of people apply for jobs after unemployment, or being self-employed, or working for a family business. What would you do if you had been self-employed?

majesticallyawkward · 16/11/2020 20:10

There's usually a space on forms to provide details on periods of unemployment, and they'll probably ask you about it if you're shortlisted for interview.

Badnessinthefolds · 16/11/2020 20:24

Put your role in the family business and use it to demonstrate skills/experience etc. Add 'voluntary position' afterwards so there's no confusion.

You can say 'looking for work' if there's a period that the family business doesn't cover and they ask you not to leave gaps (especially in NHS as they may need a full employment history for safeguarding). Just keep it short and factual. If you did any other volunteer work or self study you can put that alongside looking for work.

I agree with PP, contact HR and explain your most recent position is with a family member and ask if its ok to use as a professional reference or if they'd prefer an older one from your tutor.

I think people are understanding of gaps in employment history in recent months. If your period of unemployment goes back four years then some of it is before the pandemic so consider how to talk about that. I'm not saying it will be a problem, but if you say it's because of Covid you might seem dishonest or as if you're hiding something. You want a simple explanation if it comes up, before moving on to something positive.

"When I first graduated, I took some time to think about the career I wanted. I was looking for work but couldn't find something that suited me, then volunteered at [family business] where I learnt a lot and developed skills in xyz. More recently I've realised that a career in the NHS would suit me because.../ this role is particularly interesting because..."

I'm glad you're feeling calmer, job hunting is really stressful. Flowers

WillSantaBeComingToTown · 16/11/2020 23:53

@Palegreenstars

If you are working for that family member in a professional - even volunteering capacity then that’s fine. They need your reference from then anyway. They just can’t give the reference as a family member but for you as a volunteer in the progressional capacity.
It isn't fine if it is a post that requires a DBS
BendingSpoons · 17/11/2020 07:36

When I have applied for NHS roles, I have put references down. After I have got the job they have come back to me and said they want slightly different references. An example is that I chose to put a referee from placement as I thought it was more relevant than my very temporary, unrelated job, but they wanted the job (presumably to check I hadn't been terrible). I would just put the family member for now and have a chat with them if they offer you the job.

A period of unemployment is fine, especially on graduating. Just explain it, positively if you can e.g. I used the time to...

@WillSantaBeComingToTown can you explain a bit more? I thought references and dbs were very different? Dbs will be checking you haven't commited relevant crimes etc, references are to check yku
you were reasonable at your job. You might pass a dbs but have a rubbish reference.

ShipOfTheseus · 17/11/2020 07:39

DBS is to check you haven’t committed any crimes, surely. I can’t see how your reference is relevant to that. And what do self-employed people do? Can they never get a job in the NHS?

WillSantaBeComingToTown · 17/11/2020 07:51

@ShipOfTheseus

DBS is to check you haven’t committed any crimes, surely. I can’t see how your reference is relevant to that. And what do self-employed people do? Can they never get a job in the NHS?
They have to provide 2 other references that are non family in lieu of a last employer reference.
Palegreenstars · 17/11/2020 07:54

For a DBS you can provide character references if you have periods of unemployment. I’d still be supplying my employment reference though

majesticallyawkward · 17/11/2020 08:37

@WillSantaBeComingToTown completely irrelevant. References have nothing to do with a DBS, don't cause unnecessary stress to the OP.

If you're confused, DBS is a check for a criminal record and a reference provides comments on the applicants job performance.

WillSantaBeComingToTown · 17/11/2020 08:44

[quote majesticallyawkward]@WillSantaBeComingToTown completely irrelevant. References have nothing to do with a DBS, don't cause unnecessary stress to the OP.

If you're confused, DBS is a check for a criminal record and a reference provides comments on the applicants job performance.[/quote]
I didn't say that they did

For posts that require a DBS it is not good safeguarding practice to have a family member as a referee even if they are your employer and so they will ask for another referee (if they have good safeguarding practice)