Smiley face on a job application.

[RunBackwards]

Please, just don't

Probably don't mention twice how good your "banter" is either, it distracts from the fact that actually, your experience could be just what we need.

@VanGoghsDog

She/her organization obviously think it is important, and they are allowed to you know

Not if it’s incorrect. She has inferred that she can determine a candidate’s suitability to present to boards etc based on eye contact. This is discrimination.

If a company thinks that only men can perform their roles then should they be “allowed to”? They were for many years but fortunately more and more companies realised that a penis was not a prerequisite for pretty much every position.

So what does need to change, and be challenged, that a lack of eye contact immediately prevents someone from being able to pitch/present at board level and should preclude them from “front of house” which is exactly what the poster has written.

@VanGoghsDog

Reasonable adjustments include those which allow both the NT and ND to continue working without material on output.

What?

Sorry, missed a couple of works:

Should have read “reasonable adjustments include those which allow both the NT and ND to continue working without a material impact on quality of output “

Typing on a phone so hard to edit.

Except eye contact and communication is a skill. Owning a penis is not.

Not everyone with poor communication is autistic and not everyone who is autistic has poor communication. So it simply doesn't follow.

And she didn't "infer" anything. Firstly because she's actually been very clear and open and secondly because you have used the wrong word.

@BikeRunSki

Please have a sensible email address, you know, based on your name. Not anything like”GiddeeCow@“. Please don’t tell the interviewers to “oh fuck off”.

I once saw a cv from a ''jaylosbodydouble'' I thought it was funny!

I'm not impressed when applicants have joint email addresses with a partner either. Why do people do that?

From the other side of the fence:

When interviewing, don't invite me to interview knowing full well you have already given the role to your son in law.

When interviewing dont look me up and down when i walk in.

When interviewing dont claim you have no records of the interview and dont know who i am when i have multiple professional emails feom your company inviting me to interview at said time date and location.

When interviewing dont have security lead me to your office and have them collect me and pat me down in my summer dress when i havent been anywhere alone the entire time i have been in the building.

When interviewing dont take the piss out of my name and dont tell me repeatedly how dainty i am.

When interviewing dont talk to me like i am 5 years old.

When interviewing dont make me travel to the other side of the country when i specifically tell you where i live, then when i travel and get there you tell me my interview is delayed by 30 minutes as you have to do skype interviews for other candidates who live where i do when i was never offered a Skype interview.

When interviewing dont ask one person out of a room of 20 to step outside and then simply say "we wont be needing you, bye".

No you are missing the point. The fact was that women were considered (and still are by many) not to have the appropriate skills for the job, based on their sex. We now know this is not true.

The poster said she will discount people who don’t make eye contact. So she has made the assumption that lack of eye contact means unable to communicate.

What I am trying to say is that if you go beyond the lack of NT levels of eye-contact, you could actually find an autistic person -like me and many others - that is able to communicate, discuss in groups, present ideas at a top level (when reasonable adjustments are made). As you have acknowledged, not everyone with autism
Has communication problems and not all that do are autistic.

That brings us back to the original point I was challenging - don’t discount someone based on one skill - eye-contact - not being as polished as that of a neurotypical person. You need to go beyond to really understand if the person is right for the role.

As you have acknowledged, not everyone with autism
Has communication problems and not all that do are autistic.

That brings us back to the original point I was challenging - don’t discount someone based on one skill - eye-contact - not being as polished as that of a neurotypical person

You seem quite confused.

You seem quite confused

I disagree, I understand what @Scautish is saying completely. I'm not confused either.

@CulturallyAppropriatedName
There's an organisation, maybe a charity, called Employability. They support people with various disabilities to get employment, and canhelp get work experience, placements etc.they seem to have links with all sorts of well known companies and also train them in supporting disability blind recruitment.. I met them at a graduate recruitment fair

When interviewing across a table, don’t become all aggressive when you don’t understand the question and square up to the interviewer, lunging across the table.

Also, another candidate, when describing how you dealt with conflict with your manager, asking them to “step outside” and threatening them with violence is not going to make me give you the job.

When the interviewer holds out her hand at the end of the interview don't instead rub her pregnant belly

I went to an interview recently where all the candidates were left together in a room & it quickly became apparent that there was an internal applicant who was perfect for the job. I confess to feeling a little peeved that my time had been wasted, it was one of those jobs that don't accept a CV and have a long application form where every spec has to be answered.
So it had taken hours and I had to use precious leave to attend the interview.

They did call me to say I didn't get the job (no surprise!) but that I had impressed them at interview so would I like to be considered for other posts that were coming up in the near future. So fingers crossed 🤞🏻

@Allthedoggos

Please don't get aggressive when you are not asked to do the final stage of the interview because it's been an absolute car crash so far and we didn't want to waste the directors time as you were never in a million years going to get the job. And then don't phone up claiming you'd been discriminated against and would definitely have got the job if only you'd been invited to the last stage!

I think my dh interviewed the same person a few years ago

Preferably don’t cry during the interview

@CulturallyAppropriatedName

Please, interviewers, don't appoint someone who talks the job well over someone who does the job well, especially if you are working in an area which attracts inhibited sorts of people.

Don't rule out anyone who struggles with eye contact.

Do enable applicants to show their skills rather than just talk about them.

Then maybe my son would be able to get a job doing what he excels at (coding).

Imagine if you as an excellent pianist, applying for a job as a classical pianist, in which you would have to play the piano fantastically well, following sheet music, were ruled out of the running because when you arrive at interview they asked you to make up an improvised dance.
That's what it's like as an inhibited, autistic excellent coder being ruled out of coding jobs because you can't speak confidently to new people in an interview situation.

What kind of coding does he do?

@CulturallyAppropriatedName

Please, interviewers, don't appoint someone who talks the job well over someone who does the job well, especially if you are working in an area which attracts inhibited sorts of people.

Don't rule out anyone who struggles with eye contact.

Do enable applicants to show their skills rather than just talk about them.

Then maybe my son would be able to get a job doing what he excels at (coding).

Imagine if you as an excellent pianist, applying for a job as a classical pianist, in which you would have to play the piano fantastically well, following sheet music, were ruled out of the running because when you arrive at interview they asked you to make up an improvised dance.
That's what it's like as an inhibited, autistic excellent coder being ruled out of coding jobs because you can't speak confidently to new people in an interview situation.

Can I suggest exploring R&D type companies, perhaps including start ups and up to medium sized cos? When the vast majority of the teams are there because they live and breathe coding, it means there's a good chance the shortlisting, testing and interviewing will be done by people who really only care about the coding/technical ability (and aside from that, may also be neuro-diverse) . We have technical tests as part of our interviews and if the person is amazing technically, they would have to be actually deliberately offensive in the interview part not to get an offer. I would guess that other similar companies might have the same approach?

@Lougle

"Please make eye contact."

Please get some disability awareness training.

Some roles require a candidate who is able to engage on these social levels. Client facing management roles for example.

Eye contact is not necessary to engage on a social level.

I’m not autistic but I find it very uncomfortable when people (usually those trying to sell me something) insist on making eye contact with me.

However my daughter (who is training to be a performer) has learnt to fake eye contact successfully by focusing on a point just above the eyes in the centre, just below the forehead)

@Aridane

Is it just me feeling a bit sad reading the thread rather than entertained?

No, it makes me feel sad as well. On a few levels. These were apparently the people I was competing against when I was unemployed and yet I still couldn't find a job. I think the power might go to employers' heads a little. They want the youngest, most dynamic creatures they can find and then they mock at their ripped jeans or smiley face emojis. I did none of these things but I committed the crime of being old! That is far worse than taking a call during an interview. I rarely got as far as an interview tbh.

Don't come to the interview wearing a top so revealing we can see your bra. It won't earn you any points with an all female interview panel when you were clearly expecting us to be men!

Do many interviews really happen where the successful candidate is known beforehand?

Yes - organisations with a ‘preferred’ internal candidate but where their process requires them. To interview external candidates.

@interviewers - please don’t waste my time interviewing me for a job that is pre destined to go to the internal candidate. And when. I ask you at the end of the first interview what the next step is, it’s pretty offensive to be told that this was a tick box exercise, the role was always going to an internal candidate and that I was there only because HR says they also have to interview external candidates

Do many interviews really happen where the successful candidate is known beforehand?

Yes, I work in a pretty niche field, with a lot of public/private crossover. Public sector still have to interviewed. I was interviewed for a public sector job I’d been doing as an external secondee for a year. There were about 6 candidates, internal and external.

I’ve just realised I’ve misunderstood this Q Do many interviews really happen where the successful candidate is known beforehand?.

I thought “known” meant “known to the organisation” rather than “predetermined”.

I once got a job because - during the second interview with the area manager - i mentioned that I kept tropical fish.

He then asked asked me questions about them for about 20 minutes, which I was able to answer.

And it was only after i'd got the job, which was a sales role, that it occurred to me that he was glad I could waffle on for 20 minutes with potential customers.

I was no good at sales...I like to sleep at night and this company's attitude to its customers was outrageous.