Sorry, another furlough one...

[DarrellRiversTuckBox]

My employer has emailed me to advise that they will no longer be 'topping up' the salaries of furloughed employees from 1st August.

I've been furloughed since it began back in April but have been working (a lot more than) 20% of my hours to top up my salary.

If I continue to work 20% of my hours in August and my employer isn't topping-up the furlough pay, surely this means I'm working for nothing?

Or have I completely got the wrong end of the stick?

The gov.uk site says;

Employers will continue to able to choose to top up employee wages above the 80% total and £2,500 cap for the hours not worked at their own expense if they wish. Employers will have to pay their employees for the hours worked.

Can she do this? She isn't any worse-off if I'm making up the hours, so why?

Are you saying you’ve been working while being furloughed, and did this happen prior to July?

From July that is allowed as you can work some hours and be furloughed the rest.

But before July furlough could not be claimed for anyone doing any work for their employer (other than training). It’s fraud by the employer. Whether they paid the extra 20% or not doesn’t matter, it’s still fraud. Most people don’t want to report their employer for fraud though because it would risk the future of the business they work for, which is why there are probably lots of employers getting away with it.

‘Working for free’ isn’t the issue here. The 80% isn’t the issue here, as I would guess the majority of employers have paid furloughed staff 80% the whole time (and plenty of non-furloughed employers too). The issue is working when furlough is being claimed prior to July/ for all your hours after 1 July.

How can you be furloughed whilst still doing work for that employer? I thought furlough was for those who couldn't do any part of their normal job.

Yes it was like that but from July employers could call you back to work on a part time basis and pay you as normal then you got furlough pay for the rest to make up the hours

Agree with previous posts, before July you cannot be furloughed and do any work for your employer.
From July you can be more flexible and be part time furloughed. For the hours you work, you should earn your normal full pay (unless you have agreed a pay cut but that is separate from furlough).

Were you working while you were supposed to be furloughed? That wasn't allowed until July and even then you would get full pay for the hours you do work

Do you mean you made up the time for another company or were your company still making you wok. you weren’t allowed to do anything for them (unless essential training) before July 1st.

As pp said, you were only able to go back to work part time in July. From July onwards you should have been paid 100% for the hours you worked then 80% for the rest of the time.

In August, you will still be able to work part time and your employer is responsible for paying your NIC and pension contribution.

In sept as August but the furlough will only cover 70%, your employer must pay up to 80%for any hours of worked

In Sept as above with the government paying 60% furlough and your employer topping up to the 80% for any hours not worked.

Hi,

Yes, it's a small business and employer has made us all 'work up the hours' from April until now. Illegally. I'm terrified to speak up as she'll know it's me.

I have a young DC and it doesn't look like the childcare will be up and running again until September. So I'm looking at an 20% pay cut

I'm ashamed to have kept working but I can't afford to confront my boss and lose my job.

I understand it puts you in a difficult position.

You can refuse to work the extra hours - if they fire you then you have a clear case for employment tribunal. Most likely that won’t happen, but no one wants to upset their boss.

So options are:

1. Refuse to work on the basis it’s fraud
2. Say you can’t do the extra work anymore because no childcare over the summer/ or because the 20% pay cut leaves you unable to afford childcare
3. Live with it for the sake of having a job in the future

Thanks @Thneedville

Am i correct in thinking that my employer can still claim 80% of my salary from the government in August?

I'm just trying to clarify, if I stay at home all month and don't set foot in work due to childcare (or lack thereof) I'd get 80% of my wages; if I do go to work for 20% of the month, again I'd get 80% of my wages based on the email, when in reality she should be paying me for the hours I've 'worked-up'?

I find the whole thing so confusing

Yes she can still claim 80% of your pay in August, but can’t claim employers national insurance or employer pension contributions any more. Then in sept the government pays 70% and October 60%. So the financial support from the government is starting to reduce.

She has to pay you at least 80% (up to £2,500 per month) the whole time you are fully furloughed.

What she SHOULD pay you in August (now that flexi furlough is allowed) is 100% for the hours you work and 80% for the rest.

Annual leave is supposed to be at 100% too, maybe you can take some of that?

Hopefully you will be able to get a new job sometime, because she is not a good employer.