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Redundancy payment not what expected

35 replies

FrenesiGates · 09/10/2019 10:40

Hi all – looking for some advice...
I was given notice in August this year that I would be made redundant in mid-November (due to losing the client I work work for). I have been working for the company for 6 years and was given the option of taking on a new role at my company or taking a redundancy. I was given a "preliminary redundancy compensation schedule". This listed: Statutory Pay (6 weeks salary capped at £525 / week); Pay in Lieu of Notice –if requested (6 weeks salary); and Outstanding annual leave (payment for holiday days I hadn't taken), with a total amount listed. Understandably (I think), I took this amount to be the amount of compensation I would get if I chose the redundancy option.
I had been considering going freelance for some time, and this seemed like a great way to do this as it would make the transition a bit easier. It would also give me the opportunity to spend time with family in Australia (who I don't see often as I live in London) for 5 weeks in Jan/Feb as I would have the buffer of the redundancy payment.
I had two separate consultancy meetings and discussed my options and gave notice I would take the redundancy. Yesterday, I went to sign the final paperwork only to discover that the "Pay in Lieu of Notice" is not actually going to be paid to me. This is about 63% of the payment I was counting on and puts me in a very difficult position as I would have made completely different decisions if I had have known this – e.g. taken one of the other jobs offered to me; seeked out full-time / part-time work instead of going fulltime freelance; not taken holiday days in that period in order to maximise the outstanding annual leave owed to me; not booked flights to spend 5 weeks visiting family...
Now that I understand that the "pay in lieu of notice" is not part of the package they are offering me but a payment that would be made if I were immediately made redundant before working my notice period, I am confused as to why this was included on my compensation schedule to begin with. At no point was I ever going to be made immediately redundant as the contract didn't finish for 4 months. No one in management or HR brought this up during the consultancy period either and I feel as if I have been misled and let down by the entire process. This is the first time I have gone through a redundancy (which my employer knows) and so I am not sure of the process – I assume if I'm handed a piece of paper with a compensation schedule on it that that is what I will be compensated.
I now have 5 weeks until I leave this job and am feeling incredibly stressed out –with the payment I will be getting, once I pay off the flights I have booked, I will have literally nothing left of my redundancy payment (I was relying on having approx. £5k more to fall back on.) The issue is made even more complicated by the fact that I was planning on relying on my current employer for a portion of freelance work (they confirmed during the consultancy period they would like to continue working with me freelance as needed) and so I need to remain on good terms with them.
What should I do?
Thanks

OP posts:
JenniferM1989 · 09/10/2019 19:28

PILON tends to be paid more in circumstances where the actual company/place of work will stop trading, move buildings/areas etc so the employee(s) have to stop working right away but get at least 1 weeks pay if they have been there 2 months - 2 years and 1 weeks pay for every year they have been there if they've been there at least 2 years.

So in your case, you'd get 6 weeks PILON but only if they put you out of work there and then. Instead, they have given you notice that you can work until mid November because the company is still trading and staying in the same place, they just don't require certain staff anymore.

Since they wrote 'if requested' asking for PILON is most likely something you can do. You could have said you wanted to stop working for them right away and got 6 weeks PILON but then you'd not be earning anything between now and mid November. You usually can't get both. You either leave right away and get PILON but forgo earning anything as you won't actually work your notice or you work the notice period, earn your wage but don't get PILON

VanGoghsDog · 09/10/2019 22:01

The op hasn't confirmed yet if notice has even been given.

OllyBJolly · 09/10/2019 22:13

I've also worked in outsourcing for many years and when you lose a client to a competitor it is nearly always a TUPE situation, esp as the op was told there was a role in the new company if they wanted it

We don't know what the OP's role is. She may be an account manager in an advertising agency and the company has been acquired/gone bust/taken work elsewhere. None of these would be TUPE situations.

FrenesiGates · 10/10/2019 10:10

@VanGoghsDog they tried to give me the notice this week but they still haven't officially given it to me because of these issues (and even if they had given it to me this week, it wouldn't be before my notice period starts, which I believe it needs to be?!) yes –I do have six years service and I'm under 41.

It's not a TUPE situation –sorry if I wasn't clear earlier. The client no longer needs the service provided by my company, so they are not going to a competitor, they are just not renewing their contract. The positions I was offered were looking after other clients at the company I currently work at (and these positions have now been filled).

I might look into speaking with a lawyer – because I do think there has been a failure of duty of care by HR (it's a long story, but there have been a number of other failures by HR in previous cases and also during this redundancy process) –but I do really need to continue to work with the company when I go freelance in order for that to be a viable option. Management had meetings with our legal team yesterday and I have a meeting tomorrow – I'll let you know what they say.

OP posts:
FrenesiGates · 10/10/2019 10:17

@CloudsCanLookLikeSheep thanks for this – it's good to have perspective from someone in HR. My employer requested from the outset that I stay on (they would have been in a very difficult position if I had have left) so they were never going to ask me to leave immediately; and if I had have handed in notice in August when they let me know about the redundancy then I still would have had to work out my notice –so there really isn't a scenario where PILON would have applied (which is why I'm confused as to why it was listed in the first place as even being an option)
I do believe that in this kind of highly stressful situation it really is up to HR to clearly communicate the process and implications to affected staff during the consultancy period – which they haven't done at all. If it were just myself or two of us that had made the assumption it would be a different case, but the fact that all four of us made the same assumption (plus we had all shown the schedules to our partners, who also made the same assumption) makes me feel as if things were communicated in a very misleading way.

OP posts:
VanGoghsDog · 10/10/2019 10:39

But the HR "duty of care" is not a legal responsibility.

If the letter said "if requested" you should say "I am requesting it", then you will find out what in earth they meant (I mean, it's not like they were going to request it).

They need to give you notice six weeks before the date your employment is due to end. Whenever they give you the notice, you end six weeks from then. I think you should try to aim for three weeks PILON as a compromise.

FrenesiGates · 10/10/2019 11:06

@VanGoghsDog I know it's not a legal responsibility but I do feel as if HR has let us down during the process... on the bright side, I've learnt a huge lesson re: not making assumptions about anything! Hopefully we can reach some kind of a compromise tomorrow that will ease the situation I'm now in..!

OP posts:
CloudsCanLookLikeSheep · 10/10/2019 12:06

Frenesi as a HR person I always clarify with the manager whether PILON will be paid or not, or part paid.. if they are not sure (it may depend on other factors which aren't known at the outset of consultation) then I'd make that clear, or if PILON is definitely not made then put an n/a in the quote for the figure.

Where I work though it's definitely no frills and very commercial so unless there were extenuating circumstances such as a site closing and no where nearby to put someone, they'd be expected to work down to the last hour of the last day of the notice period !.

FrenesiGates · 10/10/2019 12:11

@CloudsCanLookLikeSheep This is exactly what I would have expected from the HR where I am! Unfortunately, there was no communication like this and I didn't ask the right questions (as I read it as being straightforward) As I said earlier, valuable lesson learned...!

Really appreciate everyone who has commented on this thread Smile I'll update on what happens tomorrow fingers crossed

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 10/10/2019 12:14

I'm also not sure op of this, you were clearly aware you needed to work your notice, so would not be getting this money, and nor did you request it, I'm not sure saying well I was stressed so hr should have explained it to me is right, there is an onus on you to read the documents you get carefully and ask for clarification on what you don't understand, and I'm sure you were given ample opportunity to ask questions.

I'm not sure the company is at fault here if I'm honest. It was on them to give a complete breakdown of what could be the final payment, with clauses to show what each was and when it would occur, as they have done. Not understanding it, not reading it properly due to stress doesn't mean they are at fault.

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