Unfairly treated in job application

[Piggywaspushed]

I would change my username for this but don't know how to : and anyway , last time I did this, two posters recognised me!

Precise information is very outing . To edit the narrative a little, I applied for a post (not a promotion and not a job open to only one person). I more than met the requirements for the job and sought support and a reference from the correct people. There were a fair number of applicants (double figures) and I was one of only three people not appointed to this role. Many of the people appointed were plainly less qualified and experienced than me.

It turns out one of my two references wasn't very supportive (I'd like to point out that the other one was glowing!), and that opinions on me had been sought more widely than from my referees. I also don't trust the interviewing to be a transparent process. This bit is vvvvv outing but kind of relevant. One of the shortlisters was a referee for at least two other applicants and another one is married to an (successful!) applicant.

I have received feedback which largely focused on the negative perceptions people have of me (which was of course very upsetting and a view held amongst a coterie rather than everyone I work with < I'd add) rather than my ability to do the job and criticised some aspects of my interview which I cannot really refute but don't believe.

Anyway, I think the whole process was biased and unfair. I am aware of safer recruitment etc.

Do I have any recourse to challenge all this or is it a waste of time?

Why did you have to use that referee out of interest of you knew it wouldn't be glowing?

Them's the rules OK! I didn't actually know , given we had quite a nice chat before I applied.

I'm guessing they wanted the current line manager or something specific, and the tickbox was along the lines of would you employ again/recommend.

It does sound a tricky situation.

I'm in a very different environment but face a similar situation - individuals who work in neighbouring teams do not necessarily hold a high opinion of me, but I don't work directly for or with them, so it's just an impression they have formed. My customers/stakeholders are scattered around the country, and give me glowing reviews when it comes to our annual performance system. The problem is that our senior managers do not easily recognise the names of my customers, and so place far more weight on the opinions of the local few.

I've had to learn that I won't progress unless I move out of my local area because of this. Unfortunately I cannot move geographically for personal reasons, and so am stuck.

OP, you have my sympathies but I have no practical advice.

the 'wider enquiries' were actually their (the shortlisters) own opinions.

This sounds systematically flawed. In public sector, it's known as conscious and unconscious bias. We have to do annual training to recognise it and use techniques to ensure our judgements and decisions are not tainted.

I don't think there's any point challenging it, I'd just find a job elsewhere if I were you.

Thanks daisy. I wish I could. I'm in my late 40s now so facing that unconscious bias , too!

Try as they might (and they try very hard!) they can't get rid of me!!

egg,I feel your pain.

Something like that in terms of the box, yes chic. A 'recommend but not that much' box!!

Op - I was going to ask if you were female and approaching/over 50.
I'm not surprised by this at all.
Jobs for the boys and all that.
I have 2 friends a similar age to you, both worked within an academy trust. Both have left after pressure to move on. Both excellent at their job but now replaced by younger models who knew the CEO on a personal basis.

To be fair, that isn't really what has happened or the profile of the people appointed in this situation :but I am sure is why other things have happened to me in the last few years and why I can't get shortlisted for a job elsewhere.

That sounds really rubbish. I wonder if there are 2 things at play. You more than met requirements - youre over qualified. People tend to cast in their own shadow and see people like them as better qualified/more suitable. Id suggest its not because you were "bad" but the others were perceived to be better. It does all sound quite incestuous and cliquey.

It sounds toxic and insular. Can you go work elsewhere?

To say they weren't involved in the final decision is, on the face of it , true, but they had such an opportunity to air their views before my interview that I was told I went into the interview already at a disadvantage.
Who told you this?
It sounds to me like you work as a TA with a temporary contract possibly in a special school and that you applied, along with all the other temp TAs, for a permanent contract. So lots of others got it but not you and two others.
Yes, it does sound like it was a less than robust process, but there's not a great deal that you can do about it now. If you had been successful, would you have complained on behalf of the other unsuccessful applicants? Schools can be a hotbed of whispering and supposition where staff are concerned. You asked a colleague for a reference, but they are hardly likely to say no if you work with them are they? They can only be honest and give the reference they believe in as to do otherwise can also be a problem because presumeably other staff at the school could confirm their reference.
As for applying elsewhere, before you do so, speak to your manager. Ask for an honest appraisal of your work and if they could suggest how you could be more employable. It could be something as simple as reworking your letter of application to sell yourself better.
It's quite rare for age to be a primary factor to not getting a job in school. In fact in our school we don't even ask for dates of birth any more.

Thanks all. It is a toxic situation and has been going on for many years, in that every time I apply for a post within the school, I don't get it. They made their minds up many years ago (I can never trace this back to anything) and I have been doomed. It is indeed cliquey and no one outside the clique has these views of me so it is like when someone is excluded by the in crowd at school!

I wish it was as simple as moving somewhere else. I am not so humiliated that I would take a huge pay cut to do so. Jobs on my pay scale are rare and very competitive and because of the opportunities denied me in my current place I am not the best candidate on paper for other workplaces! Ironically anyone who has been given the role I was after has gained very immediate promotion elsewhere, so they made a mistake if they want rid of me.

I do try to reflect on whether the fault lies with me : but as they give me no opportunity I cannot change their view of me easily and as I have not got a job elsewhere I can't test and see whether other employers would find me equally wanting.

soon , that amuses me : I am definitely not on a temporary contract . I'd be gone by now if I was! Also not a TA. My letter of application has been looked at by many people and deemed excellent and my line manager can't see any issues with applications I have made externally . I have seen their references for external jobs and they are fine. My age is really easy t work out even if I don't put dob because of length of service and qualifications. Many MNers will tell you otherwise about age being a factor in recruitment and gender buts, as I said, that was not an issue for this role. Most people agree that that is an issue when I have applied elsewhere.

The comment about being a t a disadvantage came from the person who interviewed and shortlisted who is my big line manager but not the one who wrote the reference.

You said you weren't expensive, yet you obviously are!

trinity0097
In schools there seems to be 2 contradictory views on expensive.

Teacher A is an experienced teacher who has a middle or low level senior leadership role. Increasingly the UPS and TLR becomes 'too expensive' as school will quite happily carve up the TLR into lots of little projects that can be given to 2nd year teachers who want progression (whilst expecting A to keep the wheels moving) Teacher A will probably end up stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Teacher B has been teaching 5 years and is an associate assistant vice principal leading on a very small area which usually means teaching much less, offering very little and thinking of initiatives that increase work for mainscale staff. Teacher B is on £50,000 and couldn't possibly be too expensive because he occasionally produces a graph and bullshits about impact with all the relevant buzz words.

I am expensive to another school. In my current school they would not have had to have given me any more money. It was a sideways move. Most of the people they have appointed have cost them money.

lola pretty much has it!

I don't think you have much of a compliant- indeed the fact that you are prone to complaining could be one of the reasons they didn't want you for the job.

Charming! Not sure how you can tell that!