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informal grievance approach

18 replies

IREALLYDONTCARE · 04/05/2019 19:21

looking for some advice from HR peeps regarding the handling of my informal complaint to my line manager.

After a horrid appraisal meeting with my line manager, who I will call Sally, in which Sally pretty much ripped me apart - accusing me of lots of things I hadn't done, leaving me sobbing and shaking, I sent Sally and email with her manager (Bob) cc in.

In my email, I complained about the handling of the meeting. I advised I had not been given any indication in advance that something was wrong, that many of the things she accused me of were untrue, and asking for clarification on several things she had mentioned that confused me. I explained that the meeting had led to me having a panic attack and sleepless nights over the weekend (it was a Friday and I sent the email on a Monday)

As I said, Bob was cc in. I sent him a separate email asking if he could read it and if we could meet alone to discuss.

3 days passed, no response. I emailed Bob again asking again for a meeting. No response.

Sally responded on the Friday, denying saying what she did say, not answering some of the questions I had asked, and blaming my "poor performance" on my disability.

Upon reading that email, I had another panic attack at my desk. I went home (this was lunchtime) and emailed Sally to say I was self certifying to concentrate on my mental health. I subsequently got signed off sick by my doctor and I am now in month two.

on the Friday pm, Bob finally emailed me back to say sorry but he couldn't get into his email? He was sending other emails! He also deferred me to Sally's response which upset me as it seemed he either hadn't read her response or agreed with it! I responded simply to advise my doctor had signed me off sick and that due to the nature of my ill health, I wanted all contact from there on to be from either him or HR

3 weeks into my sick leave, Bob got in touch again to offer mediation (which I refused saying that I felt harassed and discriminated by her and that I did not feel it would be beneficial to my mental health - they have known for several years that I suffer from anxiety among other disabilities). He also said he would refer me to Occupational Health and I responded agreeing to this.

week 4 - had my OH meeting. Occ therapist agreed I'm unfit for work "until matters are resolved".

week 5 - start of my second week of sick leave. Bob emails me asking for a 'wellbeing meeting'. Bob includes a discriminatory comment in this email - basically asking me to do something that I physically cannot and he knows this. I respond cautiously, not refusing to meet, but saying it would depend where, when and who with and reminding him that I am signed off sick. I also requested reasonable adjustments if there was such a meeting - pointing out to him that repeated reasonable adjustment requests had not been met and reminding him again of what my disability is.

week 6 - no response as yet from Bob to the above. No one from HR has been in touch at all. I have spoken to ACAS who expressed surprise given that my complaint is about discrimination, that no one from HR has been in touch yet or gotten involved. The ACAS adviser feels it should be handled formally and I'm now wondering if I need to raise a formal grievance due to the time it is taking to resolve matters informally and how the informal complaint is being handled.

So really what I want to know from you HR peeps - is this length of time normal? Is it being handled properly? Should I now go down the formal route? Should it be formal approach? And how do I make a formal grievance anyway - I'm scared of the stress involved and the chances of success but this treatment has been ongoing for years and my manager's behaviour is really the last straw.

OP posts:
daisychain01 · 05/05/2019 05:44

If they are dragging their heels and not taking your concerns seriously, then formalising your grievance in writing is the way forward. Make sure you document in the formal grievance that you have tried to resolve informally (giving dates) but so far there has been no attempt to resolve your concerns so you have had no alternative but to formalise it now.

I also requested reasonable adjustments if there was such a meeting - pointing out to him that repeated reasonable adjustment requests had not been met and reminding him again of what my disability is

I am assuming that, at some stage, you formalised your disability to your employer, with evidence from your GP that your condition or disability is recognised medically as such because it is long term, permanent and you will require support from your employer to reasonably mitigate challenges you face? This is important, because it takes it into the legal employment arena of them having the obligation to support you. if it has never been formalised they could argue they have never been informed and therefore were unable to know what reasonable adjustments you need. Unfortunately, employers who don't take their obligations seriously will obfuscate - anything verbal gives them wriggle room that it "hasn't happened".

IREALLYDONTCARE · 05/05/2019 08:32

I have had 4 OH reports in all the years I've been employed, 3 in the last 2 years (seriously, how many more do they need?) I've had several Access to Work applications with the help of HR so again this tells them what I need (I have equipment but there are non-equipment adjustments that they have failed to make). I've also got lots of email exchanges were I mention my disabilities and ask for help, where I've gotten no response.

OP posts:
EBearhug · 06/05/2019 02:45

Are you in a union? If so, you must contact them before submitting a grievance.

Get a copy of your employer's grievance procedure. Also check the ACAS guidelines, as many employers Base their's on that.

Write down as full a timeline as you can, with dates and times. Basically, what you'very got here, plus thongs like when you informed thEm of your disability.

There are timelines you and they must follow in the grievance process, so make sure you're clear on those, especially as this partly concerns response times before you'very submitted a grievance.

Good luck, hope it gets sorted soon.

blackcat86 · 06/05/2019 03:30

I would contact CAB and have a look at any organisations connected to disability rights. My DM was having an awful time at work and CAB were amazing with everything including supporting her with a tribunal in the end.

daisychain01 · 06/05/2019 05:50

OP, sorry I'm not trying to give you a hard time about this, but you haven't really answered my question.

You've talked about emails and OH reports, but have you actually given them a written declaration from your GP stating you have a condition that is classed as a disability.

It doesn't matter how many OH meetings you have or emails you pass between you and them, the thing that makes the difference is that your GP has stated that you have a disability, You then have a solid basis on which to request reasonable adjustments, because you're saying to them (for example) I am only partially sighted in my left eye, I need to be provided with specialist software to enable to me do my work. I also need to have a seat towards the middle of the room and near the front in team meetings so I can see the flip chart when we're going through our project list..." etc etc

Your employer is currently letting you down, but you need to help yourself by forcing them to support and recognise your challenge. In my place of work, they ask proactively at every Performance Review, whether the person needs RAs. That's because they are a responsible employer that knows their obligations and runs regular checks in case things have changed. But most employers are woefully bad at this stuff (still , even though the Equality Act has been around for nearly 2 decades!) and have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

daisychain01 · 06/05/2019 05:53

If you haven't yet formalised your disability, there is no time like the present, in fact it will give them a big kick up the bum to receive it formally now, as part of your grievance. You can say how disappointed you are that they haven't supported your disability so you've been forced to get it formalised via your GP at personal cost to yourself, because you need this sorted out,

They will respond quicker than you can say Equality Act, because they'll see a Tribunal in the making, and know they have to deal with it.

daisychain01 · 06/05/2019 05:58

Sorry Equality Act has been around nearly 1 decade (2010) still plenty long enough for companies to get their act together!

Isleepinahedgefund · 06/05/2019 08:24

OP said she has had four OH reports, and some RAs have already been made so it’s more likely than not that they are aware of the need to make the other adjustments.

They don’t have to make adjustments though as I understand it, but they do have to formally reject your requests and give reasons why, which then leads into potential grievance etc. You can also raise a grievance about the failure to even address making the required adjustments. I had a wrangle with a manger about this last year. I know how unpleasant and stressful it is.

Isleepinahedgefund · 06/05/2019 08:26

Just to clarify - When I say they don’t have to make them, I mean they’d need to justify why they aren’t reasonable (e.g. small company with five employees and one of them needs a lift put in, might be considered disproportionate to the resources of the organisation), they can’t just decide they won’t buy you different coloured paper because they can’t be bothered for instance.

IREALLYDONTCARE · 06/05/2019 08:59

I don't think they need a GP letter. I have a lot of experience of working with disability organisations (paid and voluntary) as well as family members who are lawyers - a GP letter is not needed if you have had other ways of proving you have a disability.

So over the years I have had:

Doctor's appointment letters
hospital appointment letters (for disability related surgery)
Assistance dog charity visits (I have an AD so physical proof of disability)
Access to Work reports
Occupational Health reports

I have spoken to my union, yes, and they are fcking useless. Telling me to deal with things informally. I have used them before (I have made lots of 'informal' complaints before and the problems keep reoccuring) and found them pretty useless. Feel like I'm paying my subs for fck all really.

I think this is going to be a long drawn out process.

Does anyone have any examples of how to structure a grievance letter, especially a timeline example? I have written out everything and I'm at 23 pages and not finished yet. Clearly I need to cut it down / leave the emotion out of it. I have spoken to ACAS and EHRC and gotten some advice already. No CAB near me unfortunately.

OP posts:
IREALLYDONTCARE · 06/05/2019 09:29

PS they also do a yearly equalities monitoring thing although they only introduced this about 2 years ago so that is up to date.

OP posts:
MagicKeysToAsda · 06/05/2019 10:02

I'm sorry you are having such a frustrating time and not feeling heard. I can see why you wanted to get it all down on paper, but yes I agree you need a huge edit before submitting it. Have a look at the company policy on raising a grievance, to see if they set out timescales etc. If they don't have one, or you feel it's unclear, I would suggest you follow the ACAS model guidelines.

The most important thing to be clear on is what are you looking for as a resolution. What would it look and feel like for you if this situation were sorted and you were able to do your job without any problems?

Personally, I would set that out as an opening paragraph: "I wish to raise a formal grievance because I feel I am prevented from fulfilling my job due to behaviour/events in the workplace. I will set out below the detail of the situation, and my ideas for resolution. I would be very happy to discuss any alternative additional ideas you have."

Then you could have some bullet points of principal concerns. Then a closing paragraph requesting a response (with timescale) or preferred next step such as "I will make every effort to attend a resolution meeting at any time or place I'm physically able to accommodate, and look forward to hearing from you etc etc"

As an appendix to the letter, you could include a timeline of events that specifically relate to the current situation of being unable to attend work due to ill health.

IREALLYDONTCARE · 09/05/2019 10:05

they've sent me yet another stress questionnaire to fill out to 'help' them.

Nothing whatsoever about the causes of my stress. Barely any acknowledgement of the bullying, harassment, victimisation, discrimination, that I've experienced.

It seems very much that the problem is me, when it is not me.

Very upset this morning. not sure what to do now :(

OP posts:
IREALLYDONTCARE · 10/05/2019 09:51

spoke to union rep, got agreement to meet with them re: formal grievance. Shitting myself now but feel I have no choice. Union rep still reluctant to go down that route but acknowledges that I have tried.

OP posts:
daisychain01 · 10/05/2019 20:07

they've sent me yet another stress questionnaire to fill out to 'help' them.
Nothing whatsoever about the causes of my stress

Why don't you use the questionnaire as an opportunity to specify what your sources of stress are, why you have felt stress and what you need them to do to support you.

I know it's grindingly frustrating, but you need to follow their process as much as possible, play the game to win the game. You can then highlight in whatever form your grievance takes, that you told them xyz on 12 May 2019 in their questionnaire and they didn't take any action.

Barely any acknowledgement of the bullying, harassment, victimisation, discrimination, that I've experienced.

I'm afraid you need to put aside any hope or expectation that they will ever acknowledge bullying and harassment during this internal process. If they eventually get dragged kicking and screaming into some mealy-mouthed poultry admission that they could have done things better, or that "lessons have been learned" garbage, then it's s bonus but don't hold your breathe. You need to lose the battle to win the war I'm afraid.

daisychain01 · 10/05/2019 20:12

And just to add to this:

You can then highlight in whatever form your grievance takes, that you told them xyz on 12 May 2019 in their questionnaire and they didn't take any action.

If they do respond positively, and suggest RAs as a solution,nyou would need to give them a reasonable amount of time to implement the solution, and be prepared to give it time to see if their solution resolves your stress, before you move forward with a grievance. Sorry to say this is like a game of poker.

IREALLYDONTCARE · 11/05/2019 06:41

I have 16 years of this nonsense and trying to resolve things informally. I've played the game for 16 years. They've had 5 OH reports in those 16 years, 2 stress questionnaires already over those years etc (sorry I have been going through my own records in the attic)

I wondered, re: going to an ET, is the 3 months minus one day, the date the bullying last happened, or the date that the grievance process ended? Otherwise it doesn't seem very fair as you might end up out of time....surely if a grievance is not upheld, you could date it from then as it could be further discrimination to not recognise that I'm being discriminated against?

OP posts:
daisychain01 · 11/05/2019 07:03

If this has been going on for 16 years, a very long time, then you'd need to crystallise your exact grievance very succinctly as to exactly what you're taking issue with.

If your employer is that bad, I'd say they are never going to change no matter how hard you push them. Your energies are better placed elsewhere that trying to force them into capitulation and recognising wrong doing,

Aim to improve your quality of life in a new company that takes disability seriously. Harmful levels of stress over such an extended period is bound to take its toll on you,

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