To take boss to tribunal?

[Mumtoone18]

Without dragging this post on too long just to give some background info I’ve been at a company for 4 plus years working as senior admin and there is a large chain of offices all within close distance to each other.

I was working in one of these offices when I became pregnant in 2017 and started Mat leave Feb 2018 meaning I was due back Feb 19. I requested flexible working hours prior to coming back which got rejected my my area manager. I asked to reduce from 5 days a week to 2 days a week on the basis that the person covering my mat leave would job share with me and on the days I am in she would cover a nearby office that does not have an admin due to the previous one leaving before Xmas. This made sense in our eyes as neither offices are very busy anymore due to property market and brexit etc so to save them recruiting and paying a full time admin for that office she could do work from one office and go into the other two days a week to file all paper work needed. Funny enough the person covering me is my sister so that is even more helpful to jobshare with someone I have very close contact with.

This was rejected due to the area manager thinking this would have a ‘detrimental impact’ on the other office only having an admin based in the office 2 days a week so she then offered to work there every Saturday to make it 3 days which is all they need with the volume of work.

I appealed this and a manager from another area had given me the benefit of the doubt and said he doesn’t see why it won’t work and offered me a three month trial period so I can prove this won’t have a detrimental impact on the business.

This process took a long time and run into the time I was due back at work so they ended up having to pay me discretionary leave whilst I waited for a decision. The deadline for this kept getting extended by my area manager for various reasons and every time I tried to contact him regarding anything to do with coming back to work he would ignore me.

I got in touch with HR and explained I was already feeling anxious about leaving baby to come back to work without feeling pushed out by this area manager who was not employed until I was on maternity so I never got to build a work relationship with him. HR advised him I felt this way and asked him to meet with me which he didn’t. Our back to work meeting prior to this was very rushed on his behalf and it only took him a few days to write to me rejecting the decision and I didn’t feel his points were valid as no other options were explored such as job share etc.

Due to all of this stress (there is more too it but too much to type) I handed my notice in and exchanged a few emails with this manager in regards to my feelings as to which he pushed to aside again.

2 weeks after I resigned he approached my sister and practically begged her to start doing 2 days a week at this other office leaving the office she is in with 3 day week cover and offered her a pay rise to do so. So all along the offer I had been pleading for was rejected by him because it would have a ‘detrimental impact’ and the minute I leave he offers her to do this! I mean surely now it would have more of an impact as I won’t be there covering the 2 days she isn’t there!

I feel humiliated, disappointed and so very low I loved my job but I felt I was under to much stress and pressure at that moment in time to work under a man like him.

I want to file a formal complaint just for my own peace of mind as I’m feeling very frustrated and also want to go along the lines of discrimation as I am a new working mum whom is breastfeeding.

Just wondered if anyone has had to do this before or been in this position? I have confirmed with my HR that I have every right to do so and I will be calling ACAS tomorrow for further advice.

If anyone has any history on this or any advice I would be grateful if you could share with me!

Sorry meant discrimination!

Just to clarify, you never returned to work but resigned after the discretionary leave (which was paid?) Were you paid for 2 days a week or 5 with the discretionary leave?

They approved your flexible working request, is that right? After you appealed? Then you resigned because you didn’t think you could get on with the manager?

I don’t think you have a claim for discrimination, at least not an obvious one. You resigned, they didn’t dismiss you. You would first have to prove constructive dismissal. Then that such constructive dismissal was for discriminatory reasons. I can’t see how you could possibly do that, sorry.

ChicCrossaint I did not fully return to work I was working keeping in touch days here and there whilst waiting for my back to work meeting. Yes I was paid my full time pay whilst receiving discretionary leave.

zsazsajuju Another area manager that I have never crossed paths with before handled the appeal as he was not involved so it was not biased and he offered me a trial run but I received the letter via email stating my trial started 2 days prior to this. The letter was poorly written and stated that the trial could be stopped by either party at any time and they may not wish to keep me on after this trial. The history between myself and my area manager has been a poor one in the last few months starting off with him interviewing a man who I have received physical and mental abuse from and some of it was threats just weeks before he had an interview. I explained my feelings to my area manager about this in November and he then job offered him the day after I had said all of this and showed proof. Not only did he offer him a job he offered him a job to be my assistant manager so it started from there really then wouldn’t respond to any calls emails etc hence me contacting HR they then asked him several times to meet with me to discuss my feelings and he failed to do so. They also knew I was and still am suffering from anxiety and separation anxiety with the baby and he has just dealt with it all so poorly. I feel I had no choice but to resign as I was in a senior position so a lot of my work would have to be along side this area manager and with the lack of support, communication and respect I felt this would have been to much for me at that moment in time alongside everything else I was and still am dealing with.

I am wanting to formally complain about the fact that this individual had rejected my appeal on certain grounds and has now magically forgotten his reasons and gone ahead with my idea of my sister covering another office whilst I come in 2 days but instead now leaving the office I would have been in short for 2 days. He went from saying it would have a detrimental impact to leave the office short staffed so I can’t come back unless I’m full time to pleading with her to leave it short staffed and offering her a pay rise to do so in a matter of weeks!

I'm not seeing the discrimination?

So they offered to do a trail and instead of accepting that you resigned?

*trial

I don't think you have a case OP - sorry. You did have an offer (the trial) to go back for the 2 days a week that you asked for and didn't take it. You've never worked with this manager.

Yes I resigned but to be fair the email was written up and sent just as I received the email stating I could do a trial but there were a week over the deadline on when I should have heard a decision hence another reason I resigned.

My question was has anyone complained about discrimination as I want to go down the lines of this also as I am a new working mum who is breastfeeding and was rejected flexible working (yes I was offered a trial but can I just stress this was NOT offered by my area manager he rejected it! It was offered by another guy who handled the appeal)

My reason for this is I feel it has all been very personal and there is a lady who has a grown up child and is allowed to do part time hours but he didn’t allow me too is it because I am a new mum with a younger more demanding child who is breastfeeding!?

Employment tribunals are notoriously hard to win even when you have a strong case and you really don't have a case. Give it up and move on.

And the reason I feel is discrimination towards me is because he rejected me on the grounds of a detrimental impact on the two offices but he has gone and done that anyway so why could he have not allowed me to do it as now he is short staffed 2 days a week!

There hasn't been discrimination. You aren't automatically entitled to anything in terms of flexible working when you have a child. The company needs to assess a request based on the business needs.

Wow talk about advice. My post was for those with advice or history on this subject. Doyoumind like I’ve said above I haven’t written the ins and outs of the story so I will decide when it’s time to move on. Perhaps you should move on to another post with some substantial advice for people. Also perhaps take into account that some people may be feeling very low and your pathetic comments may not help

I believe I have every reason to be fully entitled to it if there is another person with the same job title as me in the same company as me in a higher volume office as me that has been recruited as a part timer and I have been rejected part time hours after being an asset to there company for over four years!

You are taking it personally, but it doesn't sound personal from what you've said on here. Possibly due to your anxiety, are you seeing anyone about that?

This is the second recent thread where someone had resigned rather than return from maternity leave because of their boss. The other one got deleted though, the responses were similar to this tbh.

I am talking as someone who started the conciliation process with ACAS and discussed my case with lawyers but didn't pursue it even though there had clearly been fault by my employer. It is very difficult to win. I'm sure an employment lawyer or HR representative will come along and advise you.

Thanks for comments I will be contacting ACAS tomorrow with the advice of my ex employments HR team and get further advice as there is a lot more to this than stated on here.

Op it sounds as though you need to book a consultation with a specialist employment lawyer and fully explain the ins and outs you've referred to here, to establish whether you have a case.

They offered you what you wanted, albeit as a trial, and you then rejected it. For them to go ahead and do it anyway isn't discrimination. You declined, they've gone ahead anyway. I really can't see the discrimination.

Or am I not reading this correctly (which is very possible!)

Sorry- I don't see you having any cause for discrimination. Manager said no. You appealed. Other manager said yes. You thought first manager would hold a grudge and wanted to meet them. They said no, you got stressed and quit. There is no proof or evidence that it would have been a negative relationship- you assumed after they agreed to the new working conditions they would be childish and hold one, and you decided to quit without trying it. I hope you find a job which works for you part time in the future.

Like others have said, your best indicator is through a discussion with an employment law specialist. You mention that there is more to this, so even as a passing judgement people here are unlikely to be able to give you a good indication of how your case may turn out, whether through professional opinion or personal experience.

I understand that this must all feel very frustrating and stressful, and it sounds like it has been an upsetting time. Do focus on your own health and wellbeing, as you mention anxiety, for instance, if you’re not already receiving support for this then do look after yourself.

I realise some comments may seem harsh from your current position where you’re likely feeling quite attacked already by this situation, however I would say that they are grounded in the day to day reality of these types of cases - I see a lot of people who put forward cases believing them to be clear cut discrimination, but these have to pass legal tests, to be well evidenced, and it is much harder to demonstrate that many of us realise until we get down to it. Of course it’s not impossible otherwise no one would ever be successful at tribunal, but it’s not a straightforward process and for each successful case there are many unsuccessful cases, for a whole host of reasons. I think other posters are just wanting to caution that it’s a possibility that even though your return to work wasn’t managed well, it may not legally be a case of discrimination. However, an employment law specialist would be best placed to go through all of the details with you to determine the probability of success in your case.

In the meantime, you could also check out Maternity Action if you haven’t already, they may have some useful information and they also have an advice line.

Hi OP

Just reading through your post and I must say I am struggling.

To confirm, you raised a request for flexible working that was rejected by your area manager.
At appeal they agreed to a trial but you had already resigned at this point due to the relationship with your Line manager? Just to add, without factual evidence, your claim is just your word but given the seriousness nature of it I hope they at least investigated it.

From the info in your post, regarding your flex working, it sounds like either you were not advised of timescales, the procedure and/or the company made a mistake with their paperwork and dates.

What did you write in your resignation?

As the company has not dismissed you and you feel you have been discriminated, did you write this in your resignation, giving evidence of this?

Unfortunately, with the info you have supplied, your case is weak as you haven't followed the company procedure. Ie followed the flexible working policy or raised a grievance regarding your Line manager and previous behaviour.

It sounds like you have acted out of anger/fear, so if you do want to keep your job, I'd suggest calling HR before Acas and asking if you can restart the trial. This, I expect, will be what Acas suggest.

Thanks bedunkalilt I will have a look at that now!

Mrbay - My claim has been proven to HR back in November/December by police reports and evidence on my phone etc but that is just another matter.

My resignation stated that I felt I had no choice but to resign as my decision from the appeal was due on the 22nd Feb I was due back to work 25th they then extended it to the 29th I agreed I still heard nothing. They then emailed me late evening to say they would have a decision with me by 6th March. Still no word that evening so I rang HR who confirmed they could see on the system a decision had been made and couldn’t understand why I hadn’t been made aware. I left it a further two days and without any luck of speaking to my manager I emailed my notice adding that I felt lack of communications support etc hadn’t helped the situation as a whole and that I felt fobbed off and pushed out after trying to prove myself for years and it all going to waste etc. I felt as if he was using this detrimental impact as an excuse as he has other members of staff working part time I sent them in figures etc to show that I really done my research on how to make things work and to my surprise after sending that email and refreshing my email app to ensure it had sent I had just recurved my appeal decision stating I could have the trial period I was pushing for. I waited to see if my manager would respond to my notice and I waited a week till I received a letter confirming receipt of my notice.

I emailed him to say how I felt about the situation and that I had received the appeal decision and that I was confused as I received it via email on the 8th but it said ‘your trial will be starting on the 6th’ he basically responded saying good luck with everything so once again shut me down.

I have followed company procedure from the very beginning HR have been advising me every step of the way I first went to line manager then area then director and nothing was done so went to HR. The flexible working request on my side was handled correctly having the meeting filing out the correct paper work and appealing. I was advised of timescales but they did not seem to like sticking to them!

All the evidence and my feelings and thoughts were in my resignation and in further emails after that as to which I have not got a decent response too.

Do you have legal expenses cover on your home insurance OP? If so they might be able to assist you in receiving some initial advice.

Employment matters are always tricky but that doesn't mean it isn't worth looking into properly to be sure of the best way forward.

Good luck.

One of the main issues is that the OP appears to believe that because other people have a flexible working pattern, she should be allowed one too. That might be the case in some circumstances but in others it's an argument against flexible - that you've already cut the admin hours across the company as a whole to the bare minimum and can't cut more. There are also more costs associated with having two part time employees than one full time one.

OP you really need legal advice about all of this. Tribunals are very expensive and you'd need a rock solid case. Only a lawyer with all of the info in front of them can tell you whether you've got one.