HCP- night shifts and Occupational Health.

[Miljah]

Any Occupational Health experts out there? NHS.

New management team (4th in 6 years...) are imposing sweeping changes to the patient-facing staff's rotas.

These include putting everyone on the night-shift rota, currently covered by one plus an HCA, 1:10, to two HCPs which in my area means 1:7 nights.

It also includes making shifts 12.5 hours long, instead of 8 hours.

This is a job that can have quite a lot of manual-handling.

Many people, especially the PT over-50s have been to OH to plead for an exemption, having in many cases taken the job in the last 10 years because it was PT and no nights.

I gather that 6 people (don't know who) have succeeded.

My question is how have they succeeded? What sort of reasons allow you to carry on doing 9-5 PT but exempt you from say 9-9 day shifts, let alone nights? Surely management will state that if you're not fit enough to do a 12 hour stint, you shouldn't be working at all?

The new team who are imposing this are completely ruthless, so how have these people got exemptions? What sort of reasons might they have?

Anyone?

Disability would be the obvious one, although the individual reasons may not be visible/ evident to others.

Depression, anxiety, back problems, autism, diabetes etc etc etc. Thousands of reasons why. It's not down to a specific diagnosis, it's how that diagnosis impacts on the person.

Maybe medication e.g has to be taken in evening before bed and a mix of shifts or lengthy shifts mean it could not be taken?

Poor sleep patterns- shifts are hard work and it seems somepeople cannot cope with them.

A 12 hour shift is a big shift and someone health maybe means they couldn't sustain hard physical work for that long but could manage a shorter shift.

Just a few ideas but obviously it is down to the OH to make the judgement in each case.

Contracts already in place that state day shifts only, to change the shift patterns and shift hours the employers should have had consultation meetings with the unions, staff, management, hr and occy health. There are also reasons as other people have said, health, responsibilities such as childcare, carers needs. Employers can't just decide that a part time worker who does a 9 to 5 job suddenly has to do 12.5hr night shifts.

They have not long done this in last workplace. They brought in 12 hour shifts ( most of the young Nurse wanted them). Staff had the choice to do 7.5 hour days but no choice over the 12 hour nights unless you had a medical reason not to do them. Looking back it was a factor in me leaving, the 12 hour nights were horrendously busy a lot of the time and I just couldn't cope ( I am 50).

Depression and sleep apnea are two conditions difficult to manage on nights. My depression lifted stopping nights

Yes, a lot of the youngsters like the idea of 12.5-13 hour shifts.

They haven't yet had to organise childcare around them.

In maternity, quite a lot of our staff are not doing night oncalls for health reasons
: high blood pressure
: diabetes
:arthritis
And other long term health conditions that are not severe enough for ill health retirement.
And caring responsibilities where it is is difficult to get support eg disabled child.

The management delude themselves that there is an infinite pool of young fit childless full timers willing to accept the deteriorating pay and conditions. The rota says otherwise.
Get your Union involved. Don't accept any changes that are unreasonable. Don't put your own health at risk. Don't be blackmailed.

One of my colleagues ( lived on her own) argued she couldn't leave her ageing dog for 12 hours overnight. It didn't go down too well.

Thank you, everyone.

I am keen to know what works, to get me out of doing overnight 12.5 hour shifts.

I took this job because it was 9-5, 3 weekdays; but modern NHS management doesn't give a fig about us as individuals, we're just 'plug'n'play' work units. Targets Targets Targets!

I haven't done a night shift in 20 years (though I do a 1:12 on-call from home); but, at 56, am not about to re-start nights.

I do have good reasons- a crushed vertebrae (don't know how! About a year ago), long term low back pain, possible osteoporosis, and trigeminal neuralgia.

I am great for 8 hours, not so brilliant at many more, dead on my feet overnight (the tablets I take for my LBP and trigeminal neuraligia make me fall asleep)- I just can't take them if I'm on call. I don't want to add to my on-going suffering in pain by not taking these meds if I'm about to do a night shift as well. At least, on-call, you get to sleep apart from when you get called in!

Modern NHS bosses Have No Idea, do they?

when the unit I worked on brought them in, people over a certain age ( I think maybe 55 ? ) could opt not to do them and people with medical conditions ( depression etc). One Nurse told management she would do them but would not be held responsible if something went wrong ( she couldn't sleep at all in the day ) and they soon took her off nights. Many years ago one Nurse was unable to do them as she was a lone parent and had no overnight childcare, and she was allowed to do just day shifts.

I am a bit worried that 'they' will say ' Well, if you can't climb Everest, how are you alright to climb Helvellyn?' ...

My response wants to be:

Assume me and a young lad, fit, 26, say, set off to climb a hill at 9am. I match him, step for step for 8 hours. At 8 hours, I know my performance is about to drop off, so I peel off, as he strides upwards for 4 more hours.

I took on the 8 hour climb, knowing I could do it. He's prepared to do the 12 hours because he knows that means he 'only' has to do it 3 days a week.

Is he 'better' than me? Will he be the same at 55? Towards that age, will he be striding with the same commitment and certainty as he was in his mid 20s? What if 'they' decide that, instead of spreading a week's work across three 12.75/13 hour days.... it could be done in two 19 hour days?

Where does that end?

I would ask for a referral to occupational health.

I'm 'safe'- the career path isn't.