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Company Maternity Policy.. (lack of...)

44 replies

nics1stbaby · 02/07/2002 10:55

Can anyone out there advise me as to if there is time deadline when my employer should let me know about the company maternity policy?

I told my employer that I was pregnant when I was just 10 weeks pregnant. I am now 23 weeks. As I am the first pregnancy in this companies 8 year life, I put together a clear proposal for my boss covering everything that I would like (it was very clear, I got advice from Mumsnetters, and research with friends work, etc.). I submitted this about 4 weeks ago... and I haven't heard a bean since...? I even gave them a sample policy from my friends firm about 6 weeks ago.

OP posts:
bossykate · 06/09/2002 10:10

croppy, i agree completely, and imo nic1stbaby's posts should also be deleted.

nics1stbaby · 06/09/2002 10:22

I apologise for causing offense. The comments that were removed from this conversation did not belong to me. I wish I hadn't said a thing now, but everything I said is still here below. I do wish to underline that I have repetedly said this my just my experience here. I fundamentally hate the thought of being labelled a racist. It goes against everything about me. Please just berate me for my comments, don't pin a very nasty label on me.

OP posts:
sis · 06/09/2002 10:42

I had a few problems with my employers before going on maternity leave which caused me a great deal of stress and anxiety as the difficulties were linked to my returning to work. The problems have long since been resolved and we now have a new management team who are more "family friendly" than the management inplace before I went on maternity leave.

It never once occured to me that the problems had anything to do with the race of the individuals causing me the problems and it certainly did not put me off working for a white non-family run organisation in the future!

BTW, as SofiaAmes comments were in response to what she had read on the thread and didn't claim to comment on unread comments, I'm a bit baffled as to why it isn't a good idea to state her views.

WideWebWitch · 06/09/2002 10:47

I've resisted and resisted contributing but here goes!

I saw the deleted comment and maybe I'm thick, but I didn't understand it. I'd rather it wasn't repeated if it was thought offensive but the reference to cars went over my head.

I agree: racism is unacceptable and not to be tolerated. But I think maybe I understand something of what nics1stbaby was trying to say: working for an family run asian company is probably different from working for say, an American (substitute any nationality here) company. Cultures do differ and it can affect how business life is conducted.

Before anyone bites my head off, my ex DH is Indian and our ds is therefore half Indian. I do therefore have some experience of the cultural differences. I agree with sofiaames, it doesn't sound as if there is anything wrong with the way this company does business - they get good deals, they expect good deals and it all makes perfect commercial sense. However, refusing to let an employee know what her maternity pay and terms will be is lacksadaisical and maybe does stem in part from the fact that the employee in question is not part of the family. It may also be down, in part, to cultural attitude. If she were a family member, the boss would maybe say "it's ok, I'll sort you out when I get around to it, don't worry". And he/she would! It's family after all and family are important. At least, this is my experience of the way some Indian families work. There is less formality in certain arrangements (which is fine, sometimes); cousins, aunts, mothers, sisters are collectively (sometimes) responsible for children of various family members; behaviour and attitudes are sometimes different. And some of it is great!

Of course it would be wrong to say that ALL asian families are the same, or that all asian employers are the same, or that all asian family employers are bad. Sweeping generalisations are very often unhelpful IMO. But cultures do differ throughout the world and that's a good thing. I think sometimes as a society we are quick to assume racism when someone is talking about cultural difference. Noticing and disliking a cultural difference isn't racist: making assumptions, negative comments, generalisations based purely on race/skin colour is. Clearly, I don't know what the company in question is like but I think this is a point worth making.

I don't know if I've made myself clear here. I know though, that my ex DH's family would agree that their conduct and culture (in business and elsewhere) is different from mine. That's not necessarily a bad thing but it is different.

nics1stbaby · 06/09/2002 10:56

Wickedwaterwitch, you have hit the nail of the head.

By the way, I speak three languages, and have lived abroad.

Thw worst company I worked for was a city finance house which was extremely male, sexist and just british, which I found so alien as I went to Uni abroad at an international business school. I was the only brit in my class. I have always chosen to work in a multi-cultural environment as it is much healthier for the soul.

I stated earlier that on a personal level I get on with everyone here.

My gripe was the culture shock I experienced due to the most possibly admirable way that this company does business.

p.s. they constantly tell me that I do a good job, and part of my pay is performance based and haven't missed a bonus yet in last two years.

OP posts:
sis · 06/09/2002 11:59

Nics1stbaby, of course you are entitled to draw your own conclusions from your experiences, but on a personal level, as an asian, I was saddened by your comments .

nics1stbaby · 06/09/2002 12:07

Understood Sis. sorry.

OP posts:
debster · 06/09/2002 12:33

I'm afraid my feelings on your post still stand. My particular objection was to the sentence 'Everything here is always so shady when it comes to money. I'm sorry to say this is the very last time I work for a family run asian company ... Penny pinching meanies.' To my mind I do feel you are implying a link between being Asian and being mean and less than above board.

I really wasn't sure whether to comment on your message the first time round. I did wonder whether I was being too sensitive as I know how easy it is to jump on the racism bandwagon. However, being mixed race (half Asian/half European), I genuinely felt offended. I'm not saying you are racist at all but I wanted you to know that innocently made comments like yours can be upsetting.

I do agree, however, that your employers are being unfair with regards to giving you the information you need.

debster · 06/09/2002 12:34

I'm afraid my feelings on your post still stand. My particular objection was to the sentence 'Everything here is always so shady when it comes to money. I'm sorry to say this is the very last time I work for a family run asian company ... Penny pinching meanies.' To my mind I do feel you are implying a link between being Asian and being mean and less than above board.

I really wasn't sure whether to comment on your message the first time round. I did wonder whether I was being too sensitive as I know how easy it is to jump on the racism bandwagon. However, being mixed race (half Asian/half European), I genuinely felt offended. I'm not saying you are racist at all but I wanted you to know that innocently made comments like yours can be upsetting.

I do agree, however, that your employers are being unfair with regards to giving you the information you need.

debster · 06/09/2002 12:36

Sorry - wasn't trying to make the point twice!!

nics1stbaby · 06/09/2002 15:26

Debster,

I know. Those comments sound much worse when read back to me, I do hope that anyone that has read my subsequent postings can see that I am genuinely trying to make ammends. I really didn't mean to sound rascist.

It is truly bad working here, but I better not give up the day job just yet to go and work as diplomat...

OP posts:
bells2 · 03/06/2003 09:27

I work for one of the world's largest banks who unfortunately provides only the statutory minimum as far as maternity pay is concerned. I am 24 weeks and have just been told by Human Resources (following 2 unanswered emails over the past month) that the firm has no written maternity policy available yet following the changes introduced by the government in April. The HR person has asked me if there is anything specific I want to know. I actually want to check on various items such as pension, bonus etc in the event that I don't return to work but would prefer not to say that explicitly at this stage.

Anyway, I feel rather cross about it all as it took a number of unanswered emails and unreturned telephone calls to set up a meeting with HR in the first place to inform them of my pregnancy. Also, while I know my rights in general, I have nothing in writing. More importantly, it seems to show a lack of regard for pregnant employees. Just wondered if it was the norm elsehwere to be privded with a policy at an earlier stage than this?

meanmum · 03/06/2003 09:37

I would like to say it is the norm but unfortunately don't think it is. Good practice within HR should be to publish all policies and procedures so that all employees have easy and constant access to these. Your company, especially being the size they are, should have an intranet or at least a database with the policies on it and this should include the maternity policy.

My advice is to get a copy of the old policy as they will be using that as the basis anyway and then also look at the DTI website. The DTI website will tell you what the statutory minimum the employer is required to provide.

I also suggest you notify your HR departmentabout the lack of support you have received. HR's role is to provide a service to the employees on behalf of the company and they do not appear to be meeting customer requirements which is you. This has happened within our HR department when someone has notified us of poor service and we were all jumping over each other to rectify the problem. I hope this is the same case with your HR department.

It is your HR department's responsibility to provide up to date policies and there should be no reason why you have to wait in receiving this. We have all known these changes have been coming for a very long time and even pretty much what the changes were going to be so there is no excuse for them not to have a written policy which incorporates the new laws.

No matter what you are asking your HR department always ensure you read up about statutory rights and minimum's as you must look out for your own interests. There have been times when policies have not been quite accurate for whatever reason and it has taken an employee to point this out for it to be rectified. This is not ideal but does happen in reality so always be aware of what your rights are as an employee and what the company is expected to do for you as the minimum.

meanmum · 03/06/2003 09:40

Sorry that should be is not the norm as opposed to is the norm. By the way your HR contact sounds like a very lazy and uncaring person. You shouldn't have to do all the work for them which is what they are wanting you to do but as I said make sure you know your own rights.

Personally, I would be letting them know that their service leaves a lot to be desired and what you want to know is exactly what is it you are entitled to, for how long and when it commences and make them do the work they should be doing.

Also make sure they notify you of what the new flexibility laws are which you may wish to consider upon your return. There is no harm in them giving you this information now and it would be sensible of them to do so.

bells2 · 03/06/2003 09:46

Thanks Meanmum!. Unfortunately our Intranet now has nothing on Maternity and they say they can't give me the old policy as it's no longer valid. You are right though about being aware of the statutory rights - last time around they disputed that they were required to provide a place other than the ladies toilet to express. Anyway, will certainly lodge a complaint along the lines you suggest.

Aside from anything else I find it odd that they don't issue guidelines as to when I need to notify them by in terms of starting maternity leave.

Gini · 03/06/2003 10:47

I know its a pain to have to look in to it yourself but this website is very useful and will help you: www.tiger.gov.uk/ - it will mean however that you are doing the HR depts job for them, and they should be suitably embarressed by that as there are hundreds of places that will give you a specimen policy for free if you only want to follow that statuory minimum as a company, all they would have to do is tailor it with your company logo etc....Lazy gits!

Batters · 03/06/2003 21:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

meanmum · 03/06/2003 21:43

Yes, definitely keep going until you get exactly what you want. Just because of the new laws doesn't mean the old policy is completely irrelevant. Not everything changed.

You are also right they should have date requirements for when you have to notify them and everything else like that.

They are lazy gits keep on their case.

bossykate · 04/06/2003 13:35

good luck, bells, this is outrageous. aren't they worried about being sued? roll on july.

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