Can't ever take my holiday, unless it is completely "convenient"

[user1483875094]

Hi lovely mums netters. I wonder if you could all give me some advice as to how to go about a problem I face. I work in a very small company, and have a pivotal role, and am entirely responsible for some very long-winded "daily" tasks which make the business tick over. I don't want to say too much - but if I "manage" to take time off, I am always stressed anyway, as I know I will come back to an absolute MOUNTAIN of work, as nobody in the company ever picks up any my work, and in fact nobody will learn to, (I have tried!) It is not brain surgery, so I am not boasting! So I come back from a few days off, to then have to come in early, and stay late, just to catch up and correct all the errors. The biggest problem, however, is that whenever I ask (properly and in due time) to take some of my annual leave, my manager always has to consult her diary, to see if it is convenient or not, and more often than not, it is "in-convenient" as we are always sooo busy, and sooo short of staff! For three years in a row now, I have lost out on large chunks of my holiday entitlement, (part of my contract) simply because it was "inconvenient". The longest I am ever allowed to take in any one go is 4 days, which is SO unfair, when other staff go off for their foreign holidays for 10 days. I have tried to make sense of it on google, acas.... etc.. but it seems to be an extremely grey area. I am not allowed pay in lieu of refused holiday, and I cannot carry it over to the next year. (God forbid, I should dare to ask for a whole week off!) Does anyone have any pointers or reference sites they might know of which make it plainer? TGF mumsnetters, as I know someone out there will point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance.

Are these restrictions in your employment contract?

I think you need to book a 2 week holiday 😁

Not hard to make sense of. If you work 5 days a week you are legally entitled to 5.6 weeks per year of annual leave. This can include bank holidays.

Your company may decide when you can take your leave, but they cannot stop you from taking this minimal entitlement.

IMO, if they turn down a request for leave then they should say when it is possible to take the leave instead. I'll see if I can find anything that actually says that as a guideline though!

I'll see if I can find anything that actually says that as a guideline though!

That’s good practice but not an official guideline.

This is awful. Have you got any evidence in terms of emails or texts

Page 9 says that if you are denied the chance to take your statutory holidays, firstly talk it through with your employer - secondly, use the grievance procedure - thirdly, tribunal ....

www.acas.org.uk/media/pdf/r/c/Acas-guide-Holidays-and-holiday-pay.pdf

For three years in a row now, I have lost out on large chunks of my holiday entitlement, (part of my contract) simply because it was "inconvenient"

Are you a full time worker or part time? Your entitlement depends on your hours of work (either full or pro rata) and the type of employment contract you have.

www.gov.uk/holiday-entitlement-rights

You said you have lost holiday for three years - just to clarify, do you mean they have denied you the ability to take holiday at the time you have requested, and then denied you permission to take them at an alternative time during the year and also fail to allow you to carry them over to the next year, or pay you instead. If so they are breaking the law.

best if you read above link which outlines your statutory holiday entitlement.

I think we're all shocked by this! at xposts - or should that be

Would you consider looking for a similar job elsewhere? I'm sure you would be treated a lot better & much more appreciated somewhere else! What would they bloody do if you were to leave!? You're keeping the business going, by the sounds of it, & they need to sort this situation out before they lose you.

They ‘have’ to let you have the minimum allowed regardless of whether it’s convenient - it’s the law

Oh my goodness you are all so amazing and helpful!! thank you so much!! Labradoodliedoodoo no, nothing in emails, it is always verbal. I have "written emails" asking for holiday, but the response is always verbal! It has really got to me this year, as I have a friend from abroad visiting, and tried to book (4) days off, and will still - again lose 11 days this year, only to have the "sucking in through the teeth" and sighing, as though I am being a pain. I will start to go through all your hugely helpful emails and make sense of how I need to deal with this. Thank you! xxxx

You should take two weeks stress leave starting tomorrow (get to the gp and say headaches , can't sleep, no holidays permitted for years now and you aren't coping)
Then, when you find back, ignore all urgent work requests and talk to them about your holidays. Say you are trying to decide on taking them to the tribunal or quitting if you cannot have all of your holidays and have a written agreement that you are entitled to minimum one two week block a year, timing to be agreed before the middle of the year or whatever you think suits you and this block will not be cancelled on you. For the rest of the holidays no requests may be denied without in the same communication you are provided with several options of suitable dates for the same time length which you can choose from and lock in.

You should leave. It's not your fault that your employer has failed to adequately staff her business and have a back-up plan for if you're not in. What if you were involved in an accident or needed routine surgery, what happens if you just jack your job in with short notice? Three years of this shit is three years too many. Can you get another job?

You should also consult an employment lawyer. You could quite possibly take your employer to industrial tribunal and win.

No need to consult a lawyer.

Grievance.

Then tribunal.

I’m incredulous that you’ve not had a holiday of more than 4 days length in 3 years!
Do you mean that you haven’t taken your full holiday entitlement in all that time? Have you complained about this and asked to find a solution?
Have you tried asking her to tell you when you can take a fortnight off?

Watroze, thank you - no absolutely not. and ALL the other staff never have a problem taking their holiday, including said manager. xx

DAISY CHAIN, THANK YOU. I work full time, permanently, and very, very often put in a lot more hours than I am paid for, (especially when catching up). I do love my job, I really do, but this whole "thing" that I alone cannot be released is finally getting to me.

For the love of god start looking for a new job. They are not going to change and you have been an utter mug putting up with this for the past 3 years.

user " I have "written emails" asking for holiday, but the response is always verbal!"

that worries me - they might say that they didn't refuse you.

if you make a case out of this, keep that in mind. Is there any other way you have it on record that you were refused?

When you get verbal responses to something like this, you respond via email.
Hi X, I know you said just now that my request for 5 days in mid sept is not feasible, I need to take a week of leave before the end of October, when in that time frame would suit?

Dear all, I just wanted to say "thank you" for all your input. You all made me feel a lot stronger about this, and really helped. I sort of took advice from you all, and put together an actual physical document, (no more verbal answers allowed) listing all my missed holiday, the holiday I HAD been allowed, (which then looked paltry) and the personal cost of this in £ to me. I found some good sentences from various of the websites you all recommended, and I also found some information about good health re. work/private life balance. I emailed this all to my manager, and asked for a short meeting, but asked for an emailed response. I didn't get an emailed response, but I DID then have a very successful discussion, and have now been allowed to take quite a bit of holiday before January 1st! I then "meticulously" typed out the details of our discussion, the result, and the agreements about my holiday, and even went so far as to suggest that this was printed out, and put in the "staff holiday file". Manager has agreed to do so. I will never be quite sure if my recent email set alarm bells ringing, or if it was just a genuine oversight of such a loyal employee (me) - I would really like to think the latter. However, I am going to be very firm in the future, and, when denied holiday if again it is inconvenient, I WILL be asking, "then please will you suggest WHEN I can take this please, and jot me an email offering dates. I will also ensure (and I neeeeed it) that I will be taking "proper, whole weeks off" ie five days, which added to the pair of weekends will result in PROPER 9 day breaks. THANK you all, so much! xxxx

So glad :) enjoy your time off!

Well done for tackling them OP, hopefully you gave them food for thought and I hope you got a bit of the time off you wanted with your friend as well.

Keep hold of your document as well and think about claiming money for the holiday they didn't let you take last year