Opinions on this email I received? Manager seems to be pushing me

[HannahWayes]

I have severe pregnancy sickness, I'm 17 weeks now. My employer seems to be pushing me to go back?

I always update her and send the new sick notes from my GP to her. I keep records of all these emails.

What do you think?

She seems to be treating it as normal sickness when pregnancy related illness comes under a different umbrella

There is nothing at all to suggest op needs to go all "maternity action and union" about this yet I'm sorry but I don't really know what that means? Perhaps your understanding of what MA and Unions do is different to mine? It's not remotely escalating like suggesting a grievance or talking to a lawyer, or making a claim for anything - it's just getting some advice from people who should either be experts on Maternity and employment rights (MA) or the op's specific workplace or industry (Union). The advice may well be to continue to do nothing but it's not going to hurt to talk it through.

It's good to get some advice and they're a lot more reliable than some randoms on the internet. They can also talk specifics.

What an odd attitude to take!

Just for the record I absolutely think the employer should be continuing to remain in contact and where possible make adjustments to ensure the continued trust and confidence in the employment relationship.

I'm not sure invitations to formal meetings are the best way to do that.

Yes I am aware of MA and Unions remit in this situation, but my opinion still stands - I don't believe at this stage op needs any actual advice apart from see what they do next. She had already replied saying she couldn't attend - it's their next action that will ascertain whether she should seek further advice and from whom.

The op is actively looking for advice though isn't she? That's why she has posted after all.

I can only speak from my own experience but I have found it helpful to talk through the what ifs when faced with similar. It was then not knowing what would or could happen that was hard and having an idea and a bit of a plan was comforting. It was hardly the ludicrous suggestion you made it out to be.

We haven't seen the whole letter or got the full background so that is another reason to take further advice if the op wants to do so.

It's just a suggestion, not a three line whip!

Yes and I've given my advice based on my experience and profession, as you have given yours

Hi all, thanks for all the replies.

Manager is very keen on meeting in person and is coming across as if this is the only way forward. If she insists, what do I do? I will offer a meeting by phone no problem.

I have been off since 11 weeks pregnant so for quite a while now.

She is new to the manager role and was quite clueless at first.

For example, when I first notified her of my maternity appointments, she was saying about making the time up is what they usual do when someone has a medical arrangement. I said that doesn't apply to maternity, unfortunately.

She did not know this.

Inexperienced manager who needs to take advice from HR.

Get your GP to write on fit note that you are too unwell to travel and offer her a home visit.

I think I'd give your HR dept a call and explain nicely in a collaborative way.

This is perfectly normal and will be a template email. I would use this to formally document all sickness in previous 12 months, then pull out all pregnancy related sickness so that you could clearly see where you are at with the sickness policy. A line manager should absolutely be doing this, plus reasonable adjustments you need for being able to return to work. It's quite usual to need a different chair, back support, acknowledgement of additional loo breaks etc. It's also an opportunity for you to discuss when you think you'd like to start maternity leave so they can start planning cover.

Please don't worry, all normal.

I would have put money on her either being new to management or not very clued up, hence my advice to see what they come back with on the off chance she would speak to hr and they put her on the right path. Clearly not! So she replied just re-arranging it for another day?

Do you have a HR department? I would go back and say something like "hi manager, as you are aware my pregnancy related illness is making it impossible to be able to arrange anything involving me having to travel. I can be available to speak over the phone or for you to come here, please advise" and cc the HR dept/contact in

Or, you could just contact your HR department in the first instance and ask for their advice? My guess is they will step in quicker than you can say Manager Needs Training.

And I would usually call the employee as well to explain the template email and reassure it's all normal, get them thinking about adjustments etc and set the tone for the meeting as a relaxed but minuted meeting to support her. Hope this helps.

Thanks folks, some wonderful advice given

Honestly wonder where I'd be without MN sometimes!

op if she is as green as you say, she will almost certainly be asking more experienced people than herself how to handle your particular situation.

Don't worry yourself about the meeting, that is normal. However, just adding this because many are not aware (or able to do anything about it), employers can enforce maternity leave be taken from the earliest date if a long period of sick leave has been taken. If I recall correctly, it's from 28 weeks.

I'm not saying that for any reason other than to let you know. If you are very unwell because of your pregnancy there is nothing you can do to fix it, except give birth.

I hope your pregnancy related illness lets up soon and that you have a happy, healthy baby

36 weeks for forced mat leave.

This link answers lots of questions about Maternity related sickness. It's from MA who are a charity but reliable: www.maternityaction.org.uk/advice-2/mums-dads-scenarios/pregnant/sickness-during-pregnancy-and-maternity-leave/

"Pregnancy sickness is exempt from your normal sickness records and you can't be disciplined"
Genuine question, what stops some people just being off sick their whole pregnancy then as they don't fancy work?

They would still need a sick note. Self certification is still 7 days. Longer than that without medical evidence would probably be classed as AWOL.

Ah so they smouldering be disciplined in the usual way for that while pregnant

Smouldering??
What is this phone doing?

You're protected from discrimination for maternity related reasons. You're not protected from shirking.

Also the kind of people who would take a whole pregnancy of sick leave because they don't feel like it (assuming they could convince a doctor to sign fit notes stating not fit for work) are vanishingly rare. Not least because there are plenty of people who don't get any kind of sick pay beyond statutory so not much in it for them and many people need to be earning in their qualifying weeks to get the maximum amount of maternity pay.

Legal info here

and here

Basically, you can not be penalised or disciplined for pregnancy related sickness, but that is not to say that your employer can't discuss the conditions for your return to work. But, if you are too sick to attend a meeting, they need to rearrange.

One of my former companies always did these meetings in the home environment if the employees illness meant they found travel difficult.

It makes sense surely for them to offer that. Anyone who has suffered nausea of any sort (not just pregnancy related) would know that travel is bound to be difficult.