Capability proceedings against me - should I really welcome this???

[mousiemousie]

I have been trying to improve my relationship with my boss for 9 months and it has been an awful time for me. She is a bully and is constantly insinuating that I am incapable of doing my job but will never say what problems she has with my performance or how I can address them when I ask her. My support has been reduced from a full time experienced and qualified person to half of a temporary inexperienced trainee and this is affecting my ability to meet deadlines but my manager claims that my job is adequately resourced. I am working significant unpaid overtime but still cannot meet deadlines with my current resources.

A director from a different department has advised me that a capability charge now would be in my interests and that I should press for one. Prior to changing boss under a restructure 9 months ago I was very well thought of for the previous 9 years and it is only my line manager who thinks I am lacking in capability now.

I was suprised by this advice but I do need to resolve the problem as fast as I can - it has gone on too long. Is pushing for capability proceedings really sensible? I would also potentially have a bullying case to make but would be reluctant to persue it asI think it is unlikely to help me.

Does anyone have any advice or thoughts? I work for the NHS.

best of luck mousie - I shall keep an eye out for your threads

Today I saw HR, unfortunately a younger less experienced HR person was all that was available to me. My boss's boss had scheduled another meeting for the 3 of us this morning but I requested that we postpone this until I had spoken to HR as I was anxious to know that I was going about things in the most constructive way and I felt the previous meeting in this format had not gone very well. My boss's boss was fine with this.

I was advised that I had 3 options - to ask for a facilitated meeting (previously resisted by my boss) with an HR facilitator (who would normally be a junior HR person and would normally go in to the situation cold).

Option 2 is to escalate to the next management level ie director level.

Option 3 is to start formal grievance proceedings.

These are in order of escalation value so the HR adviser advocates the first option as the best next step and I agree that the lower the escalation increment the better likelihood of a workable resolution. I am going to propose this to my boss in a meeting with her and her boss, and suggest that we all 3 agree an agenda for that meeting that satisfies ALL our needs. I will tell them that the last meeting only addressed THEIR needs and that I do not want a meeting in response that just addresses my needs - I think all needs must be addressed.

I feel that an experienced facilitator will be required for the best chance of this approach working - but I don't know how to make sure I get one that has a lot of experience! Any ideas?

I also think that my boss will need to be prepared to compromise as well as me and thus far she has not thought this necessary.
So far I am not sure how much my boss or her boss realise that I am close to a formal grievance and that not only is this unlikely to do me many favours but it is also unlikely to be good for either of them. I think my boss will need to feel that there is some pressure on her in order to give any ground at all and I don't know if I can affect this whilst at the same time not escalating the situation further unduly?

Overall I feel better about things today while paradoxically feeling further from a good resolution than ever...I feel like I am sliding inexorably to formal grievance. I think I feel a bit better mainly due to no longer being pre-menstrual, but also due to the wonderful support of those around me including everyone who has taken time out to post on this thread. All of you are hugely generous and kind human beings and it means a lot to me that you have posted your kind words and intelligent advice.

Oh yes...and we had a great time in London this weekend seeing The Lion King and staying with my cousin in his new house!

Oh mousie - I have just read your updates since my last post to you, and I am so sorry that things haven't improved.

I think in order to show that you have made every effort to reach a mutually agreeable solution, you are right to request a facilitated meeting again. With regards to getting a HR facilitator, can you speak to the HR advisor that you saw today and request a more senior member of their department. I also think it is vital that you meet with them prior to the meeting (if it agreed) to ensure that they are fully up to speed with your whole sitution before you go in. I would seriously question any HR professional refusing this, especially if you explain that you want to avoid a grievance situation, but that you will progress down that route if all other options fail. (Dropping 'consructive dismissal' into that conversation will also help )

I do feel though that as you are clearly doing all the running to try and resolve the situation to the best interests of all involved, that if this meeting is refused, or doesn't have the desired outcome, then you should raise a formal grievance. Please don't worry about how this will make you look in the eyes of management - HR is there to ensure that policy and procedure are followed, and that includes ensuring you are not treated detrimentally as a result of the grievance.

At all times, keep a diary - if the worst case scenario happens and you feel you have to leave, this will help your constructive dismissal claim.

Good Luck x

detoxdiva thank you - if the facilitated meeting is agreed I will definitely follow your advice about how to get an experienced and up to speed facilitator.

I am writing a diary every night, much to the annoyance of dd who is getting less time from me than she is used to

dp has advised me to stop posting on mumsnet in case it is identifiable and prejudicial . I am thinking that I haven't posted anything that might be used against me - and my boss doesn't have kids...but other people do...

Stopping posting is obviously your decision amd I can understand your dp not wanting you to prejudice your case. However, from what others have said, there will be other people with your employer across the country in similar situations, so as long as you are not releasing any personal info that clearly identifies you as you, then you should be fine. (And if anyone asks you in rl then you can just say no it's not you!)

Just on the HR side of things - I don't know how it works with your employer, but do you have regional / area offices with HR managers who you could contact about your situation?

m, so pleased to see your post, even tho work still is pressured, the tone of your writing is much more upbeat, London proves that you are trying not to let this take over your whole life. (difficult i know)
I think you are going about things exactly the right way and that all can see that you are doing your best to resolve a difficult situation which speaks volumes for your professionalism and pride
good luck

No regional offices but my organisation is large - over 5,000 employees so the HR dept is also fairly big compared to most. ACAS might be worth contacting though...they have facilitators although I think they charge so not sure that this would be an option. I might investigate!

Thanks, detoxdiva!
mousie
x

robbosmum we cross posted again - what a nice thing to say!

I have decided that I need to play to my strengths and the ability to approach things in a reasonable and diplomatic way may be one of them ( of course mumsnet is a good part of the reason for this!)

This is why your bosss boss has such a lot of respect for you!!!!!!

Today it became clear that the penny had finally dropped for my boss and her boss that this was potentially heading towards a formal grievance against my boss. Neither had considered this until yesterday when I consulted HR instead of going ahead with our planned 2nd meeting.

I am stunned that it has taken them so long to realise, and I think they are both in shock that they could have ignored all the signs.

My boss asked if I was starting a formal grievance for bullying and if the facilitated meeting I was suggesting was part of that procedure. She was actually visibly upset at this point and I said no, I wanted to solve the problem informally, I wanted all of us to contribute to the agenda and although discussing feeling bullied would form part of my agenda it would be part of a wider discussion to enable us to work well together and put all of this behind us. I said I thought we could do this or I would not be suggesting the facilitated meeting.

Then my boss asked me to describe the bullying behaviours so I got out a wodge of my typed papers and gave her some examples. I found this suprisingly difficult to do. The facilitated meeting was agreed and will probably be next week, we agreed to request a senior HR officer. I left the meeting feeling shaky and physically sick. DD tells me this is normal - "it always feels like that when I use your advice to stand up to bullies at school mum"

Things will change now because my boss has moved on a stage of realisation - but which way they will move I will have to wait and see. I think I have probably done my boss a favour by making her see the effects of her actions but don't expect her to see it that way, and am not at all convinced that this will be of benefit to me.

BUT I DID IT!!! I STOOD UP TO MY BULLY!!!

WELL DONE M,
your boss, regardless whether she likes it or not will be told by her boss to sort this out informally and to do whatever it takes to achieve this. It is an extremely serious situation for a mgr to be accusewd of bullying and aggression, esp. as people rarely speak out, everyone knows who these mgs are but everyone puts up with it.
You should pat yourself on the back and have a v. large g&t, what make sit worse for yuor boss is that none of your other mgrs agree with the labelling of you being poor at your job (badly phrased sorry)
you should be so proud of yourself. I think she may be having a sleepless night tonight

oh bravo Mousie

yes it takes guts to do what you have just done and I think the way you feel about it is totally natural.

I also agree that boss will most probably be bending over backwards to sort this out (but beware of slippage after)

Could she see how some of the examples you gave her could be bullying .. I must say if she faces this and changes her behaviour you'll probably have done her a favour too

What a fabulous example you are setting for your DD too .. she's going to grow up strong and confident and self-aware

good on ya

robbosmum thanks so much for your support - it means a lot .

I have had a glass of wine and I feel more normal than usual now that I have stopped feeling sick! and I feel like I did the right thing.

For some weird reason I don't have a self image as someone who can be bullied so I needed help in recognising the situation as bullying...I think I suddenly feel good about myself for something and I haven't felt that way for some time...maybe now I will feel able to deal with whatever happens next without feeling that it would all be overwhelming and unmanageable which I had been feeling.

MM, I've been a lurker on your thread, and just wanted to say a huge "well done" for handling this all so well.
I hope you get the outcome you so richly deserve, and that your boss realises that her behaviour has been unacceptable. With any luck she will change for the better.

no probs m , its wot mners are good at!!! bullying happens by stealth, its a situation you get used to and then one day the penny drops trhat you hate going into work and feel you are doing your very best, which everyone appreciates except your boss!
you are very brave

Oh wow mousie - seriously well done on a great meeting by the sounds of it

You've done the hard bit and got them to see how determined you are and they seem to be taking you seriously now. Keep up the positive attitude, and I look forward to hearing how your meeting goes.

Thanks for your support, all of you

I think I turned a corner in that whatever happens I feel more able to handle it than I have done before.

Hi everyone
Things have still been very hard going but my self esteem is slowly coming back...

HR have been very supportive and are in agreement with me that certain behaviour from my boss is unreasonable and some of her expectations of me are way beyond my contract. I have a facilitated meeting tomorrow with HR and my boss to try to find a way forward. I am hopeful that I can make the most of this meeting without becoming too emotional although this is not a forgone conclusion

I have found out that some senior people in my organisation have been impressed with me in the past and still are and that there are job options associated with this although I can hardly believe this

Thanks to all of you who have been so supportive, you are all beautiful people and you have really helped me and my family through an experience which has both shocked and rocked me greatly.

Glad to hear things are looking up for you during a tough time there. Hope the meeting goes well.

It must be nice to hear the positive feedback about you too

Hi Mousie mousie

So glad HR have helped, how did the meeting go? Sometimes the HR route is the only option with a boss like yours, they are too pig headed and self absorbed to see what they are doing to others.

Hope things went ok for you, have been following your thread.

I am not really sure how the meeting went...

I have been offered another job by my old boss which sounds great and I accepted and my boss was told on the day of the meeting.

She tried to cancel the meeting but I asked for it to go ahead.

In the meeting she demonstrated a lot of the behaviour I have been citing as unreasonable in front of the HR rep and didn't show herself in a good light. I think that I managed to make a lot of good points and not to dissolve into tears...

Yet the meeting saw her asking for me to work another 6 or more weeks for her before transferring to my new boss - to help her manage without losing me with no immediate replacement and to let her show she can now "fix" the relationship...so it seems to be the outcome she wants whereas I want to transfer yesterday.

She will be gutted that her management skills have been questioned in such a public way though and that she has lost her scapegoat. I don't know what my next move should be...

I would like to transfer with immediate effect and would like to be sure she will not bully my successor...but she still finds nothing wrong in what she has done...

Meanwhile I have shocking joint pain from the stress and feel that she has pretty much got away with her behaviour. On the other hand I am extremely lucky to have had so much support both from other people in my organisation and outside, and to have been offered a good job to go for working for a really good and decent boss.

I don't really know how I feel or what to do next, even though this was a pivotal meeting.

Things have probably turned onto a good path for me now but I still have to work for her for a few more weeks

thanks for asking