How much should this job be paying and how to go about negotiating PT?

[KentishPud]

"XXX School is seeking to appoint a self-motivated, inspirational Finance Manager to provide strategic support to the Head Teacher and Governing Body. As a well-qualified and experienced individual with a strong financial background, you will be responsible for financial tasks within the school.

The successful candidate will have an important role in creating highly effective and structured systems with our partner School. It would be expected that you can demonstrate significant experience of financial leadership, including planning, forecasting, budget setting and management, preparation of accounts and statutory reporting within a very large institution."

It's full-time, 37 hours per week 52 weeks per year. Large comprehensive, in special measures.

I currently work in school finance (this would be 1 grade up) and accept that the money is rubbish. That suits me FTB because I work short days, term-time only. The advertised job has all the downsides of working in school (poor pay) but not of the benefits (no short days or long holidays)

I'm pretty well qualified for the job, having experience in schools and having done most of their second paragraph in a previous life. However, when I left that job I was earning c. double what he school is offering.

Despite that, I'm tempted to apply, wondering if my reservations will mean few applicants and that it might be possible to negotiate some extra holidays. However, I also wonder if that might be shooting myself in the foot by taking a reduced salary to do effectively a f-t job and (I suspect) many f-t school finance people actually work quite "flexibly" in the holidays.

Anyway, I have to apply and succeed etc, but what grade/salary would you expect this to be and at what point would you start talking about hours?

As an ex-Governor at a school in special measures I have to say it is highly unlikely that the job would go to someone who wanted part time hours. 110% commitment would be required and someone who is asking about part time when the job is clearly advertised as full time is not very likely to get the position. In my experience the only possible way of getting part time is to do the role successfully for (probably) a number of years and if the school has been turned round ............. at that point ask for part time.

Just my view, others may think differently.

I know ragwort but they're offering 1 grade lower and approx. £10pa less than the bursar at my current, medium sized junior school, who does get the benefit of p-t hours. I just wonder who they think they're going to get without offering p-t. i.e. I'd be interested p-t but if I wanted give 110% commitment 52 weeks per year, I'd go back to my old career and earn double

BTW, I'm happy to work f-t term-time, I'd just like some extended holidays. Not necessarily all the school holidays but a bit more than a standard f-t position offers. They would get 110% commitment.

I absolutely agree with what you are saying Kentish but from my experience I just know that so many employers automatically expect 'full time' without even questioning if/how the job could be done differently.

I work part time myself (by choice) and I know I do a better job that the full time managers but because I am 'only' part time I get paid a pittance much less ............ sadly that's just the way it is.

Work out your hourly rate for both jobs and then compare if it's worth giving up the flexibility for the promotion.

I did the same and despite the attractiveness of the higher job, the associated additional costs for school holidays and loss of flexibility was too much to make the change. I do regret it but I just couldn't have made it work and there was no chance of part time or term time for the promoted role.

Yes that's exactly my point Ragwort, I too am currently doing a job for far less than I'm worth because I get lovely p-t hours. But this job seems to be offering a very low salary for what they're asking without the benefit of p-t. Will anyone qualified actually apply?

Slalomsuki, financially I'd be way better off because I work very p-t ATM and it is a step up. I'm ready to take on much more. Youngest DC now almost teen but whilst they don't "want" me around so much these days I do think they "need" to know you're there, even if they don't know it. So, I'd like a proper challenging job, but for it to be close to home which means I can be around in the evenings and I'd also like to be there for a good proportion of the holidays. Which is why I'm considering this one rather than going back to my old career, but I'd want to tweak the hours, just a little bit.

I don't think it's a question of how much it "should" be paying. If they get tons of qualified experienced applicants at the salary they are offering, then clearly there's no reason for them to offer more, or to be flexible about hours/holiday. If they, as you suspect, don't get a good set of qualified applicants, they are far more likely to be open to flexibility of terms. Apply and see what happens.

Thank you flowery. So you'd apply and do the interview (should I get one) on the basis that it's f-t and then talk about hours if I'm successful?

Yes. If they like you and want you then you are in a stronger negotiating position, and by then if there is a problem with a lack of good candidates they will know that - at the moment they do not.

My old school paid the finance manager 28k which I thought was pants money for the role. It's a secondary with 1, 000 pupils.
I would wait to be offered before negotiating hours.