How do you manage work and family? I'm struggling.

[Fishandjam]

Am just after a bit of experience-sharing. Apologies in advance for long post but I don't want to dripfeed.

I have 2 DC, DS aged 5 and DD 2.5. DS has been diagnosed with mild ASD, though he's unstatemented and seems to be doing OK at school. Younger one is at nursery.

I work in a professional job 4 days a week, 9-5. I have an hour commute each way. So DS has to go to pre- and after-school club 8am to 6pm. I rarely get back home with the pair of them before 6.30pm, whereupon we have to do snack/bath/bed in a rush. DS often struggles to settle to sleep and has a lot of anxiety/separation problems, so either I or DH has to stay with him until he's asleep (though we've been doing a staged withdrawal and it seems to be working so far). So by the time we've got him settled and had some dinner, it's usually knocking on 9.30-10pm.

DH works 5 days week, and has a 1.5 hour commute each way (the oposite way from my commute). He isn't often able to do school/nursery pickup or dropoff, though he can do some days. He tries really hard to be home for the kids' bedtime but he usually then has to work again in the evenings.

We have no family help at all - we have to manage everything between us. I do outsource my cleaning though!

Basically, we're all miserable. DH and I are exhausted and snap at each other constantly, as well as at the children. Weekends are basically riot control as DS is so tired on Saturdays from the week at school, he's really hard work. DH and I almost never go out anywhere as a couple as DS struggles to be left with anyone other than us.

I'm also conscious that there's only 1 day a week that DS can do any kind of after-school activity, have playdates etc. Homework, when it comes, has to be done at weekends too.

There is little scope for me to reduce my hours or to rearrange them to achieve an earlier finish each day (I already work short days as our official finish time is 5.30pm). DH can't either. Part-time work in my field is rarer than rocking horse shit generally.

I keep fantasising about just jacking in my job, but while we could just about manage on DH's salary, there would be no savings, no pension contributions, no holidays (we live in the SE where housing costs are a lot). I don't really enjoy my current job - it's well paid but much of the work is singificantly below my experience level, so I'm bored a lot of the time. Yet I know it's a good job and that I should be grateful for it, and I feel I'd be such a failure if I gave it up. I've always worked and have been quite career driven (I had my kids quite late).

I really don't know what to do. Has anyone else been through similar and come out the other side?

Personally, my life has been improved by a new job, so I feel enthused by work and come home happy to see the dc rather than work hanging over me and having to work again all eve. Gone from 4 days to 5, but now my weekends are sacrosanct rather than spending Sunday trying to work while kids scream.

I have also got an after school nanny so dc are home so they are more relaxed and don't have to be carted off home. They will also be able to do afterschool activities. Expensive and I am broke mind.

Our serious alternative was to move somewhere cheap far away and have no mortgage and some low paying local work.

Hello everyone,

Thank you all so much for your kind replies. I’m feeling a bit choked – I was fully expecting someone to come on and tell me to woman the fuck up! Mumsnet, I luffs you.

I’ll try to reply to some of the points raised:

mandy214, DH wouldn’t be able to change his working pattern in any meaningful way. At risk of making myself entirely identifiable IRL, he’s a university lecturer in a subject which isn’t done at every HE institution. So while his FTE salary is less than mine, and his hours are much more rigid (lectures, tutorials etc), he needs to stick with the job he has as it would potentially be more difficult for him to find an alternative. For the same reasons, he can’t easily work from home – he’s asked, and been rebuffed. By the same token, I can’t flex my hours to an earlier start/finish because I need to do dropoff some mornings, and pre-school club doesn’t open until 7.45am. Plus my department has to liaise with West Coast USA a lot, so an early finish doesn’t fit with that (my boss told me that an early finish would “truncate the day” too much). WFH met with a similar lack of enthusiasm.

We already don’t do baths every night; I also don’t do much if any domestic goddessry (the last time I got the iron out was to set some Hama beads ). I do insist on cooking a decent meal for me and DH; the kids usually have a picnic-type tea as they’ll have had cooked lunches at school/nursery.

twelvelegged, I could do my job via consultancy but it would be tricky – I’m a solicitor and so would have to register as a sole practitioner, pay for exorbitant PI insurance, etc. I did have a spell of self employment in the past and the regulatory burden was ridiculous for the setup I had. However, there might be ways round it – I’d have to get proper advice though. Other mums at my grading either have SAH husbands, parents willing to help out, or husbands who earn very good money and so they can afford nannies, or private school with all its wrap-around stuff. Plus they have NT kids who don’t have a meltdown just as you’re leaving the house in the morning because you asked them to carry their book bag

I’ve definitely thought about engaging a nanny, but I can’t see it being a long term solution – I fear the difficulties we’re having will continue even once both DC are at school, and I doubt we could afford one indefinitely. Plus my job isn’t necessarily secure, for all sorts of reasons – I can just see me taking on a nanny, only to find I’m being made redundant! The idea of a nanny appeals hugely, though. Maybe I shouldn’t dismiss it out of hand. Are there still such things as mother’s helps? Sadly we only live in a 3 bed house so no room for an au pair (I definitely can’t face having DS and DD share!)

funchum, we’ve often thought about moving closer to DH’s work. However, that would severely restrict my ability to find work in my field (hi-tech), and what little support network we do have is where we currently live. So while it would solve the DH commute problem, we think it would bring more problems with it.

Sorry, I don’t mean to sound so negative about all the suggestions! I just feel like I’m so far down in the trenches that I can’t see a way forward. However, I think I’ll shake a few trees to see if any of my business contacts need part-time help – all too often it’s being in the right place at the right time for this sort of thing (it’s how I got my current job).

Thank you all again. You’re complete stars.

What I did when the children were smaller was share a nanny with a local family. That helped with the cost. It made a lot of (positive) difference to my life. And let's face it...if the worst happened and you got made redundant you would still be either looking for another job and still need her. Or not looking in which case you would give her notice...

We have similar challenges (not ASD, but not NT either)... Similar aged children and two careers. It's bloody hard at times. Unmumsnetty hugs...

An after school nanny/housekeeper has been our saving grace. She works about 16 hours over four days. Cost here is about £9-10 per hour gross which isn't much more than I'd be paying for childminder or afterschool clubs. She keeps the house reasonable, does the children's laundry (including their beds). Assuming she still wants to, she'll be staying on when youngest goes to school. It means that they can do after school stuff/go to the park/just veg out at home. Homework can be done... It also means that we can do other house stuff at the weekend as all the basics are covered. I just live in fear of her leaving...

I think mothers' helps do exist but are not usually left with sole care of children.

it sounds like you have really thought this through op and that you are doing your best under different circumstances.
hopefully something will come up soon that'll help you out a bit

have you looked on gumtree at the babysitting and nannies section? I see lots of jobs on there for unusual hours that are needed to fit in with a particular families circumstances, maybe you could try there?

"we’ve often thought about moving closer to DH’s work. However, that would severely restrict my ability to find work in my field (hi-tech), and what little support network we do have is where we currently live."

Re support network, we moved when the children were small, as my DH had a similar commute. We now live five minutes from his job. I've always worked freelance (even pre-children), though, so it didn't affect my job. It made such a difference, as we just had so much more time. And we quickly built up a support network, mainly because that was the criteria we used for choosing our house - near active children's groups like NCT, beavers etc.

Obviously, your job isn't so portable. Can you see if you can find another job closer to your DH's work, and he look for a job near where you live? Does he have to stay as a lecturer? That doubles the chance of finding one. The travel thing just made such a difference to us. And it meant that my DH saw so much more of the children (and the housework).

Academia can be extremely inflexible. Would he consider look for another job? I know that after years or even decades becoming an expert in one field it sounds crazy not to continue that path, but it is absolutely possible since his skills are easily transferable to other fields.

Sounds tough, but good to hear you're thinking laterally.
The solicitors I know facing similar juggling acts have mainly gone in-house or down the PSL route, although I gather those roles are like gold-dust.

I'm already in-house twelvelegged. My employer is very family friendly in lots of ways - no sideways looks when yesterday I had to leave unexpectedly to get a poorly DD, for example - but there's still a bit of a bums-on-seats/if-we-can't-actually-see-you-working-you'll-be-taking-the-piss mentality. And of course the pay is worse than in law firms (while still good in absolute terms), so it's a sort of double whammy when it comes to thinking about nannies.

Fishandjam - my H and I are both solicitors, both in contentious specialisms, all a bit unpredictable and unfortunately not as well paid as everyone else seems to think . I can see where you are coming from!

How does your DH commute? Is there any way he could get the train (rather than drive) so that he can work on the train and therefore reduce his need to be at uni for the time he's not actually teaching? Even if it meant he could just do pick up one night per week?

How would reducing your hours be received? If you did a half day less (so 3.5 days rather than 4) so you could leave an hour earlier each day, or if you thought it would work better, have an afternoon off. And then ask if you could work from home just for that morning (i.e. then have the afternoon off). If they know of your commute, they might be more accommodating and not expect you to do a 2hr commute for a morning in the office.

The other suggestion is whether your DH has any contacts with a university closer to home? Our after school nanny is a student teacher - she helps us 2 days a week when she only has lectures in a morning (she was previously a nursery nurse which is how we met her). Bit of a long shot but any chance of finding a student who could help that way?

I also think its definitely worth asking at your DDs nursery if any of the nursery nurses want extra hours either helping out in a morning or occasionally in the evening.

I'm on a similar situation. Firstly dh and I get up at 5.45 each day so I can get dressed and we can do some jobs. A load of washing goes in every morning. Empty dishwasher. Get kids up and dressed. We take our breakfast to work (porridge sachet). Kids get breakfast at nursery/school. I also do all drop offs and pick ups. I leave at 7.45 First child goes to breakfast club, baby goes to nursery. I get to work for 8.45.

I collect both kids from nursery/ afterschool club and get home for 6.15pm. Dinner is either cooked (slow cooker) or just needs heating up.

I eat with the children then it's bath and bed by 7.30 for youngest. I put clothes out for next day and put washing away while kids are in bath. She doesn't sleep well but we had to be firm and she's learning. Some nights are better than others. Dh gets home about 7, eats and helps with homework for older child. Who's in bed by 8.

We then start with washing, tidying up kitchen etc.

Slow cooker and batch cooking are your friends! Food shop and clean on your day off.

Weekends are spent getting as much done for the next week as possible! We have 5 sets of school uniform and 2 sets of PE kit. By Sunday night it's all clean and ready for the week.

We've just started booking a date night every 6 weeks. Cracks in our marriage were showing but this helps.

Dh has 70 min commute and is looking for a job closer to home.

It's exhausting but we try and keep one day every weekend for family time. Sundays tend to be the day of cooking, cleaning and in the garden or DVD.

It will get easier as they get older.

I work in london annd dp had an academic job not in london. Like really far from london. He made clear that he needed flexibility regarding schedule commute etc.
long stary short he found out very soon that the position was a pita. So he found a better paid job in london that actually allows him more flexibility.
And we are happier.

It's an age old problem that lots and lots of parents w/o family to help are struggling with. The options are either:

• one of you cuts back their working hours significantly (which may involve relocating to reduce mortgage/living costs); or

• employ a nanny.

I don't know anyone in your situation who has managed it any other way. Most people I know simply do not have super flexible working hours/GPs on tap.

If you have a career you can take a few years out from and still hope to get back into then consider doing that maybe? You sound stressed and exhausted (understandably given your situation).

Last thing I would add, do what's right for you and your family. Ignore those that disapprove of you giving up work (if that's what you choose to do) and ignore those who disapprove of you outsourcing childcare (if that's what you choose to do).

Thank you all again for your kind and helpful posts. As well as all the practical suggestions, it's been really good to know I'm not just being a pathetic wuss!

I'm even more sure, though, that I need to change something. The poster who said it was a shame not to be enjoying my DC's childhood had it bang on. I'm watching the Panorama about cancer and it really brought it home to me: if I was told tomorrow that I had 6 months to live, what would I regret? For sure, I'd regret all this stress.

So. I aim to gird my loins and tell my boss tomorrow that I want to finish earlier - will have to see how she reacts before we can explore the actual hours. Wish me luck!

Good for you and fingers crossed. I have heard of quite a few people who assumed they would get nowhere with requests like this, but did when they pushed it politely but assertively. Often seems bosses will try to put you off even asking because that often works but, when it comes to it, would rather bend a bit than lose a staff member completely. Hopefully yours will be sensible.

In your shoes, I would seriously consider changing jobs to something much more family friend.ly for the sake of your marriage and children. No job is worth the stress you are under.

Op what about your partner? Is he going to request to leave early or arrive late as well? It would be just fair.

Hi everyone,

A quick update. I asked my boss about finishing earlier - she pulled a bit of a catsbumface but said she wouldn't oppose it. It would have to go through HoD anyway so might not get granted. She pointed out that it may affect my employability at that company in the near future (don't want to say why as it'll out me!) But in principle I'll take that hit.

However, I did sit DH down at the weekend, after spending an hour sobbing in a darkened toilet with the stress of it all. We talked through every single option - proper brainstorm. Upshot is that we'll look into the possibility of a after-school nanny. I haven't been able to progress that yet but will do soon. Thanks to all who suggested that!

nolim, I think I explained upthread why it probably wasn't a goer for DH to reduce his hours.

I'm in a similar situation but luckily I can work from home full time. Is this an option for you? I have 3 children, 2 dogs and a husband. Plus I'm the main breadwinner so extra pressure - esp as I'm in the service industry and this month it looks as though work is slowing down so we seem to be getting attention from management again (we had redundancies 2 years ago). Children are 2, 4 and 6 (and then there's the homework).

DH feels bad if we don't get the kids out both days at the weekend but frankly it feels impossible as we're all recovering from early mornings adn late nights.

Oh just looked at your update.

Good luck Fishandjam. Hope you get approval for your hours and you get an after-school nanny