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Forced to work an afternoon with no childcare

34 replies

incy · 12/09/2006 07:47

I am a teacher and for the past two years I have worked 0.5 of a full time contract. I have always worked the same two full days plus one morning. Two days before teaching was due to start my line manager told me this could not be accomodated anymore and I would have to work my hours accross all three days. As I do't have childcare on the afternoon in question I said this was impossible but she is saying I have to do it. I know my contract does not specify exact days or hours so in effect I could be forced to do this contractually but if they do I will have no choice but to resign. In the meeting last week when I was told my hours had changed, my line manager said she found me cold and unapproachable, was dreading doing my apprasial and knew I'd have to resign if these hours were inflicted on me. I think she is just trying to back me into a corner and make me resign. Any advice - I just feel like resigning.

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tribpot · 12/09/2006 07:51

That sounds awful, can you talk to your union about it? It does sound like she is trying to force you into resigning, which is illegal.

incy · 12/09/2006 07:55

I have done but it is causing me a lot of stress - my son has been in hospital all weekend and can't be sent to nursery for a while so I'm not at work to deal with it directly. Sorry if sounds defeatest but at the moment I just want it all to go away!

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TheBlonde · 12/09/2006 08:09

If you have done your hours over 2 days for 2 years then they can't just up and change it without consultation/your agreement.

incy · 12/09/2006 08:11

Also, would they not have to offer me alternatives such as other courses I could teach on to fit in with these hours ? Nothing else has been offered - it's just a case of you'll have to do it even though they know it is impossible.

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Twiglett · 12/09/2006 08:21

its illegal .. the fact you've done it that way for 2 years already is tantamount to a contract

you have a stong sexual discrinimation case there

what is the union saying

lemonaid · 12/09/2006 08:22

Equal Opportunities Commission website says:

Q: I am the mother of 2 young children and my working hours have until now fitted in with my childcare arrangements. My employer is planning to alter my working hours and I will have difficulty obtaining suitable childcare. Can my employer do this?

A: If in changing your hours your employer does not take account of your childcare needs so you are unable to work the new hours, or can only do so with difficulty, then you may have a claim under the Sex Discrimination Act. Whether your claim succeeds will depend on whether or not your employer can justify the change in hours. The tribunal will also have to be satisfied that you have made genuine efforts to find suitable childcare, so you should keep a note of the attempts you have made.

So sounds like you'd have a good claim -- definitely worth pushing it with the union's legal representation service. Especially given they gave you 2 days notice. Of course she's trying to make you resign. Don't do it!

incy · 12/09/2006 08:33

The union do feel they are being unfair - however as we all know it's not worth working finacially when you have to pay for childcare and so I am tempted to just go. On the other hand part of me does feel I should make a stand as if they get away with it this time they may try it with someone else with children who has to work.

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tribpot · 12/09/2006 08:38

I think it's up to you, incy. As you say, there is always a trade-off because childcare is so expensive and PT salaries generally not great. But there are other reasons for working - do you enjoy it (other than when you are being persecuted by Boss From Hell)? Do you need to 'keep your hand in' in case you want to go back PT when your kids are older? (I would think probably not for a teacher?)

I can completely understand why you don't feel up to fighting this with a little one who's been in hospital, your union don't really sound like they've done a great deal except say "oh dear, that is bad". Can your local rep not speak to your boss on your behalf?

Alternatively I would write a letter, quoting the paragraph lemonaid mentions, and asking for more time to make suitable arrangements.

incy · 12/09/2006 08:40

Thanks for all your help - the stuff from equal opps is interesting as the union said may be able to claim under sex discrimination act so I can see why now. He has written asking them to fully justify in writing why I can't be accomodated so I guess this is why. As I say I can't see why I wasn't offered other courses to teach to fit in with these hours even if couldn't accomodate with my current courses - I have taught other stuff pre maternity leave. I suspect part of the problem is that my line manager and her friend (also in my department) have chosen not to have children and want this afternoon off so they can have some free time together. They could cover me as they are both free and can teach the course in question but I suspect they think I have been looked after in the past by my previous manager (male, three children under 5) and want to make a point. Isn't work lovely !

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threebob · 12/09/2006 08:42

If you did have to show that you couldn't get childcare - could you?

Rookiemum · 12/09/2006 08:44

I hear what you are saying about your manager trying to make a point, it hurts doesn't it particularly when its your children that they are making the point with. Try not to give them the satisfaction of resigning, you'll get tremendous support from mumsnet if you choose to fight your corner.

Pixiefish · 12/09/2006 08:44

Good Luck with this. i was forced out of a teaching job ecasue my working 2 days was deemned to be awkward. Although they did accomodate me I was subject to low level bullying until I became quite ill and quit.

Don't let them do this to you

blueshoes · 12/09/2006 08:52

incy, that is outrageous! That is why you need to cite chapter and verse to them. Whether or not you take this to an employment tribunal is up to you and your stamina, but if you are already seriously considering leaving, you have nothing to lose by writing a hard hitting letter to them using/implying "change in contractual terms", "constructive dismissal", "sex discrimination" and "internal appeal process" and "taking advice".

Many times, reading the crap that women have to face when combining work and childcare, I wish I was an employment lawyer. This sort of thing just makes me soooo mad.

BTW, I consulted an employment lawyer when my flexible working application was turned down. And she told me this sort of thing happens so much it is depressing. Many times, employers just get away with murder.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 12/09/2006 08:59

No reason why you cant make a fuss, AND go.....

They absolutely cannot do this without offering you alternatives OR the time to sort out childcare (bearing in mind mst childcarers require a months notice to terminate a contract, and it can take a couple of weeks to find an alternative - with vacancies, and even then a settling in period is required).

If they change things so that its costing you more money/reducing your salary then there is also an argument for discrimination.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 12/09/2006 09:00

Also discrimination as in - on top of changing your hours in the first place.....

incy · 12/09/2006 09:04

Threebob good point - DS is at a very nice nursery which (because it is so nice) is full. I could move him I suppose (which is where my case will fall down) but I don't want to as he is settled and I have already moved him once as he was so unhappy and he is only two. So ultimately I won't be able to take it to tribunal but as you say, I am probably going anyway so I feel I should make a point. I also supect that similar to pixiefish that even if I do get my own way I'll probably face low level bullying so go anyway. This has also happened to a friend of mine also a teacher (different school)so so much for child friendly teaching as a job. No wonder they can't find any teachers ! The irony is that when I go they'll employ somebody else part time and chances are that this person will have a reason for working part time (another job or care of dependants) as well as unlikely to be able to teach exactly what I'm teaching - so my manager will have to make changes anyway so fit in with them.

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incy · 12/09/2006 09:07

vendevickie I am with you that I should make a fuss and then go. I went to see my GP yesterday (as son is ill) and she could see I was
upset. I told her everything and she did say that if I don't make a point I will dent my confidence forever so best to deal with and not just resign.

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lemonaid · 12/09/2006 09:10

incy -- Realistically, just approach your son's nursery and a few others that you know will be full and get them to confirm that they couldn't cover the new hours. Chances are that if you can show say four different "attempts" to find childcare for the new hours that will be fine as evidence that you have tried and failed to find childcare. And with only a couple of days' notice you should have no trouble finding plenty of places that can't take him.

You can go to tribunal. Although IME they tend to settle out of court before it gets to that point. It's a big game of chicken seeing who will back down first, but normally it doesn't get as far as a tribunal.

incy · 12/09/2006 09:15

Good point lemon aid. Will do. Thanks for all your support I feel I will make a stand even if I just go.

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prettybird · 12/09/2006 09:36

I think that the point here - which would help a construcive dismissal case, was that yuo were given only two days notice - and a "like it or lump it" attitude.

That is the bit that is unreasonable.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 12/09/2006 09:44

TBH - if you have found suitable childcare - they cant force you to change it - for the very reason you stated - to look elsewhere would mean, in your opinion, sub-standard/less favourable care.

Whatever you do (especially if you are going to go and want to make issue of it) you MUST follow the official grievance policy/procedure.

Kaz33 · 12/09/2006 09:51

Great advice here, not much to add except that if you do decide to go you should be able to get some money out of them in lieu of making a claim.

They don;'t want the publicity and normally just buy you off. I got eight months net salary out of my employers

chestnutter · 12/09/2006 10:00

Agree with VVV re: childcare. I think that if your current nursery cannot accommodate your ds for the new hours, your employers won't/shouldn't expect him to change childcare essentially to suit them when both you and he are happy with it.
Outrageous. It's your decision but as a fellow pt worker I hope you do have the courage to make a stand in this situation.

slug · 12/09/2006 13:51

There is no way that an efficient manager would have left it to two days beforehand to realise this timetabling issue. Timetables are sorted out about April or May. You have a strong case for bullying here. As for the 'cold and unapproachable' comment, well gee, that's what she gets paid all that extra money to deal with. Line management is not just a pay hike and the right to mess with people's lives, there are some responsibilities attached to the post too.

It sounds to me like she's trying to make you the fall guy for her inability to do her job. Go over head to senior management. Quote the sex discrimination law, point out the short notice and the implications of her being unable to do her job effectivly.

incy · 12/09/2006 15:17

Thanks for all advice. Have taken lemonaids advice and called round a few nurseries and they have a minimum number of sessions they can accomodate (either one full day or two half day sessions) and so cover for one afternoon would not be possible. I have got them to e mail this to me. Slug, the manager in question has admitted she knew about my problem since early May - when I asked her why she hadn't discussed it with me she told me the reason she hadn't was that I was cold and unapproachable and she was dreading doing my apprasial ! When I said she had nearly six months to do this she just said she had a steep learning curve as a new manager. I have documented all of this and sent to HR but have had no response - as I mentioned my son is ill and so I'm unable to go in and deal with all this. As I said I think they just want me to go away and resign !

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