How serious is falsifying notes in a hr file?

[Madamecastafiore]

Just wondering.

Long running dispute.

There are notes in my HR file that are lies.

Dated and signed mentioning my pregnancy and the fact that it had been known about for quite a while.

It's a moan about lateness amongst other things. I was stopping to vomit in lay by on way to work!

Problem is it's signed and dated February when I didn't get pregnant until March so pretty indisputable evidence that note was falsified. Typed and signed and dated much later.

Is this a serious offence?

How do you know this note is on your personnel file? If I found something like that on an employees personal record in my organisation I'd go ape shit. It should not be there - if you requested access to your file and it was complain and complain hard because the person who didn't ensure your file contained only what it should needs to be disciplined. Exceedingly poor practice for stuff like that to be on a file. anything like that should be in a separate file

I second what was said before: stick to your employer's complaints procedure as a tribunal will want to see that you have given your employer a chance to put things right. However, do bear in mind that there are strict deadlines for filing a case to an employment tribunal. Your employer will try and drag this out so set some deadlines for response and if they don't meet them, tough, move on to the next stage. Keep a log of everything but try not to get too bogged down in details when you explain your situation.
I'm not up to speed with the legal side but I seem to remember that there was a preliminary fact-finding procedure of some sort where you could ask questions on record. Not aware of details of your previous posts but this seems to all flow down from a complaint about race discrimination and get mixed up with your pregnancy, which links to sex discrimination.
So you need to get professional advice. If you are in a union, get them on board. If your local section is a bit useless, escalate it to the regional level. Phone ACAS. Phone the Equality and Human Rights Commission. Phone the Working Families helpline, they have some solicitors working there who are great.
Hope this helps.
Don't let the bastards grind you down.

Where does your organisation get its funding? A ministry or local government might be the Big Brother you need, to shame these people...?

Thanks chaps. Been trying to have a whole weekend without this hanging over me.

I think they are funded on a regional level but have already been told off for going to HR Manager so now think it wouldn't be a good idea just yet Plu. Although I will shout what has happened from the roof tops. I will write an article and try and have it published or start a blog or do something to show just how unfair the public sector is in some of its practices.

I have thought maybe I should go to the meeting to go through outcome if investigation and then hand the boss lady 3 letters asking for grievances to be raised in respect of some of the allegations in the report and the falsified file notes.

Do you think thus is the best idea.

Part of their outcomes was me needing to have some sort of back to work interview before going back to one if the 2 sites that the issues happened at. The very thought us making me cry. How could I go back to the places where these people have cooked all this up against me??

Wait, the boss lady is one of the people you think is involved in falsifying the notes? And you're going to ask her to handle a grievance about falsifying the notes?

NO NO NO!

I'm too tired to think straight at the moment, but you have to get your head outside this "trapped in the process" state of mind you're currently in. These people are, to put it crudely, the enemy.

If you are not getting external advice yet GET IT! Union rep, employment lawyer, whatever. You need your hand holding through this, and you're not getting detailed enough advice from this thread. This needs to be played very carefully and YOU NEED PROPER ADVICE.

It's fabulous that you want it shouted from the rooftops but you have to get through this stage cleanly first.

Look, these people are unscrupulous liars! Scare them with talk of publishing and you'll find yourself accused of something criminal and branded a self-serving disgruntled ex-employee.

Sorry to be yelling like this. But I've seen someone taken down by liars, and they never worked again.

This boss lady is one above the one who has thrown me under the bus.

I really can't think straight either. If it were not for DH and the kids I think I'd be jumping under the bus right now.

They will not answer any questions or even speak to me until after this meeting . If I go outside of the set down chain of command I am being verbally reprimanded (part of any back to work procedure is being talked through how to complain the right way using their system).

I've spoken to ACAS and they have said go to the meeting and see what they have to say.

It's the next step that I have no idea about.

I agree that you should take external, confidential advice (MN is not confidential). You can and should take that advisor into their meeting. It could be the best thing, to have a witness, and a legally savvy one at that, there. When I was a union member, I could have taken anyone I wanted into a meeting like that, and when it was a question of redundancy,.I did so.

You do need proper advice, though, as it could be best to keeo your mouth shut in such a meeting, to see what they "have" without revealing what you have; or it might mean you losing the chance to raise a grievance.

Have you got legal cover through house insurance, bank account, union membership?

I agree that you should take external, confidential advice (MN is not confidential). You can and should take that advisor into their meeting. It could be the best thing, to have a witness, and a legally savvy one at that, there. When I was a union member, I could have taken anyone I wanted into a meeting like that, and when it was a question of redundancy,.I did so.

You do need proper advice, though, as it could be best to keeo your mouth shut in such a meeting, to see what they "have" without revealing what you have; or it might mean you losing the chance to raise a grievance.

Have you got legal cover through house insurance, bank account, union membership?

Dh has some sort of advice thing through work. Employee assistance I think it is called.

I still can't get my head around all this cloak and dagger stuff and the fact that they will happily make stuff up and tell out and out lies.

Sorry to go back to sounding like such a feeble idiot but I met a friend today who used to work there and we talked about it and it brought all the horrid feelings back.

Dh has some sort of advice thing through work. Employee assistance I think it is called.

I still can't get my head around all this cloak and dagger stuff and the fact that they will happily make stuff up and tell out and out lies.

Sorry to go back to sounding like such a feeble idiot but I met a friend today who used to work there and we talked about it and it brought all the horrid feelings back.

Dh has some sort of advice thing through work. Employee assistance I think it is called.

I still can't get my head around all this cloak and dagger stuff and the fact that they will happily make stuff up and tell out and out lies.

Sorry to go back to sounding like such a feeble idiot but I met a friend today who used to work there and we talked about it and it brought all the horrid feelings back.

You're not a feeble idiot. It is incredibly difficult to deal with liars. Particularly when you don't know who is one, in league with one or more liars, or, indeed, another normal person bamboozled by lies. Your reaction is entirely normal, and so are you.

Thank you.

I do feel incredibly stupid though. I had no idea things like this happened or people did things like this.

It's not "being stupid" to have been treated properly (and, presumably, to have treated others properly, too!) thus far in your life.

Going to ring union this morning to see if they will help if I join now. Will also email one of the members of staff who was. The union rep and ask his advice.

Thanks for your support though, it's invaluable, am in a big hole at the moment and all my courage seems to have deserted me!

Going to ring union this morning to see if they will help if I join now. Will also email one of the members of staff who was. The union rep and ask his advice.

Thanks for your support though, it's invaluable, am in a big hole at the moment and all my courage seems to have deserted me!

Going to ring union this morning to see if they will help if I join now. Will also email one of the members of staff who was. The union rep and ask his advice.

Thanks for your support though, it's invaluable, am in a big hole at the moment and all my courage seems to have deserted me!

Do see what's available through your husband's Employee Assistance Programme - legal advice is one of the services offered through ours, and it can be for the employee's immediate family as well as themselves. I don't think all schemes are the same, but if you've got something like that available, use it.

Oh Madame, you're not stupid at all. As Plu says, you're the normal one! The nice one who has always treated others properly.

I remember all too well the horror and sheer disbelief when helping my friend. We spent ages in a sort of fug believing that if only we did what was right and told the truth, all would be well.

That's just not true when someone is maliciously working the system to get at you.

My friend did eventually get a big payout - when the employer made a prat of themselves in front of an Employment Tribunal.

The reason you need external advice is that you need to plot a route through this where you go through the employer's process correctly, cover all the bases re people who have misbehaved (eg it sounds like HR haven't covered themselves in glory), then take the correct action following your meeting - for which as Plu says you should absolutely have a witness, preferably taking notes for you so you're not relying on the employer's minutes.

The correct action could be to resign and claim constructive dismissal in front of an Employment Tribunal. Or it could be to make a complaint to some higher part of your organisation. That's why you need the professional advice - to make the right decision.

Oops, missed the most important bit:

GOOD LUCK!