Let go this week

[Sackedoff]

Hi,

Have been with my employer for less than 6 months. Part of a fairly large sales force. I have passed my probation period and my end of year consultation was full of positive feedback, I was described as a key member of the team for the coming year.
Approximately half of us were called to head office with no notice, it is a 5 hr drive for me.
When we got there we were told we were all being given a months notice and that we weren't being made redundant, but that the board has decided not to employ a direct Salesforce with immediate effect. The other half of the team were told today.

A number of us have been told that they would like us to now work for them on a self employed basis. Ie on a commission only structure.
They want me to run the exact same area with exactly the same targets but they will not be paying me a salary.
We have all been given a months notice, even the guys who have been there for years. In effect though we will only receive two weeks pay as the pay period starts on the 1st of each month.

So, in my position, would there be anything I could do to at least get paid to the end of the month giving me a full months salary.
Also, are they actually able to do this?

Am so upset and frightened for my future now. I am incredibly unlikely to get a new job anytime soon as it will look awful on my c.v and it's a crap time of year.

What does your contract say about notice?

You should be paid for your entire notice period, regardless of when the normal paydate is.

In terms of whether they can do this, in your case absolutely, you've only been there a very short time and they can dismiss you for no reason if they so choose.

For those who have been there longer, it sounds dodgy and depending on how this self-employed thing is going to work, it also sounds like an attempt to call something self-employment which in fact is not, and to avoid employment responsibilities and obligations. I would say a) they should be given the statutory notice period, b) if they are losing their job because the business has decided not to employ sales people that is a redundancy situation, and c) it may well not be a genuine redundancy situation if these people will effectively be employed anyway even though the business wants to call it self employment.

I would suggest you urge your colleagues who have more rights than you do to seek advice.

Something similar happened to me when I had been in a job for 11 months. My boss offered to pay me to the end of the month.

I requested a meeting with him and the HR Manager and fought it on the basis that they were in breach of contract (i.e. my obligation to them was to turn on time, do my job effectively, etc. Their obligation to me was to pay me and treat me fairly). I got three months money out of them (tax free). I walked into another job three weeks later.

If no one on here can advise from a legal stand point then ring ACAS. It all sounds very dodgy and unfair to me.

"If no one on here can advise from a legal stand point"

whereiseveryone, Flowery is MN's resident employment expert. She is perfectly able to advise "from a legal standpoint". Her advice above is perfect.

I can only imagine your employers were horrendously uninformed about employment law because your argument was specious and completely without foundation.

The thing about self-employment is that it is much more than simply the employer deciding that is how they want to play it. There are a number of tests.

One of the big tests is if you cant complete the task for whatever reason do you get someone else in or does the company. In this situation I would guess the company.

Basically if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

You are entitled to your full notice as Flowery states.

In your situation get your CV up to date. If a company is going down this route then I would have my doubts about the long term. Being cynical there is a good risk that they could fold owing you money.

BTW I bow entirely to Flowery's far superior employment law knowledge it is just that DH went on an Inland Revenue self-employment course and a 'self-employed' company driver got a shock!

You are entirely right Worry, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it's probably employment. A phrase I actually use frequently in exactly that scenario!

Perfectly fine to dismiss the OP but her colleagues definitely need some advice.

Thanks all, I appreciate the time you've taken to reply. I've been having a think and a google around self employment and I think your hunch that it's employment under another name so to speak is probably right. Sigh.
And it's fairly obvious the company is under financial stress, the md, fd and hr directors have all gone in the last few weeks.

This is so utterly shit though, I have zero chance of getting another job in my field for the same pay as this will look so bad on my cv.
The law is a fucker.

I've spoken to various colleagues and they are all going to go for the self employment option and accept the notice they have been given. Bonkers!

anyway, I'm off to drink bleach and rock in a corner.

Please dont drink bleach! You would be clean round the bend (boom, boom).

Dont assume that this is a disaster in career terms. Employers do understand that crap happens. Frame this properly:- current employer changing employment terms, taking the sad but sensible view that the terms on offer werent reasonable blah blah blah. So much more professional than clinging to the wreckage.

Sackedoff, don't panic, really - I would just mention that the sales department/force have been made redundant when approaching other employers (simplifying the situation for them, they won't care about the ins and the outs). You could briefly allude to it in your cover letter if you're worried about how just the bare dates will look on your CV.

But don't panic! First off, can you get a good reference backing up all your positive appraisals - is your ex-line manager/MD about to give you a written one if you think they may move on in the near future? Willing to give you their mobile number for the reference if they do move on to another company? It's worth playing nice with them even though you're justifiably angry - flies, honey etc.

Anyway, don't panic - you'll find something to keep the wolf from the door in the meantime. It's unutterably shit, but if the company's going under, maybe it's a blessing in disguise. I'd maybe suggest making a list of all of the temp agencies in your area and make a face to face appointment with each - agencies are shit in my experience unless you've actually gone in to speak to them.

Good luck!

What WorrySighWorry said!