Are contracts of employement worth the paper they are written on in small companies?

[MeAndMyBoy]

DH started a new job 8 mths ago. He is working as a Trainer and it involves a lot of travel. However, it is also involving a lot of time staying away from home. In the last 5 weeks he has had on average a day and a half of the weekend at home. This is the longest he's been away but since he started he has had some part of most weeks away from home. His contract states occasional days away from home. I don't feel that this counts as occasional - but how flexible do we have to be and how flexible is "occasional"?

I'm not sure but I'd love to know the answer! I'm currently on mat leave but I work in a similar capacity as part of a small team owned by a large company (charity). With a small team like mine, much is based on goodwill, ie when I was pregnant I was factored out of lots of travelling/overnight stays etc. We have a kind of 'pull together' when we need to attitude with the advantage that the rest of teh time we work at home (does he?) and so hours can (hopefully) be averaged over the week/month. His contract is still legally binding, however small teh company. He could look at the 'working hours directive' (EU) as he shouldn't be doing more than 48? a week and according to my company this does include travel (but according to my team we are expected to go on the train and read/use laptop!). The problem is that by doing these hours he is effectively accepting these conditions? The problem for the company is that he could sue them for stress etc I suppose? Sorry, no legal expert and no real answers!

I'm certainly not a legal wizz but I am the HR Manager of a company that sounds very much like your other-halfs new employers, so thought I'd give my side of the argument. We also employ 'trainers and consultants' so think the idea is the same.

For us, a 'Trainer' is someone who travels around the country conducting courses at client sites, so the travel element is essential. I always make a point of mentioning at the interview stage the large amount of travelling involved in the role and ask if that would consitute a problem. Now, most people say "no, that's fine" and take the job. When it comes down to the week-in-week-out travelling however - they don't like it and start 'mentioning' how much travelling they are doing and the hours they are putting in for the company. I fully understand that for the majority of people being away from home loads is not a great thing - but I do point out that extensive was always part of the job spec and they knew what they were taking on. That said, was it specifically mentioned at the interview stage or highlighted as an issue for him to consider?

The way I combat it as a problem within our company is to operate a very 'informal' (i.e I can stop it at any time...) yet monitored flexi time scheme. That way, I recognise the commitment people like your DP are making but do not alienate the remaining office based staff who are also 'doing their jobs'.............

If he has only been there a short while and likes all the other aspects of the job/company - I would advise treading carefully. It may well be that rather than jumping in with "the working time directive says......" (which I have to admit would piss me off, if he had known the hours at the outset) he is better placed to ask for an informal meeting with his boss to say "I have a young family and as much as I love the job and working here, is there anyway we can look at all the travelling I am doing to make my work life balance better?". That way, he comes across as keen and flexible but also good at communicating and working through problems. You never know, they may well say - sure what did you have in mind............

Plus, any employer would be a fool to ignore a request like that, given the recent publicity given to life balance and the hours employees in the UK work...........hope that helps.

Hi ladies thank you for your replies.

Runtus your point of view is really interesting thanks.

Yep that's the type of job he is doing. He is employed permenantly by the company, but we feel is being treated like a contractor, they at least have a choice about taking jobs or not though.

The travelling really isn't an issue - DH has done jobs before in a software installer/trainer capacity that involved travelling all over the UK so he doesn't have an problem at all with that.

The problem is the nights away from home. The travelling was stressed at interview - the nights away wasn't and he specifically asked as he didn't want to be away from home for weeks at a time. The contract states occasional nights away - which for me would suggest maybe 1 week in 4. He does get 'working from home' days and the company were very much, but we don't expect that you'll actually need to do anything on those days. Again this isn't how it's turned out, but not through anything that they could have forseen, they have taken on several new customers so DH needs to spend evenings and any days at home learning the new training material provided. Having said that since christmas - this friday is the first this year.

I feel that your approach makes a lot of sense and we do want to tread carefully and try and negoiate a better work/life balance rather than go in guns blazing as he does enjoy the job and it is something he really wants to do.

In that case it sounds like thay would probably be in favour of the informal approach to smooth things out. They sound very much like us, in that they have to react to the client needs and new clients always have needs!

Hopefully, they have already noticed the need for resources in the Training arena and may well be planning on recruiting more staff to it, in order to relieve the workload on your other half.

As I say, start the communication flowing and see how they react............hopefully they will respond positively and everyone will be happy.

I also work in HR. This kind of thing is not restricted to small companies at all, but arises through changing business. The best thing would be for DH to raise the problem but at the same time to suggest one or two possible solutions. That way he can be assertive and proactive.

Thanks for your advice - DH is going to make an appointment to go in to the office and talk to them to see what can be negotiated.

Any luck?

Hi They don't have a free slot until later on in the week so we'll have to wait for an appointment til then. Thanks for asking.

Little bit of an update, DH has got an appointment for 17th April to go and discuss things in a bit more detail. so fingers crossed for then and see what we can sort out :)

Oh good luck and let me know how he gets on!

Any news?

Hi just an update.

DH had made an appointment to go in and see his employers on monday - when he checked yesterday that the time was right and everything was ok, he was told that no the meeting had been cancelled as they have amended his schedule already and they hadn't moved offices as planned so would now wait until the office move was completed before seeing him.

Needless to say we are both fed up. DH was told if he has a problem make an appointment to go in and see them and they could discuss it - he made the appointment and then has it cancelled as they didn't feel it was necessary.

Hmm............I would raise that as an issue in it'e own right. If he has requested a meeting to discuss a specific issue he is not happy with, they are obliged to 1) meet with hin and 2) to inform him of any changes to that meeting in advance and in writing.If the situation were the other way round and they had called him to a meeting and he decided not to go - can you imagine the consequences?!

Got to the meeting and riase this as a complaint within it.

Hi Runtus - thank you for still looking at this :)

I can imagine the merry hell that would be played if the shoe had been on the other foot.

Yes he now needs to make a new appointment sooner than they are suggesting so that he can raise the existing issues and this as well.

I hadn't realised that there were such strict guidelines surrounding things like this, I'm not sure that the directors do either it is such a small company and they do have quite a slap dash approach to things.

Thanks again and I will update this again when there is some more info :)

No worries - glad to help if I can.

Most small companies don't realise that they have obligations to their staff and tend to dismiss requests and complaints out of hand if they deem them unimportnant. A lot of the time it is best to try and work with them rather than against them, if you want to keep a relaxed and civil working relationship but that doesn't mean you have to be walked over by them.

I would suggest putting any new request in writing and make sure that within it, you state that you require a new meeting as the last one was cancelled without warning, consultation or notice. Also, within it, ask for confirmation in writing of the new meeting date and time.That way, at least if it ever does go any further (and hopefully it won't) you have it as proof of what is happening and how he is being treated.

Hopefully, just by doing that they will realise he is not just going to go away and that they need to take this seriously. You would be surprised how often that makes people more 'receptive' to yuor comments.........

You do help, thank you again.

That's a good idea to put the request in writing and to ask for confirmation in writing too.

We'll try that and see how it goes.