Concerned about DH's employer's attitude to him being booked off work - stress related

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After months of struggling, DH has realised that he cannot go on as he is, and will be seeing a doctor tomorrow to talk about the stress that he is under and how badly it is affecting him. DH has been telling work for months that he is not coping well and now that he has made a number of expensive mistakes due to being so pressured, he has realised he needs time out. Work have not supported him properly, in DH's opinion.

I am concerned about work's attitude to DH needing time out. He has been employed for just under 2 years. Aside from constructive dismissal, is there anything else untoward that could happen?

DH really needs a break and needs it urgently. He has not been coping for months and it has eventually taken its toll on him. He phoned me in tears a few hours ago and is leaving work early today . (I have told DH not to worry about a thing and that we will get through this, so I hope he knows he has support at home.)

What could happen at work? His boss wants to see him for a meeting in 2 days' time to discuss this.

DH told me that he spoke to his line manager regarding seeing his GP - and the manager told him that he should probably not bother because he did not believe in it!
Also said that DH had last Saturday off, so why was he so stressed? DH works Mon to Fri and 3 out of 4 Saturdays. He leaves home at 6.30am and gets back 7.30pm. Plus Saturdays.

Any ideas please?

Does he work for a small business or do they have a HR dept or similar he could deal with? If not, I'd be tempted to go above this manager's head.

Does his contract specify such long hours?

Thinking short term, hopefully the GP signing him off will give him time to recuperate and feel more able to cope and get a strategy in place to resolve the issues he's facing.

Long term though he will need to come up with a solution. Could he go part time? Are the hours not as long as they seem, is it to do with a long commute so could you look to relocate or he could look for a job closer to home? Can he think of a solution to the issues that have caused the mistakes he made, you say he isn't supported - do others in the same role have these issues? If not, what is different about him and how can this be resolved eg further training?

His work should manage the sickness as they would any other, they are unable to fire him without a full disciplinary process being followed.

Speaking as someone who has seen this from a legal viewpoint quite a lot, I think the big issue is not what they think. It is what his long term plan is.

If he needs a couple of weeks to recuperate, he should take that. But what I see too often is the absence drifting onwards without anything being done to help either side. The employee is just signed off again and again, doesn't get better because they are stressing about work/returning to work and the employer gets annoyed because the length of absence gets substantial and it all gets acrimonious and ends in furious lawyer's letters and an exit payment.

I am so sorry he is having such a tough time. Obviously your role now is to make him take a break. But after that, it is to help him forward. Can he go back to this job- and if so, what support does he need? If not, an alternative plan can be very empowering. Please, for your sakes, don't let it drift. I see too many people who end up in legal action trapped reliving it for 12 months or more. I genuinely believe (however detrimental to my fees ) that legal action isn't normally the answer.

A big employer with a good HR department will be 100% more supportive if you can be engaged and proactive about what you need.

Hang in there.

Thanks so much for your replies! DH works for a subsidiary of a large company and he does have an HR department.

Relocating will be difficult and expensive for us and he has been talking for ages about looking for a job closer to home which I will encourage him to do. I think it is a combination of the long commute plus the pressure that is getting to him. He is very very tired.

Other people in his position at other branches of the company are going through the same or similar. He told me that a colleague had a real breakdown at work and was found crying .... DH did that at work, yesterday, too.

I don't think he has contacted HR at all, though he says that his line manager is looking at reducing his hours so at least he could get home earlier in the evenings. He has a 10 hour day without a proper break for lunch because he is alone at his branch.

Youllaugh, it is highly unlikely that DH would let this drift along, but I can see your point. I have said that he should probably have a few days of doing nothing, just taking a break and then we can talk about where to from here. He is too dedicated and too proud just to crumple up and not keep going. So ti is unlikely that this will just go on and on.

Thanks again for the replies.

Your plan sounds like a great one.

When I said that things sometimes drift, I didn't mean it as a criticism of the person who is sick and stressed. When you are ill you are not your normal self IYSWIM and often people find it hard to see a way forward if they don't have outside help. It sounds like your DH might have recognised the issues while he still has the strength to deal with it - that is enormously helpful for all of you.

I hope it all works out. Maybe a job closer to home is the answer like you say?

You've had really spot-on advice here from the others.

All the research in the area of stress has shown that on average stress levels will get right back to old levels within 10 days of returning to work (if the workplace source of the stress), and that applies no matter how much time is taken off. He clearly needs a break and you need to use that time to work out what needs to be different - once you have a plan he can then decide (possibly in discussion with employers) if he will be able to execute such a plan within current job or not.

YoullLaugh, when I replied about "drifting" I wondered if what I said would have been seen as criticism of people being in that situation! I realise you were not being negative about it and I certainly did not mean that DH is better than that! Rather, that his character would probably mean that he did not land up in that situation.

StillSquiffy, thanks for that info regarding the recurring stress once back at work. We must and we will work out a plan to sort this. We have had all sorts of shit happen (both had a parent die, DH had a business that failed, I miscarried last year etc etc... and we managed to stumble through all of that so we will get through this, too).

My dh had a stress breakdown earlt last year after a series of total crapness, but mostlt due to work. His boss was absolutely awful about it, and I ended up calling the HR dept (dh too distressed). Boss got a complete and utter bollocking, and no longer works for the company.
DH had 9 months off, and hr were great at helping him back to work where he's had no problems since

a 10 hour day 5 days a week, as well as 3 out of 4 saturdays does sound like very long hours even without a commute added in. I'm not up on UK law, but isn't there a EU directive on not working longer than a 48 hour week, and are there not rules about breaktimes that need to be observed (probably UK rather than EU law there)?

Do you have any kind of labour inspectorate or similar kind of body checking on these things in hte UK? And if so, could your DH contact them about his working hours being excessive (as it sounds like a problem in other cases too)? That the whole company would be looked at?

Sorry if that doesn't help, I don't know enough of UK issues as they differ to here.

CMOTDibbler, that's really sounds promising, hearing that your DH had such a good result. My husband today, after seeing the doctor, told me that he feels guilty about being off work, but I reminded him about how often he has asked for help, how often he has said doing so many Saturdays were too hard on him and how many times he had been told that plans were being made to get him an assistant.

BiddyPop, some employment contracts - as far as I know - have an opt out clause so that the employee can opt out of that EU directive regarding not working longer than 48 hrs a week. And there ARE rules about break times having to be observed, but DH is alone in his depot and would have to switch off the phone and shut up shop if he wanted even half an hour to have a sandwich.

He is torn between trying keep his job and trying to keep sane. I don't know about any inspectorate here, and I am not sure if the HR dept could help. Will see what his boss says tomorrow over lunch.

I think we understood each other and both worried we had offended the other .

It sounds like your husband's employer really needs him and will be rather stuffed if he leaves? If there has been talk about getting him an assistant this absence might be just the leverage he needs to give them a kick up the arse to do that. If he can, he should get clear commitments from them whilst he is off.

Also, when he is ready to go back, bear in mind that his doctor can write him a 'fit note'. This is basically a note which says 'MrRoom is fit to go back to work if you do X and Y". So, for example, the note could say he is fit to go back, but still needs to rest so shouldn't be working more than five days a week, to be reviewed again in one month. With a supportive doctor that can be a really effective option. It gets him back (and paid if their sick pay is poor) whilst limiting the strain he is under. And if they know they need an assistant then having to choose between having MrRoom five days or not at all (because if they don't do what the note says he is still signed off) should motivate them!

Is there an Occupational Health dept? (Although in my cynical experience they may not be much help...)

Thanks for the info re "Fit notes". I had heard of them but did not know what they entailed.

TheSilverPussyCat, I don't know if there is an Occupational Health Dept. Not sure DH would know either!

Update: DH did not get a call from his boss today to meet for lunch - when DH called him to say he had been booked off for two weeks, boss said he had been to busy for him to ring DH: boss is running DH's depot! Hopefully this will mean he gets the opportunity to see what Dh means.

A fit note is merely what used to be called a sick note. Now the GP is supposed to put what you can do - in your case, your DH cannot work at the moment. It is all part of the governmental attitude that work is some sort of cure all, when in fact people these days are under huge stress at work.

It will do DH's boss the power of good to see what DH has to cope with.

I'd disagree with sick notes and fit notes being the same.
Sick notes were either OK to be at work or not decision.
Fit notes allow the Dr to say what you can do. So previously if you were a forklift driver who broke their leg, you weren't fit to be at work. Now you can get a note that says you can be at work, but not drive. ie your not fit to do your normal job, but if there is an appropriate desk job to do for a few weeks, you can work.

There is more info here

Hope some time off is helping your DH.

Well, I said that a note saying you couldn't work was now called a fit note. And I mentioned the bit about the Dr saying what you can do on a fit note, if appropriate.

Which is also what it says on your link.

I do hope there is no company protocol about ringing employees when they are off sick - this happened in my case (stress) and I just felt all the worse.