Probable refusal to consider flexible working- advice v appreciated.

[Sk77]

Hi,
I write re the above. I was the first Female ever to be employed at the privately owned firm I work for. I have been there for 2 years now and raised issue re my working a 4 day week with 3 days in the office & one day from home- confirming I would have full office facilities and child are arranged for that day at home.
The company have no HR and I am dealing with one of the co-owners re maternity matters.
Trying to arrange maternity cover for my clients (I am an insurance broker and new business producer) has proven to be awkward. They want me to do over the 10 kit days to handle my renewals and have (finally and grudgingly) agreed to take a first jobber who will be overseen by one of my colleagues to handle the day by day enquiries that may arise. My point here being they are c,early not concerned about covering my prescence formally with a qualified replacement for the 9 months I have said I will be off.
As I receive no maternity other than smp, their wage bill will be considerably lower whilst I am not working.
I have agreed to do more kit days, to be contactable at home, to travel after 4 months in Europe (not over night) , to work from blackberry (unpaid) after 6 months, have taken scan days as holiday and not had any absence at all and yet they have not even considered my request for a 4 day week formally.
The co owner spoke to my colleague about my request (in the middle of the office) and said they probably won't be agreeing as they "dont want to set a precedent".
This is despite the fact that 4 male members of staff (was 5 but1 has just retired) are part time ( due to retirement approaching).
They have not researched any of my maternity rights- I have done it all myself and provided them with the info
They clearly haven't bothered to even formally look in to my flexi request or they would know has to be one of 8 formal reasons, damage to business etc and relayedto me in writing following correct (& confidential?) process
I downloaded template re formal flexi request on hearing they were likely to decline. The reasons I gave for why it would not affect the business in detrimental fashion are:

1. I am responsible for my own budget
2. I do not need to be in the office to do my job
3. no other staff member would be impacted upon by my hours
4. I do not manage others & I manage myself
5. my salary would be pro rata'd

I would very much appreciate views here re next steps. Does my case sound positive? The last thing I want to do is cause division by discussing legal advice but equally want to be taken seriously.
Any advice will be gratefully received

Many thanks
Sarah

They sound like antediluvian twunts!

However this is a tricky situation. It would seem that you have an excellent case for flexible working, and have the law on your side. That's all well and good, but I would assume that you want to keep your post rather than win a tribunal? I would write your formal request and flag up the positives for them (reduced salary costs / your willingness to be flexible as far as you can). If (when?) they refuse you need to challenge them on their reasons, and meet with them to press your case.

If they are as arsey as they seem, your only recourse may be legal - and if they back down at that point you may well have a tricky working relationship with them in the future, that may not ultimately be sustainable. I'm not saying you need to put up and shut up - far from it, but on reflection you may find yourself in a no win situation, and perhaps ultimately you need to plan to move on tyo a more family friendly employer once you've re-established your working routine on your return from ML.

good luck!

If I was you I would stick to the law over your maternity rights - is it even legal for you to do extra KIT days? Will that mean you are commiting some kind of fraud if ou are getting SMP? Take the time off for antenatal appointments that you are entitled to.

I think you need to consider if you want to continue working for a company that is treating you like shit.

Thanks for your reply. You're right that I do want to keep my post and also don't know likelihood of finding a family friendly employer after I go back to work. Very galling as had thought I'd done my home work enough (ie existing part time, others work from home but in Singapore) to think I'd be ok. Seems not.
They're not so much arsey but very very old school, all white ex public school boys and had been since 1999 when they set up the co.
Think might have to get half an hour free legal somewhere!

Thanks again

Thanks Rita, I need to research implications re kit, I had not thought from that angle. I do feel very exposed to issues such as these where I'm not au fair with the law myself and have no HR there to help me.

Do you have a union?

No I don't, I do not believe they have them for insurance brokers, but again should look in to as not 100% certain of that. Wish I did do tho! It's proving to be very stressfule dealing with this from an uneducated perspective.

Maybe try Maternity Action for advice then.

My advice is this:

1. Stick to the letter of the law regarding maternity leave. By taking more than 10 KIT days and continuing to claim SMP not only are the company breaking the law but you would be committing fraud. As soon as you go over 10 days (and a day is any day where you do work. Even just replying to a few emails) your maternity leave ends and your right to SMP does too.

1. Do not take holiday for antenatal appointments. You have a legal right to reasonable time off. The more you collude in them breaking the law the more vulnerable your position becomes.

1. Politely write to them including the details of how to manage a flexible working request and point out there are time limits and legal processes to follow and include the relevant legislation (Business Link or DirectGov). I would highlight the relevant bit.

1. Let them worry about your cover when you are off. By all means be helpful and do a good handover but when you are on maternity leave you are off and it's their problem to manage - not yours.

Give them info from Business Link www.businesslink.gov.uk. I would use their links because they are written for the employer.

It sounds like it's about time they got some proper HR help. They don't necessarily need to employ someone to do this. They could use an independent consultant or an HR firm who specialise in doing HR for small businesses. PM me if you want me to point you in the right direction. The cost of buying in such help will be saved many times over by getting things right in the first place. A good consultant will also advise on how to help the business achieve its key objectives.

I can't do links at the mo - am on phone - but if you need specific links say and I'll look them up.

Btw HR are not there to help you - they are there to help the employer. Admittedly the best way to help the employer is to have everything done by the book and legal with happy, well motivated employees.

Forgot to ask, when did you make your request for flexible working?

I made my request in writing (but didn't date doc) on Wednesday and then after hearing news looked unlikely I downloaded template from mums net to do formally. I do worry that as my role is based largely in my ability to generate income, that if I let my accounts be handledn incorrectly I could lose them and this would then affect my role. This is partly my dilemma and has allowed me to more malleable I suppose which isn't good.

I feel for you. I have been in a somewhat similar position in that my application for flexible working was refused and I have had to fight for it (and my employer is in the public sector with an HR department). The reason I have had to fight is in part due to my not knowing enough about how to approach the situation.

I think that you might be able to get advice from ACAS - at least have a look on their web pages.

Seems to me that your employer is being intransigent because it cannot think outside the box.

Thanks so much for all your help. As suspected on Monday we had a 5 min sit down. He said they don't want to meet my request. The reasons given in writing (and no examples given at sit down) were as follows:

1)we feel this would lead to additional cost to cover work
2) we feel that existing staff would need to cover her work when not in office
3) we feel it would have a detrimental impact on her ability to achieve her budget targets and on her performance overall.

My initial thoughts are:

1. I'm a broker so am out of the office and at client meetings regularly- I have a blackberry and mob so for 4 days (inc one at home) I don't see difference as I'm not in a supporting role
2. the cost comment is invalid as I would ensure all clients/underwriters could call me whilst off if need be- a colleague would have to take one message- or send one email- which when you compare to my £126 daily net rate doesn't stack up 3 I find so subjective it's ridiculous. Do I not have right to say well no actually it would not and to request trial to prove such?
3. I would offer to work 5 days ad hoc if needed and always be contactable for "emergencies"
4. emergencies would be absolutely minimal as work flow always well managed and has never happened before- its insurance not mission critical

I'm going to chat to Uncas. They have said in minutes of meeting they would consider flexible commuting hours on a 5 day basis but I do not know what is proposed in same way they have not given examples in reasons to decline.
Any help gratefully received. Thanks so much

S

Agree with KatieMiddleton. By doing more kit days, going away in business and such like you are Working and your mat leave ends. I am also wondering why you made your flex working request before you have even gone on leave? They might have been more likely to consider it when you're been off 9 months and they want you back

I wanted to know where I stood tbh, If I needed to arrange child care for 5 days and there's up to a year waiting list for nursey spaces, im not in a position to leave it to the last minute. we have no people to help us so that's where we are,,
I'm also naturally very organised (perhaps too much so) but that's me and I could not have relaxed not knowing.

Could you try going back on five days, prove to them that you are just as good as before baby (they night be nervous ? Unsure? Of how you will cope, although obviously legally could never say that)
If you are in the role and doing it well they might then consider your requests?
Just a thought?

Sorry a nightmare position for you, when it's obvious from here that it would work.
Good luck

Thanks so much for your thoughts. I spoke to Acas. I cam cite them not investigating it correctly as part of appeal as they haven't given any actual tangible explanations re costs incurred etc, ESP if own salary drops too.
After that I'll see where we are. As we have no family to help its become a point of principle that don't want to have baby in nursery for 5 days unless I see their (as they have to be) valid reasons. That's fair then and currently it's just IMO laziness & looking for reason not to set precedent. In that instance if that was upheld I'd move employer out of principle. Before I felt strongly I wished to stay but have changed opinion of them over the handling of this.
Btw- pls don't jump on this thread saying they have right to decline, I know this- I question the legitimacy of their reasons

Sounds as though you probably have grounds to make an appeal worthwhile, but unless you have a tangible offer from somewhere on the hours you do want to work, I'd probably advise avoiding making a decision on 'principle' just because you are cross about their handling of this.

You say that if you felt they had given valid reasons you would consider putting your child in nursery for 5 days, so it's not as if you are definitely completely against doing that at any cost.

You've got plenty of time before you need to make a decision anyway, and surely it's best to do what's right for you and your family given the options available to you when you come to deciding rather than what could end up being effectively cutting your nose off to spite your face to make a point.

Plenty of time until you need to decide anyway.