Promotion with a Pay Cut?

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Hi all, I'm a regular but have name changed for this. I could do with some advice and hand holding!

Background... I've been working for a relatively big private sector company (~1000 staff) for four years. Two years ago I was promoted to a senior for the position I started on. The department I was in was eligible for a bonus scheme of an amount per quarter, as long as set targets were achieved. The bonus has always been achieved and my stats the highest in the team.

Six months ago, in the interests of progressing, I secured a secondment into a different team for a more advanced job. In doing so I ceased to be eligible for the bonus for the time frame of the secondment, however I tolerated this as I was optimistic at the end of the six months when I'd proved my capability, I would be promoted into the new department with a payrise.

The six months have ended, the new department are desperate to keep me (I am pretty good at what I do) and have offered me a promotion with a new title...but no salary change and no bonus scheme, which means my payslip gets smaller. I have argued this with them, but they are just giving me 'management waffle'.

Their argument is that their staff budget is empty for the year. However they assure me they are in the process of sorting out pay bands, and would appraise my salary in line with that. These pay bands were meant to be introduced last month, then next April, now next summer. They won't confirm whether my salary will change, or which direction it might move if it did.

I'm sure without proof (culture of not discussing salaries...) that I was being fractionally underpaid in my previous position, reaching woefully underpaid for the new position, by a laughable amount. From looking at similar roles with different companies, my pay should be at least 20% higher than what it is!

I'm willing to start looking around if I have to, but I do enjoy my job and the company (till now) has been good to work for. If we can just iron out this problem, I'd prefer to stay. However I refuse to be taken advantage of!

Those in the know, do I have a leg to stand on here to involve HR (I don't think they have any idea what's happening at present) or argue my position from a legal point of view? Not sure whether it helps or hinders or is a non-issue that I'm in a male dominated area, with a ratio of approximately 20:2 men to women.

Use your experience to update your cv and start applying elsewhere. You have nothing to lose. In the meantime I'd stay at your old department and then apply to the new one whe.
n internal vacancies come up, if you roll over at this point they'll treat you badly forever.

You have a choice - new role and no bonus or back to old role with bonus - those are the terms. I don't see why ou would go to HR. It's entirely your choice.

'Fractionally underpaid' compared to who?

Sounds like a fairly straightforward choice to me. Either refuse the new position and go back to your old department with access to the bonus, or accept the position on the basis that you trust them to review favourably later, or say you're doing the first thing in the hope that they are desperate enough to keep you to sort something out.

You can speak to HR about anything you like but I can't imagine this decision is something they have much say over.

You mention the male dominated thing - if you take the new role and become aware that men doing the same role are paid more, then you could consider making a complaint about that but it doesn't really give you much in terms of bargaining power at the moment really.

'Fractionally underpaid' compared to colleagues of the same age/experience doing the same or lesser job as I was but seemingly earning more - as calculated following a discussion prompted by someone else about the value of student loan repayments people had.

'Woefully underpaid' compared salary offer to the job advert I found on a recruitement agency's website that I strongly believe (but can't prove) is for my firm, for people they're trying to hire for the very job I've just been offered. Which is the 20% difference in salary.

Other adverts, for similar jobs, for my level of knowledge and experience, were also suggesting salaries that is 20% higher than my current one.

Unfortunately, with the whole "Don't talk/ask about salaries" culture, it is difficult if not impossible to get proof of any inequalities in pay. :(

Thanks for all your inputs regarding HR, I wasn't sure whether they could/would do anything. Sounds like I'll be sorting my CV out tonight!

Salaries that are... Not salaries that is! Doh.

You can certainly adverts for similar jobs to assist negotiations and demonstrate market rates - you may have already done that - but ultimately it's going to depend on whether they literally have the extra money you want and how desperate they are to keep you.

If you refuse to take the promotion on the basis they've offered it and move back to your substantive role (while looking elsewhere if that's what you want to do) it will be up to your new department to decide whether they are happy to lose you on that basis or not.

I can imagine the management waffle they are using

As hairy says, and probably your work, it boils down to which is more important money in your pocket or the new role. There is nothing wrong with either answer, or wanting both its just that it doesn't always work out like that.

Why not apply for the advertised job through the recruitment agency? If it is for your company you can go back to them and query it. If not and you are offered the job you can either move companies or use it as a bargaining chip with your existing company