Is it reasonable to NOT pay a cleaner cash?

[katymac]

I want to pay the cleaner either through PAYE, or for her to invioce me or for me to pay by chq.

This is because I need to puit the cost through my books as an expense.

The lady who is going to clean for me has asked for cash in hand.

Am i being unreasonable? (don't you love these threads)

Katymac - I wasn't saying you should. Only that if you use an agency the fees are higher to reflect the fact that most agencies charge VAT.

Even if you did it through the books on a PAYE basis then you are responsible for paying for the tax and NI, as your cleaners charge will be based on the net amount.

If this cleaner doesn't want to give you a receipt then you will have to find someone who will.

Uh oh, the morality belt has come out. Here we go . . .

You could still pay her in cash through your business though, surely?
I think most cleaners work cash in hand. Mine prefers a cheque. She doesn't earn enough to pay tax.

And indeed if we are getting into a discussion of the black economy, in all likelihood she is not likely to be worried about not declaring her earnings to the tax man, but rather losing her benefits.

The receipt will be proof that she is working and could be used in a fraud case against her!

I wasn't meaning cash - money, I was meaning cash in hand

I don't have a problem with cash money - but I need it to be "visible" so receipts would work (if she agrees)

I think you assume that the benefit system is more joined up than it is, a receipt should be ok

Well, you asked 'Am I being unreasonable?'

IME, yes. If it's just one of these stand alone, one-person operations, I've never known it to be anything other than cash in hand - no receipts or that. Like hiring a babysitter for a night out or paying some fella who knocks on your door to cut the grass in your front green.

People had sound advice, find an agency and they're more likely to be willing to work w/you on receipts, etc. You've put it to the lady you wanted to employ and she wasn't interested.

Katymac

I pay my cleaner thru PAYE, unless she earns more than 4600 per year (in total declared earnings) she'll not be liable for tax, and less than 400 per month means there is no N.I. liability either.

BUT of course it will cause your cleaner a problem if she is also claiming benefits. I must admit I wouldn't pay someone anyway if I knew they were claiming benefits and not declaring earnings. I think most benefits now allow some work (up to 12 hours p.w.?) without benefits being affected (not an expert on benefits tho').

or file it without a receipt under miscellaneous expenses, you are allowed a certain amount without receipts

she's def talking benefit fraud - I doubt she'd actually pay tax under paye would she?

and I don't blame you really. I'm not an anti-benefit fraud nut, but as you say it will cost you in extra tax.

i think if you knowingly pay someone who is committing fraud you company can be fined - its not worth it.

i know as a housing association we can be fined for accepting dodgy rent payments

Is your cleaner coming in once a week or several times a week? As we don't have to produce receipts for anything under £10, can't you just put through that amount every now and again during a week?

The prisoner - you are a genius....

Thanks everyone

Katymac - get her to sign a P46 and keep it safe with your books and records. This is a form you can get from the tax office which she signs and ticks the relevant box to say she's not working anywhere else, and, as long as she's not earning over the tax and NI thresholds each week then you can put it through your books as "cleaning" and as she's under the thresholds you won't have to submit any end of year paye returns for her. So unless your investigated the tax office will never know who she is. So then it's up to her if she tell them she's earning or not. But I agree with you. If you're in business you need to be able to claim for all the expenses you can. If she won't sign find someone else.

oh my goodness do you ladies have cleaners,in my dreams!

Us childminders are just rolling in money ... we have cleaners, gardeners, maids, cooks, personal slaves ...

my 1st choice would be a driver!

Truth is, I get all the minded children to blitz my house from top to bottom, get all the ironing done, prepare dinner for my family, etc., but the younger ones can be so slow! They're pretty adept at peeling grapes now.

notasheep - my cleaner is called me. even if I could afford it I'd be too ashamed to leave the house messy and clean up before they came so it'd be a bit pointless really

i know someone who does that, cleans before the cleaner gets there, personally i dotn understand!!!!

crazy isn't it....when we go on holiday my mum sneaks round to clean up! it's really embarrasing, so last time we spent 3 days scrubbing the house before we went so that she couldn't do it. Hearts in the right place bless her but I wish she wouldn't do it - she has now been told and has promised faithfully it won't happen again.

She has refused to do it unless I pay cash in hand

So I'll find someone else

pfer me too