Self-employed - client wants to put me on payroll - any experiences?

[Rosebud05]

As the title says, am self-employed as sole trader. Have agreed large piece of work for client, invoiced in advance as they requested, they're now saying that because the work is training and I'll be working more than 3 days over 3 consecutive months, they can't pay me unless they put me on the payroll etc. I personally think they've misinterpreted the HMRC guidelines but as they're a local authority, they're unlikely to let a bit of common sense get in the way of their red tape!

It is legally okay to be employed for a bit? I know it's a hassle with my finances, but that's sort-out-able, yes?

Any experience or opinions greatly welcomed.

There is nothing to stop you being employed and self-employed at the same time.

Does the LA have a 'no moonlightiing' clause in the employment contract - that could get awkward.

Thanks. The piece of work I'm doing for them is a lot over a couple of months (hence the requirement) when I'm not doing any work for anyone else, so there won't be 'moonlighting' involved although.

agree with West MidsAccounts
no reason why you cannot be both 'self employed' and 'employed'
also agree with your comments on local authorities - i 'had to be employed' by them when i was actually a casual sportscoach working on an 'as and when' basis. just go along with them they like to wear their jobsworth caps as it saves them thinking for themselves

As long as they are paying your NI at the time for the bit you are being paid for I think its ok. This is the bit hmrc get sniffy about under IR35

kitbit> its nothing to do with IR35, that only applies when you are working through your own limited company (instead of as a sole trader) basically as a contractor for usually one client.

It's not a hassle at all you just get your P60 from them at the end of the tax year and fill in the employment pages of your tax return simple. I am self employed as vet and work around 4 days per month for AHVLA (government).
I suspect as they are determining the hours of the training at that it has to be you in particular that is why they feel you need to be employed. As HMRC state that to be self employed two of the criteria are that you should be able to set your own hours and substitute someone else to do the work.

Morph, I am a sole trader, my accountant was adamant that IR35 applies to me too, I contract and have been working for a sole client for a period due to circumstances, it's the same as the potential to avoid paying NI etc is the same?

... then kitbit perhaps your accountant is not very good at explaining things, because IR35 does not apply to the self employed. HMRC have always had the power to challenge a contract between an organisation and a self employed person and say that the contract is a contract of employment (a 'contract of service') rather than a contract for services, and so PAYE applies.

But a company (or a partnership) cannot be an employee and cannot be brought within PAYE, so HMRC wanted new powers to collect more tax and NI (although they cannot collect employers NI in this way) from people who provide services through a company - this is what has become known as IR35. More information about what it is is provided by HMRC. Many firms offer advice specific to those who may be caught by IR35, but I am not going to plug any of them here: if you are interested the Professional Contractors Group might be a good place to start.

I am looking into employing some people at the moment.

You might want to look here at the DirectGov website to see what thay say about Understanding Your Employment Status.

There is a list of factors that determine whether you are defined as as:

? employee
? worker
? self-employed

I suspect it is these rules that are causing the issue. I have done work as an employee and freelance and through a Limited company all at the same time. It really depends largely on whether you are self supervised and whether you have regular hours and whther you work exclusively for one employer.