Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Work

Chat with other users about all things related to working life on our Work forum.

Flip

Original poster

not the full deal - what would you do?

25 replies

JenJam · 10/10/2005 12:40

hi, am just looking for a bit of advice. i have a very nice, but also quite shrewd, employer who has said 'take as long as you like with your new baby' have double the statutory pay for the 20 weeks...i.e. 90% for 6 weeks as is usual, followed by 20 weeks at £206.

I asked about holiday entitlement and was told that i wasn't entitled to accrue holiday while I am on maternity leave, only when i am actually working so my 4 weeks a year would be pro-rata'd to 2 weeks (assuming i take only 6 months off).

should i put them straight on the fact that i do have a right to accrue holiday while on maternity leave, given that they have been generous in giving me an extra £100 per week for 20 weeks on top of the statutory.

we're a small company....

on the one hand i think i should fight for my corner, but then again, perhaps I should just 'let it go' given their generosity this far.

am i being greedy??

OP posts:

QueenVictoria · 10/10/2005 12:44

Its a toughie - you DO accrue holiday whilst on mat leave but they are being quite generous apparently with you mat pay. Dont really know which i would go for. Make sure they put anything like that in writing though!

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 12:46

thanks for replying Qvictoria. but what to do....? some people take their 'rights very seriously' and i would too if i was in a big faceless company, but being in a small company makes it diffficult. on teh other hand i am sort of pissed off that i didn't get a payrise either this year which i would have definately expected, had i not been pregnant. and i let that one slide as well. i suppose i feel a bit of a pushover

OP posts:

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 12:46

OP posts:

BlondeinLondon · 10/10/2005 12:48

no you are not being greedy
put them straight!

LIZS · 10/10/2005 12:53

Agree you should accrue the holiday. Guess it depends what that is worth to you as to whether you risk losing the "extra" money or want to press for the holiday (or pay in lieu) . May also depend on when during the holiday calendar you would return - is it feasible to take the days you accrue plus those you earn by working in the remainder of the financial year ? You could opt to extend your maternity leave by those extra days accrued instead, so delaying your return date.

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 12:53

you see my dilemma?

OP posts:

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 12:56

LIZ, the 'extra' almost exactly cancels out what i would be owed if i pushed for holiday entitlement. so i guess i am not short of anything, but it's not the 'hugely generous' package that they think they are giving me...if you get my drift. it's all about the emotional side of things. they think they are being very generous and feel good about themselves, when in actual fact they are delivering the minimum requirements
what would you do liz?

OP posts:

crunchie · 10/10/2005 12:57

I would say something 'carefully' Along the lines of thanks so much for the additional pay, but I wanted to check he holiday situation properly. Suggest that someone 'told' you that you accrue holiday when on Mat leave, and you wanted to check whether it was true or not. Hoped they could look into the legal side for you

LIZS · 10/10/2005 12:57

Definitely do see your dilemma. Are you certain you will return ? They could put a caveat on the extra money so that you'd have to pay some or all of it back if you don't go back at all or only return for a few weeks, or even try to change your hours, in which case if you don't state your entitlement now you'd potentially lose out both ways should you not go back on the same basis.

LIZS · 10/10/2005 13:00

posts crossed. btw I took the extra money, the holiday pay and didn't return in the end (took a career break and faded into oblivion) but it was a faceless large company !

Roobie · 10/10/2005 13:05

I think you should point out that you are contractually entitled to all the annual leave that you accrue during maternity leave - it seems a bit dodgy from your employers point of view to mess about with your statutory rights like this as they would potentially be open to action from you. I would inform them of their mistake and leave it up to them - if they subsequently backtrack on their original offer it will not make them look good. You can always take your accrued leave at the end of your maternity leave so you start getting paid in full again before you go back to work.

sweetheart · 10/10/2005 13:11

I would decide which would be of most benefit to you if you couldn't have both. Then speak to your boss and say that you know you DO accrue holiday whilst on maternity leave. If he says they can no longer give you the extra money but you would rather have the money than the holiday perhaps you can negotiate this.

This is what I have done - I have agreed to give up my right to accrue holiday as my boss is going to pay me half my salary for 6 months and I would much rather have extra money whilst I'm off than extra holiday when I return to work.

goldenoldie · 10/10/2005 13:25

JenJam - I don't think that paying you an extra £100 a week for 20 weeks is very generous, and it is your legal right to accrue holiday pay while on ML. Not giving you an (expected) payrise either. What are they playing at?

Are you sure they want you to go back? Sounds like you are being edged out to me?

How long have you been working there? Maybe it is time to move on?

Guard · 10/10/2005 13:26

Although it's a small company try to get in writing the whole policy - ie pay, holiday, entitlement if/when you return, what happens to other benefits you might be getting (eg health insurance/pension etc), when you can leave, how long you can have off etc. Most companies would give above the minimum pay due to new laws (came in 2004 I think when mothers were given the right to a full 52 weeks off) and you are still entitled to holiday etc. My concern would be if you agree not to take the holiday (ie move away from the normal model) where would that end ?

QueenVictoria · 10/10/2005 13:28

You ought to have got a payrise - i believe thats classed as discrimination.

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 13:29

crunchie, did what you suggest-their have counter response . sent it to the bosses of the company and worded it in a friendly / casual way ...something like this "would like to take 6 months ordinary maternty leave and believe that while i'm off i'm entitled to usual benefits as per everyone else in company; payrise, bonus, holiday pay" and the reply 'think I am right in my belief that if you have maternity leave
in a year, your holiday entitlement would be reduced pro-rata. So for this
financial, your holiday entitlement will be about half of what it would be
if you were not big and preg and about to have half a year maternity LEAVE.' I think the use of capitals is deliberate!!
it's a minefield this whole thing. part of me wants to just not get embroiled in any of it. accept that small companies can't afford to do big company things and the militant me wants to fight for all that I am entitled to. anyway i'm v interested to hear points of view on this either way; will log on again later and see where the balance lies. really must get dressed (this is my first day of maternity leave and i'm still in my dressing gown) it's simply too much of a novelty - imagine not being at work, not being on holiday and not being off sick! it's going to take sometime getting used to!

OP posts:

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 13:32

wow. took so long writing that last post that i was suprirsed to see so many responses. thanks. HELLO GOLDEN OLDIE!! what are you doing over here! how are you getting on with the twins?

OP posts:

LIZS · 10/10/2005 13:37

Can you speak to the Maternity Alliance - sounds as though they will get arsy so you need some solid info to back up what you are asking for. If they get difficult about this I think you should press the holdiay issue as if you go back after 6 months and they make life similarly awkward, you could lose out all round. Hadn't realised you had already started your ML - is there a reason why this is discussion is ongoing ?

Original poster

JenJam · 10/10/2005 13:41

you are ALL RIGHT. i read sweethearts message and thought yes that's probably 'fair enough' and then i got to goldenoldies post and thought 'yes! i was due a payrise and I rolled over because i'm not going to be working and i can always renegotiate when i get back.....

I've been with them for 4 years. i would say that they have been good to me, largely because they let me take a years sabbatical to travel in 2001; I have worked bloody hard for them (including lots of hours over and above trhe normal), in return they pay me well and they are FLEXIBLE....

suppose you really have to weigh it all up..

anyhow really must get out of this dressing gown. i am beginning to feel like a slob!!

think what i will do is talk to our payroll lady and ask her to them straight on the facts; (hmmm conflict avoidance strategy); then give it a day or two and reply myself probably saying something like i am legally entitled to holiday, but holiday and extra £100 per week amount to almost the same thing so i won't be losing out; just won't be as 'well off' as I thought. then leave the ball in their court to decide whether they want to revise their 'deal' or not.

does that sound like a sensible plan

as for getting them to write it all down...hmm they are not that sort of company, it took me 3 years to get a formal contract out of them! they are not like the average employer...

OP posts:

crunchie · 10/10/2005 14:14

You could counteract their response where they said
'think I am right in my belief that if you have maternity leave
in a year, your holiday entitlement would be reduced pro-rata. So for this
financial, your holiday entitlement will be about half of what it would be
if you were not big and preg and about to have half a year maternity LEAVE.'

Unfortuneatly you are wrong in your belief about holiday entiltlement, that legally I do accrue holiday etc etc

However in your shoes I would be half tempted to let it lie, if they are being flexible for you, and you want to continue with them (and their fleibility will mean an enormous amount once you have the baby) then I would weigh it all up and probably not rock the boat. I mean 2 additional weeks holiday when you have had 6 months off is not ABSOLUTELY necessary, but £100 a week extra will help hugely.

Tortington · 10/10/2005 14:15

take the mat leave then tell them your entitled to the holidays too.

they are making a profit - they are your employer - bollocks to them.

they should know what they are talking about instead of being fuckwits

LIZS · 10/10/2005 14:19

tbh I think your "reply" gives them a a bit too much leeway. If they want to offer you the Statutory Minimum and give you the holiday or the financially equivalent extra maternity pay, fair enough but don't see why they should be allowed to dress it up as financially more generous than it really is. If having the money up front (assuming no strings attached) is important to you then by all means take it but restate that you know you are legally entitled to holiday. MA will help you put this more formally if you contact them.

goldenoldie · 10/10/2005 14:34

Hi JenJam - did you get NCT classes sorted?

Prufrock · 10/10/2005 14:38

And be aware that they are only allowed to take back anything above SMP that they pay you (if you don't go back) if they expressely state in a written contract taht they will do so.

Original poster

JenJam · 11/10/2005 06:07

Spent most of afternoon and evening cleaning skirting boards and painting ceiling and having an internal dialogue with myself about the work issue. Thanks everyone for your helpful comments/perspectives. Have decided to raise it first with payroll person and then drop a 'friendly' email (DP's advice - he's seen how stroppy I can get) to inform my employer on what's what. the maternity alliance do leaflets, so thought I would order one of these and sendit to him along with my note saying I am entitled to X and Y. BUT I am not going to make any threatening demands though....given that he has offered the equivalent in 'extra' cash, but will just let him know that I count this as holiday pay that I am entitled too, rather than a generous renumeration package from the company

Then I want to forget about it and get on with enjoying this new experience.

although have to say that it leaves me feeling a bit uneasy, as what lies beneath this issue is an attitude that I'm 'a financial burden' to the workplace/employer (I am the first person, in my type of job at my company, to go on maternity leave and i think it has shocked them)....yes I know, it is a very unusual place!! or perhpas they just seem to attract/recruit childless people!!

Anyhow, must get back to bed as i woke up far too early today.

OP posts:

Flip

Swipe left for the next trending thread