Dh just been made redundant for 2nd time in 18 months. Would really appreciate some advice from MNers in Senior Management-type roles!

[wilbur]

Title says it all really. Dh lost his job in July 2009 and was out of work for 7 months. Started a new job in March, at a start up company (although backed by a much larger company so it looked good on paper) for less money working a 9-day fortnight. Backing company has now got cold feet about teething problems and has binned the whole enterprise (very short-sighted of them, but that's another thread). Dh has work until early Feb. He is sort of bottom rung of senior management (almost director level but not quite) in a retail-related field.

I woud really like to hear from people in senior business roles about how they think he might go about getting a good new role. If anyone has the time to answer or comment on a few questions, I would truly appreciate it:

1. He has had a number of interviews for the next step up from his current role or bigger version of it over the past 3 years. Most times he gets to the last two people and then doesn't get it. My instinct is that he doesn't interview very well for senior roles - is it worth him looking at interview coaching? Do those kind of personal development schemes work at all?

1. How should he present the move to the start up and the salary cut? Do you look at people who have taken a pay cut in order to get a job as less valuable? Does it affect their long-term salary increases (ie we know this guy will work for peanuts so let's pay him that)? Please be honest.

1. What are businesses looking for in a CV at this level? Should he have one of those mission statement things at the top - "Dynamic senior manager blah blah...".

It's frustrating becasue he has a great CV with several, very successful long-term jobs at great companies and he is very good at his job with fantastic retail instinct (all his bosses say so). He just struggles at putting himself forward and presenting himself as a business person.

Any thoughts?

bumping hopefully

are there any recruitment agencies which specialise in his field? DH has found those of more use than anything when job hunting

What networking has he done? The vast majority of jobs are never advertised. If he doesn't interview well, making use of personal contacts may help bridge the initial hurdle.

It's not a very "British" thing to do: but he should write a list of all the contacts he has and draft a letter to them, not asking for a job, but asking them for some pointers are usggestions as to where his talents may be best suited. Follow the letters up with a phone call or an invitation to meet for a coffee. If they don;'t have anything themsleves, they may know of someone who does.

What prettybird says.

I would happily meet with someone in my field who was jobhunting, if I knew them (or even if I didn't) - so although it is teethclenching, he should be aware that everybody knows what goes around comes around, and should be glad to help him.

Is he on Linkedin? My dh says that it is very useful for networking. He also used on of those posh recruiting companies (cost a foooooortune but not all of them do) to get his last job.

I would definitely recommend interview training. My dh said that it was worth the fee for this help - they taped him and let him watch it back (perhaps you could interview him at home - 'twould be cheaper).

I'd meant to mention LinkedIn.

Make sure he takes time to put to put on a well-structured profile (and puts on his photo) - and he should also contact some of his contacts who are on LinkedIn for recommendations.

I know recruitment consultants use LinkedIn: I got an interview a couple of years ago via LinkedIn for a job which wasn't advertised externally.

He's on LinkedIn and I think has started to make contact with some of his past colleagues on that, so I will prod him to do that. he has had a couple of headhunter approaches through linkedin so I will make sure his profile looks good.

Thank you maktaitai and prettybird for saying he should network more - he did have an introduction a year ago to a v senior guy in his field but didn't follow it up as he "hates that stuff". It's hard for me to convince him about business protocol (I just sit in a small room typing for my work and have not been in an office environment for a long time) so it's good to hear it from someone else.

Any comments about interview technique? Can it be learned once you're at a senior level and no longer a school leaver?

Ooh, sorry groovygretel - didn't see your comment about interview coaching - who did your husband use? I don't think we could do it at home - both far, far too self-conscious!

If you suggest to him that he's not asking them for jobs - he asking them for pointers as to where to look and who he should be contacting. That way, he doesn't feel that he's being pushy.

But make him ask for recommendations from those poeple you've said have laready said that he's good.

Some additional & alternative thoughts

If he and other senior people were convinced about the start-up business - could they try it for themselves (without the support of a larger company providing finance).

Agree with networking.

Look at self employment in general. The higher the climb on the career ladder the fewer the roles and the greater the politics. The level DH has reached already is perhaps the hardest one to keep and make progress from - there are always cheaper and younger competitors.

Not sure of DH's age but my experience in retailing and retail related supply was that many people reach a plateau as early as late 20's and certainly by early / mid 30's. It is not a negative reflection of them - just a reality of the sector.

Perhaps (and especially in the current climate) a change of career path or relocation may be necessary.

If his cv gets him interviews but ultimately he is unsuccessful - it may be worth e-mailing a member of the interview panel and asking for advice and guidance on what they saw as the positives & weaknesses of his interview - this may give him guidance on whether he can do anything to improve his skill set or presentation style. Not everyone will reply but some do (i always try to), but be aware that the interviewer(s) may be very circumspect in their answers to avoid any potential comebacks / discrimination claims.

Get him to do a SWOT analysis of himself, also carry out the same exercise on the market sector he is seeking employment plus other areas of employment that his skills may be applicable. It is possible that this will identify opportunities or may identify why he needs to change direction seek additional skills / training / experience.

Whilst he is not working (assuming he cannot get a new position by February) seek any opportunity to add to his skills / education (I did management courses with the OU) - even if they are not relevant to career -they say something about him.

Also seek voluntary work (assuming this does not affect any benefits etc) where he can apply his work / management / mentoring skills to keep his hand in and again this shows something to any prospective employer.

Good Luck to DH

Thankyou, PB and iamnotreallysure! Yes, the senior team did discuss buying out a licence from the backing company, but it was v complicated and expensive (the start up was a new direction for an already established and lucrative brand). So no dice there, sadly.

I will definitely see if he can get more specific interview feedback.

Interesting about OU courses - when he was made redundant last time, we discussed an MBA, but they are so expensive and time-consuming. I will look and see if there are individual OU courses that might help him.

Off to Google SWOT analysis!

Is he still in touch with old colleagues - DH got his current job via an old boss.

1. If he is getting through the recruitment rounds to the last couple of people then issue prob not quite as bad as you think. Would suggest using senior recruitment agencies for mock interviews and getting feedback. Interview coaching will always help, if only to challenge him to think about higher level strategic stuff that everyone wants. Be very targetted about companies when he goes in - they want to hear about how his skills will add value to their company, so he has to sound like theirs is the best thing ever

1. Be very upfront and confident about the job (i.e. not ashamed). Great unique opportunity to be involved in something from the beginning, to make my mark etc. Always the potential for it to take off. Say why he liked the industry/product If salary comes up, then something along the lines of - always a challenge for these companies to match the larger packages, but prepared to accept that because of the poential, and also in recognition of the salary, they offered flexibility and a 9 day fortnight. Use the economy as the reason for it going bust - most start ups do so won't be a great deal of stigma attached.

1. Yes probably to mission statement, but lots of agencies will recut CV anyway. Use recruitment agents and ask for CV advice from them. Find the specialists in his area, buy any industry magazines and look at the adverts in these to see who targets that market. Use linked in, and link into recruitment advisors you contact, as that will be one of the best ways to stay in touch. Link up to all former colleagues he can remember. Once he has the network as large as possible post a status update saying .... seeking new career challenge from March in xxx - interested in hearing of any opportunities. Linked in is v low hassle form of networking

Don't panic, he is in work at the moment so can spend some time setting all this up. It is a tough market out there - he may have to take a sideways step or contract in a business first rather than getting his ideal role straight off, but these can be a great way in

Saw your comment

he did have an introduction a year ago to a v senior guy in his field but didn't follow it up as he "hates that stuff"

This is sadly an huge part of the level he is at / and seeking.

Totally understand (and share) his feelings but did come to realise that you either do it or change direction - my experience says that in most companies senior people are not necessarily better at their job - they are just better at the 'relationship'.

Thank you lovely MNers - really appreciate you taking the time to help.

lisacol - that's a great help re thinking about strategic stuff at a higher level, and abouthow to present the current job in a positive light.

Agree with the others. He has to do the networking, go for a coffee stuff if he wants a job at this sort of level.

Mission statement stuff is useful, but it has to be tangible and specific. I delivered, I led, I increased by x%.

Also the Aprrentice is a lesson in how not to do it . I personally wouldn't recommend an MBA anymore, but OU do some good managment training. New media etc. is very useful.

I would also start being very realsitic about salary and benefits. I am seeing more people looking at taking 20-40% salary drops. There are a lot of people out there. Contracting is well worth considering.

Ha ha - yes, the Apprentice - thankfully he's not going out there saying "Wilbur's DH - The Brand".

I totally agree with the others above.

I took redundancy last year, and spent quite a lot of time updating my Linkedin network, updating my profile to state I was looking for work, listing my main skills and experience. Although not in retail, I was contacted by a lot of headhunters and agencies, went and met as many of them as possible to get my name out there as looking for work. I also got in touch with ex-colleagues, let them know I was looking for work and through one of them, was offered a contract role, which has since turned permanent.

Contracting can be a good way of broadening experience, and proving to a company your worth, and may help if he finds interviews hard?

I hope he finds another role very soon.

Thank you fiorentina - it's great to hear about alternative ways of getting a permanent post.

O darling - so sorry to hear this. Drop me an email for a solidarity drink? MIx

MI!! Hello darling girl - will email you.