Is this sex discrimination / unlawful withholding of earnings?

[TheYearOfTheCat]

I would be grateful for views on a situation I have at work.

I work in a large male dominated public sector organisation (c13500 employees), and work part-time hours. There are not that many part-time workers (about 50), and all of them are women.

Our annual leave policy is that pt workers are entitled to an annual leave allowance on a pro rata basis. It turns out that one of the PT workers has been taking the full AL allowance.

Our organisation has now said that every pt worker must submit details of all annual leave taken over the last 7 years.

Additionally, and on what should be an unrelated issue, the PT workers have recently successfully argued that an allowance which was paid to FT workers, should have been paid to PT workers as well. The back pay from this equates to between £4500 and £10000 per individual.

We received an e-mail last week that said that all PT personnel had to complete a spreadsheet providing details of leave, and that failure to do so would result in non-payment of this allowance we are entitled to.

I really, really object to the organisation's stance on this, for a number of reasons;

My integrity is being questioned, and leave records to be scrutinised purely because I am a pt worker. All pt workers are female.

If there had been a discrepancy in the annual leave of a FT employee, the organisation would not then ask all FT workers (predominantly male) to submit their leave records for scrutiny.

The back payment of the allowance is an entirely separate issue, yet they are attempting to force compliance by withholding the payment. This seems like unlawful deductions from earnings.

Whilst I am completely certain that all my leave records are beyond reproach, I really resent the message that the organisation is sending out to the rest of the employees - i.e. that we are all feckless, who diddle our leave. We already work in an extremely hostile environment, in which perceptions are that PT workers are not especially committed, and to my mind, this exercise only goes to reinforce these perceptions.

I would appreciate any views. I am thinking of submitting a grievance about the issue.

wow. They've fecked up and seem to be blaming someone else. Even if they get a list of the days you've taken off are their processes strong enough to say you were or were not in.

Personally I'd seek legal advice and just tell them you've never taken a holiday ever.

It does seem a very strange way of doing this? Was the payment related to holiday?

I think you need to drop the "it's becuase were women stance" though. Just becuase all the pt workers are women (unless you work in HR how do you know this?) doesn't make it automatic sex discrimination. Now if there was a pt worker who was male and was exempt then....

The payment is not related to holiday at all - it is for completely unrelated matter.

I know that all the PT workers are women because we were all on the e-mail distribution list.

I think part of the reason I am bristling is that this one individual was obviously mismanaged, yet instead of focusing on management practices, completely scrupulous people are being investigated.

Yes, they are being idiotic.

But, speaking as someone who works part time, you will do yourselves no favours making this a 'man/woman/sex discrimination' thing. I think you should go back and complain that it is unreasonable to ask all part time employees to provide such records just becuase of an issue with one employee. I would frame it that the implication is that all pt'ers are dishonest, not mentioning that you are all female. What about people who joined part way through a year? Do they have to provide records in case they got too much holiday too.

I'd simply not be able to do this. I don't keep my own holiday records past the current year. Do you?

RibenaBerry, good point about people joining half way through the leave year. You are right, of course, about not referring to the female aspect, although ours is an amazingly sexist organisation - there is a tendency to get sensitised to it.

I do in fact have all my leave records, going back 17 years. However there is no policy in place which requires people to retain leave records beyond the current year, so I may just 'mislay' them.

Yes they are being daft. Is it not more usual for annual leave records to be kept by the organisation rather than the individual anyway? I can't imagine I would have remotely be in a position to provide this information when I was working in house. Particularly in such a huge organisation surely they are kept on an internal HR system of some kind?

Ridiculous request, but I agree that claiming discrimination isn't the way to go.

speak to ACAS
they will suggest the best way to approach this for the best result.
large organisations are VERY wary of getting bad press about discrimination against minority employees
part time not women BTW

Get your Union involved.

Having never worked in a workplace that recognised unions and never been a member of one, ACAS are a less confrontational starting point IMHO

Do you not have to submit leave requests or get leave authorised in some way? I too work part-time in the public sector and if you adjust your hours up or down you always receive confirmation of your leave (in hours per year). Surely if your organisation has a concern about leave, everyone - full and part-time - should have their leave sheets checked.

Think you should contact your trade union rep about this and the payment of the allowance (btw is it an allowance related to attendance?)

We keep our own leave records, but need to submit them to line management for authorisation. Our area admin then make a record of the absence, then return the leave record to the individual.

At the start of each leave year, the line manager signs off on the annual leave entitlement.

The allowance is for a completely unrelated matter.

Given the advice I have received here, I think I will e-mail stating I no longer have the records, and will not therefore be able to provide the information. I can confirm though that all leave entitlement has been taken on a pro rata basis, as per the policy, and authorised through the appropriate channels. I may (helpfully) ask if our legal advisor has been consulted on the legality of witholding payment of the unrelated allowance, as it could leave the organisation vulnerable to allegations of unlawful deduction of earnings and possible legal action (my role is one in which we regularly consult the legal advisor, so it is not an unusual suggestion to make). Then finish off by saying I understand that this issue arose as a result of discrepancies in the records of one individual, however it is disappointing to note that the subsequent investigation of all pt workers' leave records implies that all pt workers are suspected of impropriety regarding annual leave.

What do you think?

Then finish off by saying I understand that this issue arose as a result of discrepancies in the records of one individual, however it is disappointing to note that the subsequent investigation of all pt workers' leave records implies that all pt workers are suspected of impropriety regarding annual leave

Personally I'd save that for the second letter....

in such matters less is always more
BUT
a swift phone call to ACAS would still be worth it in case they can quote the piece of legislation to have for quoting if needs be

Good luck and keep us posted

Thanks TalkinPeace - have since spoken to ACAS, and they have advised that this would appear to be a threat of unlawful deduction of earnings.

The most ironic thing about this situation, is that I am of a grade (as are several other of my pt colleagues) that we do not get paid for any additional hours we do beyond our contracted hours. An audit was conducted last year into the actual hours that people in our grades worked (as opposed to the hours we are paid) and most people were working at least 25% more than the hours we are paid for.

A colleague was approached by her HR bod to query her AL hours (which were totally correct), and I believe the HR person couldn't wait to leave, as 1 1/2 hours later my colleague had managed to demonstrate that in fact she was owed leave, not the other way round.

Tee hee.
That is the way to go.

I never used to get overtime either.
I remember at an appraisal having the managing partner admit that they billed me out for 56 weeks a year - not bad considering I managed to take holidays in there somewhere.

It will pan out fine :-)

Well I have sent my e-mail off, complaining about this.

I spoke to my staff association, who were aware of the issue, and had been advised that the rationale for withholding the payment (which should have been paid in July) was in case any discrepancies came to light from the investigation regarding annual leave. Apparently it was to save us the hassle of having to pay back any overpayment when instead they could deduct it from the payment due .

So in fact, they have been withholding it for our own good.

Quite apart from the fact that this illustrates their assumption that pt workers are dishonest.

Sorry, it's still me, with a new name.

Make a request that it is paid before Christmas.

If it was due in July, a request for interest at the same as you pay on the overdrafts you have while its not been paid could focus minds......

Good luck and well done