Suspended over allegation, but not sure whats going on

[halia]

Hope someone can help me here.

2 weeks ago I went into work only to be called aside by my boss and told that I was being suspended because there had been an allegation against me that I had been drunk in work hours.

I defended myself briefly at the time, stating that this wasn't the case but I was in shock tbh. I was sent home straight away and given a letter saying it would take no more than 5 days to investigate this. I wasn't allowed to talk to anyone from work while the investigation was taking place. I know this is normal and I did my best to deal with the "are you OK" queries I got from work colleagues who are also friends.

I sent my boss an email to update him on my workload as I have clients and I wanted to ensure that no-one turned up for an apt when I wasn't there. I did ask if I could send a vetted 'out of office' type email so that people would be told I was off on 'family emergancy' but my boss didn't answer that question.
I also asked for copies of work policies which I have still not received.

The following monday I got a phone call from my boss asking me to come in for a meeting to discuss the result of the investigation.

I offered to go that afternoon but he said tuesday.

At the meeting (which was just me and him) he barraged me with questions, about all kinds of things, he kept firing questions at me, at one point he asked 4 or 5 questions in a row then barked at me when I didn't answer straight away.

He also made ANOTHER accusation that I had gone into the workplace one day when i had been forbidden from going in.
I replied that I had only been in on the day he said I could to pick up my gym kit and that I had been seen by 3 other staff members. He says he saw me on CCTV on another day - but the day/time he said I was at my sons school.

Anyway I got out of the meeting not sure what was happening, he said I still couldn't talk to anyone and took my keys off me. He said he had to talk to someone in HR and then he would get back to me the next day (weds)

I didn't hear anything at all for the rest of that week, I sent 2 emails. One was an updated workload list the second was an email asking (again) for copies of disciplinary policies & procedures and written confirmation of the allegations.

Today I got a very brief email sent at 5pm, saying that he had tried to call me - but he hadn't rung me at home so he must have used my work mobile number which I had agreed to turn off so I COULDN'T be contacted by clients or colleagues.
It didn't say anything except to call him on his mobile.

I'm really confused and worried, I dont' want to talk to him without anyone there again, or to do a phone call because of the way he intimidated me when I saw him last.

Help?

(oh I don't have a union and I've been told I can't talk to HR because they are supporting him btw)

You can talk to HR! You are also entitled to be accompanied by a work colleague. Go to the ACAS website or phone them for advice. There are procedures that should be followed. Get someone to accompany you to the next meeting (legal right) and ask for the meeting to be minuted.

is it OK to reply to him by email rather than ringing his mobile?

I really really don't feel confident about talking to him without anyone else present after the way he was in the meeting last week.

Didn't want you to go unanswered. Hope one of the experts will be along soon.

Was your conversation written down. This is common practice in my work and usually done by another person in serious cases. Also, not sure about first investigative meeting but you should be allowed an accompanying person at any subsequent meetings.

If I were you I would try to keep a record of all communication so if you do phone write it down.

Good luck. He sounds like a peach!

He seemed to be taking notes but I didn't see a copy of them and there wasn't anyone else there.

This is why I dont want to ring him as he has asked but email instead. tbh right now this is getting to me so much I think I'd run a risk of bursting into tears on the phone.

(I honestly loved my job until this happened - I was doing well hitting my targets or exceeding them and got glowing testimonials from clients. This is a new boss and I'm starting to feel that he just doesn't want me around so I'm going to get fired no matter what I say or do)

Call HR. He should have offered you the right to be accompanied. You should also sign and agree any minutes. Have you been interviewed? Has he told you the allegations & evidence? Keep a record of any contact you have with him.

How long have you been there halia?

Who told you you couldn't speak to HR? Your manager? Ignore. Ring someone from HR, explain what's happened, then follow up with an email outlining everything that's happened.

Speak to HR first and see what they say, before you ring him or anything.

If it's the kind of place to have discplinary procedures and an HR department it sounds as though he's gone a bit 'off-piste' as I'm sure he isn't following whatever procedure there is, which is why it's crucial you speak to someone in HR - they may well be unaware of a lot of what he's doing.

If he sacks you and you've been there more than a year, it doesn't sound fair as a dismissal. If you've been there less than a year there's not a lot you can do about it, but either way you should speak to HR. I imagine they will reign him in a bit and organise a proper meeting with you being allowed to be accompanied by a colleague.

Also, HR are not on any side! They are there to ensure processes are followed and that people are treated in a fair and equitable way. He is talking out of his arse!

He is not treating you fairly. If he is taking notes then he should only be noting what has been discussed and then it is good practise for you to have a look through these notes and sign to say that you agree with how you have been represented.

He sounds like a bully. Speak to HR, if they are honestly siding with him advise that you would like a witness to accompany you to any further meetings as you feel you are being harassed.

If in doubt about anything tell them you would like to speak to ACAS before proceeding. It's not unusual so they shouldn't be surprised.

I started there september 30th last year.

re HR: I work for a small charity which doesn't have HR but we are 'loosly' aligned with the national organisation. I didn't even know that we could use HR from national until this started.

I can't ring them cos i don't have any contact details. When I emailed and asked him for contact for HR he said he 'could' give me the details but their advice would be strictly limited because they were supporting him, and then he promptly failed to give me the contact details and went on at length about how I wasn't to talk to anyone about this. I asked again for the contact details and he hasn't replied.

He did say if it went to disciplinary I could be accompanied but I'm only allowed to take a work colleague or union rep, we dont' have a union and I am banned from talking to any work colleagues.

At the moment I'd just like to know what's going on, he hasn't told me what the result of the investigation is, or whether its actually still ongoing. I'm assuming I'm still suspended on full pay because he told me I can't go into work and i havn't been fired..... but I don't know.

Call ACAS first thing in the morning. Please! You are not bring treated fairly! Ask for HR details by email and all contact to be by email so you have evidence of how he is treating you. You have the right to be accompanied at ALL meetings. Good luck x

You need to make very careful notes now with as many dates and times as you can remember and in as much detail as possible about what has happened to you so far. The questions, the way your boss behaved. Get copies of all your appraisals if you can. Keep all emails.

Record every detail of what is hapening. You will need it in a Tribunal.

Your boss must treat you fairly and if he does not then you will win any case that you bring if he has breached any procedure.

The HR department will be no use to you as they wil be supportng your boss. The only use they will be is as a repository of official letters you send asking for inforation about the investigation and the allegations against you. You should send that formal letter - as a record that you do not know what is happening or why you have been suspended. If they dont reply that will look very bad. You may also wish to make reference in that letter to the behaviour of your boss and the fact you have had glowing appraisal so far before he arrived. Keep strictly to facts though - leave out any emotion.

ROFL at the only use of HR being as a repository of letters

I don't think anyone here can comment on how useful this particular HR department might be, and unless and until Halia speaks to someone there we also don't know to what extent they are supporting her boss or not. Given his actions thus far it's entirely likely they are at least partially in ignorance, which is why it's important to contact them directly, rather than just write them off as useless.

Halia if he won't give you contact details for someone in HR proceed without them. Ring the main switchboard number of the national organisation and ask to be put through to HR, then explain to whoever you speak to who you are and what it relates to and ask to speak to the relevant person. You don't need to wait for your boss to give you permission or contact details yourself.

re being accompanied, you don't actually have the right to be accompanied at all meetings - an investigatory meeting doesn't attract that right, but a disciplinary hearing or other meeting that might result in a warning or similar action does. So he's right on that.

To be quite honest Halia it sounds like this man is making up his own rules as he goes along.

Even if, in a very unlikely situation, HR were supporting him- this doesn't mean that you should not be allowed to contact them!

It would be reasonable for him to ask for you not to discuss this with your colleagues as often this can lead to arguments etc. But to not talk to anyone about it is rubbish.

You are entitled to speak to HR, however loosely aligned with them you are. Thus, he absolutely has to provide you with the details you have requested. I would suggest that you put this request in writing or an email to him and keep a copy of it in case he reneges on this.

If you are only allowed to take a witness in for a 'disciplinary' meeting then what on earth are the meetings that you have already attended? Warning meetings with regards to a future disciplinary? If that is the case then in my experience you would still be allowed a HR rep, Union rep or colleague if you wish.

I would demand a copy of your disciplinary procedure in writing as per above as well- again....as there doesn't really appear to be any procedure being followed!

Make him aware that you are aware of your rights and do not be scared of him.

With regards to pay this is something that you should have had given to you in writing at your last meeting with regards to any suspension. Or at the very least they should have discussed it and then sent it to you in writing.

There is no 'entitlement' to speak to HR, but if he blankly refuses to give you details that obviously doesn't look great in terms of the employer acting reasonably. But just go ahead without them, really, you don't need his permission to make a phone call.

It does sound like he's making it up as he goes along so you need to make sure you speak to HR, find out what disciplinary procedure applies to you (ie does your small charity have it's own or is there a universal one) so you can work out where it's not being followed, and get what's happening on the radar of a few more people.

Dont be under any illusion.

HR are not there to help you. They are there to protect the organisation. They will provide you with infomation and tell you your rights but they wil not provide any other assistance in dealing with your boss.

They are not on your side and it is a huge mistake that many employees make to believe HR will help them when facing unfair treatment form a boss - they will not. Their job is to stop you suing the organsiation/firm and if you do to minimise the cost.

Please do go and look at the ACAS website. There are strict regulations about disciplinary procedures that employers must follow. Your boss either doesn't care or doesn't have a clue.

I hope it doesn't end in an industrial tribunal but your boss making up his own procedures will not do your employer any favours if it does.

"HR are not there to help you. They are there to protect the organisation"

Yes absolutely they work for the organisation but if an employee is suffering unfair treatment protecting the organisation would also frequently involve helping the employee by preventing or improving the unfair treatment.

Easiest way for HR to protect an organisation from legal action is by preventing managers from behaving like this in the first place, which is why it's important to contact them - if they are even remotely competent they will at least sort out his procedural errors and ensure halia is treated fairly and according to the disciplinary procedure in future.

Do you have a legal helpline with your home contents insurance or your bank, Barclays offer one for example.
I was fired about 6 years ago, actually not totally unreasonably but a correctly worded solicitors letter got me £3,000 go away money, my commission basically.
Worth taking advice because it does sound like he is trying to build a case against you even if there isn't one.

Ok sent an email this morning saying that I got his email. I reminded him that I had turned my work moby off and therefore if he emailed me that would ensure I received it.

I also asked (again) for copies of the policies/ procedures, written confirmation of the allegation and current status of investigation, and the contact details for HR.

And all this cctv proof that you were in the building when in fact you were not. You poor thing. Sounds a complete nightmare. Any one person who could be behind this?

BeenBeta - it sounds like you have had a bad experience with HR! They are there to protect the organisation but there is no way they would want to have a rogue manager opening up possible tribunal cases. These are expensive to defend and don't do the Company's reputation any good!

I've attached the link to the ACAS guide for disciplinaries & grievances. A tribunal will take this code into account and can increase any award by 25% for any unreasonable failure to comply with the code.

www.acas.org.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=1043

Good luck.

What an extraordinary story!

They should not have suspended you unless it was for a disciplinary reason. You can only do that in cases of gross misconduct. I am not sure that being drunk in working hours would constitute gross misconduct anyway. If it is just misconduct, organisations have to go through a series of warnings: verbal warning and then 1st written warning, 2nd written warning before considering firing anyone.

The meeting between your boss and you following your suspension was irregular. It should have been a formal meeting including HR and someone of your choice to support you.

As to advice, I do not know your financial situation or the status of the job but I would either go directly to an employment lawyer and get them to write a very aggressive letter on your behalf or do it via your union.

Larry - I think being drunk in work hours would probably count as gross misconduct in most organisations, but OP has said the claim is completely untrue and the manager has no proof of it. His behaviour after making the allegation is just bizarre.

The meeting sounds like it was more a fact finding meeting so do not have the right to be accompanied. Though the manager's bullying conduct is completely unreasonable as is his failure to provide minutes of the meeting. Any meeting which can directly result in disciplinary action does carry the right to be accompanied.

By the way, OP, if you are called to a disciplinary hearing you have the right to contact colleagues to arrange for one of them to accompany you. It would be illegal for your manager to forbid this contact.

Just noticed from your OP that the meeting is today. Have you arranged for someone to accompany you?

Good luck and don't let him bully you.