Career break-step forward in maternity rights

[growingweeble]

Six months ago I had a baby and am struggling with what to do when my maternity leave ends.

I am a highly qualified professional in a niche area and have a job I love. There is no other employer in the local area (or country come to that) who I would want to work for as much. Bottom line is I don't want to lose my job.

I should add that my job is very much based on reputation. A significant time out and I'll find it much harder to get the same job again, even though my skills will still be there.

I am realising that I don't want to put my DD is childcare before she is about 3yo. This is partly because of research that suggests it's damaging to place kids in childcare before then, but mostly because it feels the right.

I also know I want another child.

Financially we'll cope if I don't work for a few years.

I've been thinking that in an ideal world I would take a career break for 5 years and have another child in that time. But I thought that was too much to ask for so hadn't actually thought I should approach my boss. But the more I think about it, the better it is, not just for me but also them.

Mat cover is always tricky as 12 mths is not easy for the replacement or the employer. The individual only just gets to grips with the job and they're off. Surely a 5 year contract would be better for everyone.

If I don't get a career break I will be using my legal right to mat leave again in the nearish future. I hate the idea of going to work pregnant again and knowing I'm inconveniencing everyone.

My mat cover will be looking for another job in the interim while i go back to work in the interim, and of course my dd will be in childcare rather than being looked after by her mum.

I'd be happy to be very flexible about going back and could give an 18 month period say to see if someone in the team left and I could slot into their post. But if no one left then I would be entitled to my job back.

I could also 'volunteer' say 15 days a year to keep my hand in.

Not sure about pension contributions. I'd like those maintained.

I personally feel that there needs to be some sort of legal support to enable women in my position to do this. It's good for society that kids are looked after by their mums (usually) and it would protect women's careers. I'm also not convinced that it's tougher on business than the current mat leave system.

But, what do you think? Worth askingfor? Risks with doing so? Things I need to consider from employers perspective and my own?

Thanks.

Honestly, I think you are totally out of step with the pressures of being an employer. Now, of course, I don't know your particular employer, but most would struggle enormously to guarantee someone their job back in a niche field in five years. If it is niche, I would have thought two weeks a year is also way to low to keep your skill base up.

Also, what about the poor maternity 'cover'. You really think that five years in a job and then being turfed out for a career break returner is a good deal for them? You say you'd wait until an opening came up for a while, but otherwise are entitled to the job. So that person is meant to invest all that time, develop that niche skill, build relationships, all on the shaky footing that you'll be back to take it all off them?

People like M&S can do long career breaks because, at a store level, they need masses of staff in relatively few posts (store assistant, store manager, etc) and so stand a good chance of slotting people back in. That isn't the case in most non-retail environments.

And, you might want to rephrase your comment about childcare being damaging to children. Bad childcare is damaging to children. That is a world away from good childcare. The people responding to these posts on this board almost all have children and work, or plan to, so you are alienating the very people you want to help you.

Sorry if that's blunt, but I think sometimes it's best to hear it straight. If I was advising your company, I'd tell them it would be foolhardy to agree your request.

Everything Ribena said, plus the following:

"if no one left then I would be entitled to my job back."

Seriously? After five years off?

I think the comment from all my clients to me if someone requested what you're thinking of would be 'am I allowed to say no?', rather than 'should I say yes?'. But even if one of them was minded to agree a career break, my advice would be not to guarantee anything at the end of it. In a policy or letter I'd put something like 'if practical you can have your job back, if not practical, we will look for something else and make every reasonable attempt to redeploy you'. I would certainly not advise any employer to guarantee that someone would be 'entitled' to their job back after five years.

You say you would like your pension contributions maintained. But why would an employer pay pension contributions for someone who isn't at work for five years and who may well change their mind about coming back anyway?

You can't have it both ways. If you choose to stay at home you can't expect to maintain a career at the same time. You have options open to you if you want to maintain your career. You could put your children in some form of childcare and go back after a year. Your DP or DH could stay at home with them to avoid 'damaging' them , or you could both request part time working and split it between you.

And what about men? You think there should be some sort of legal right for women to do this, but why not men as well? Currently women get a year with a guarantee of a job at the end of it and I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect women to make a decision by the end of that time as to whether they want to keep up their career or stay at home.

And it's perfectly easy to say that you prefer to stay at home without criticising everyone else's choices and suggesting they are damaging their children by not doing the same. In my view it shows a lack of judgement to do so unnecessarily when you are asking for help.

Good,honest advice here that has put a different perspective on your situation.

Please do not write off childcare - you clearly love your job and want to remain employed - good childcare can enable you to do this. However if financially you don't need to work for a few years, and if being at home full time with your baby is the most important thing to you, then it may be worth seizing that opportunity and putting your career on hold.

Have you thought about p/time work? I do 3 days and dh has a fixed day off so our dc have only ever been in nursery for 2 days a week - it's great childcare and they have thrived there - this works for all of us.

Welcome to the world of the professional mother. You've scaled the heights and now you realise that you can't have it all and have to make soem really tough decisions. We have all been there (except the few of us who couldn't wait to get away from the nappies).

In the UK before the 1950's mothers rarely brought up their own children, so the current 'mum at home' thing is the anomoly not the norm for our society. Many countries (Sweden for example) consider it odd to not put your children into creches at 12 months, others (Netherlands) consider it absolutely normal for both parents to work part time whilst raising the kids. There is no 'normal' or 'right' choice.

From an employers' perspective there is no upside at all - especially if you do a niche role.

Which leaves you with the choice of whether to drop out now and take the risk that you cannot get back in or to try to juggle everything and do both family and career. It is an either/or choice and the chances of you being able to negotiate soemthing else are fairly remote.

Knowing that doesn't of course make your choice any easier to make.

You are crackers. Even suggesting this preposterous scenario (which they are very unlikely to accept) will damage your reputation.

There is also a lot of research to suggest that childcare is good for children.

I find you insinuation that mums like me are damaging our children to be not only offensive, but factually incorrect.

Excellent post by Flowery.

Basically you have a decision to make, stay homeon a career break (and resign) or go back to work at the end of 12 months. If you go back, you then need to decide whether you want to request part time.

As for you contribution to society... oh please... get over yourself. My children are perfectly fine contributions to society even though they have two working parents. In fact, they are just as lovely as yours. No more. No less. But just as...

Oh dear. My use of the word 'damaging' wasn't carefully considered. What I meant was that in a first best world the primary carer (usually mother) would be around for the first 3 years. For many reasons it may be 'damaging' for that to be the case, such as if they are depressed at being a stay at home parent or for financial reasons etc. It may well be much better for the child for the mother to work. Clearly there is a balancing act here. I do apologise for that careless wording as i know everyone is trying to make very difficult decisions that are best for their own situation. But, while we're being so blunt, the science does seem to support that Mum at home for first 3 years is first best choice with everything else being equal, ie finances, etc etc.

But at the moment our society doesn't support that as a decision. If we are to have a society in which raising children is valued as well as women's rights there is further to go. And I'm wondering if career breaks shouldn't be the next milestone.

I'm not suggesting there is an easy option. Current maternity leave is fantastic to have. Without it would be so much harder. But is 12 months really better for business (likely followed by another 12 months for many) than an honest 5 year (for example) break.

That's my question. Taking a mat cover post is difficult anyway as it's only for 12 months. I would rather take a longer contract although of course I recognise that that isn't great either.

can't your H step in? there are 2 parents here...

i'm sorry to be so blunt but you're really trying to have it all here - and we all know that isn't possible (practical) just yet. our feminist fore-mothers mis-sold the package. and even if it were possible, I'm not sure if it's morally ok to demand a 5 year break, asking for pension contributions paid, guarantee of a job at the end SHOULD you deem to want to go back at the end of it.

a man would be laughed out of the office for requesting such a thing - why are you any different

"the science does seem to support that Mum at home for first 3 years is first best choice with everything else being equal, ie finances, etc etc."

I think the science is send lots of mixed messages. ANyone can find a handful of studies to support whatever claim they want to make on the best care for under 3s.

I'm pretty sure hanging out with the nanny is better for my children than being homeless.

In many ways, hanging out with the nanny is better for them than haning out with me. She has far more patience than I do for starters. She yells a lot less (not at all in fact). She can never be their mother, but she can offer things I can't and don't.

Let's face it, your immediate desires to stay home may well based on your own desires, and not your baby's long term developmental benefits. That's fine, if you can afford to stay home and want to do that. go for it. But, don't sugar coat by insulting those of us whose chose and believe in a different course.

And if women had a legal right to 5 year career breaks a lot fewer would be hired/promoted. I oppose any legislation which gives rights to women it does not give to men because in real terms it strengthens the glass ceiling.

Strix - me too. I wholeheartedly believe that leave like maternity leave damages women (having taken it twice myself!). It needs to be something that any employee might take before the stigma of being a woman candidate is reduced. Now, there are practical limits to letting anyone disappear for a year, but I would definitely extend some sort of sharing arrangment to fathers for the full period, so ok, it would be something you don't worry about once employees are past a certain age/stage in life, but it would be a start.

And make flexible working something any employee might ask for, not just parents...

I'll get off my soap box now!

I would really recommend making a formal request to work flexibly - perhaps part time or jobshare- so you can keep your career going and spend time with your child. I went back on a jobshare, now stand alone 3 days a week and it's worked out very well for all our family. I'm loving the adultness and responsibility of work, DS loves nursery and is an incredibly bright and sociable child.

Completely agree with the poster who said childcare is not a problem, poor childcare is. The last study I saw said that a mother working part time gives the best outcome for a child but I've seen lots of studies with wildly different results.

Weeble, Strix is right. Even the Rowntree Foundation (who do an awful lot of research with the aim of showing how important it is for mums ot stay at home) have found conflicting evidence and one of their pieces of research has shown that having a career mum is a very positive role model for children which - if supported by good childcare - far outweighs any downside of not having mum at home. So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stop taking it as fact that the ideal scenario has Mum at home.

The ideal scenario is actually whatever works best for your particular family circs, and it does women no favours at all to have prejudices bandied about one way or the other.

If you want to see some of the research do a search on some of my posts on the 'bashing working mothers' threads, because I have linked to quite a few pieces in this area.

Rant over. As you were...

Whats wrong with a nanny? I assume you have a nice home with space (big assumption?) at least then you could leave baby at home and pop back and any spare hours in the day you will be able to see baby.

I help my husband with 2 business' 1. a farm (when I had to drag the pushchair out in all weathers and prop the milk bottle with blankets) 2. another heavy plant business which involves H&S, endless paperwork, running about etc.
My husband doesnt help me at all with housework, childcare etc. I work long hours really for a small income. Also as an employer, we dont put up with demands either and you have to be careful especially in this climate as I agree in the statement 'no one is indispensible'.

Like above posts, you cant have it all. If you have talent you can use that in another field where your needs are more satisfied.

You have to enjoy the baby stage as it doesnt last long.