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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

House of Commons this afternoon. Ministerial statement on new code of practice

77 replies

impossibletoday · 01/06/2026 18:37

From c 16.41

https://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/6cf14ecc-c54b-4536-9f93-66c8e8f6334e

Parliamentlive.tv

House of Commons

https://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/6cf14ecc-c54b-4536-9f93-66c8e8f6334e

OP posts:
nicepotoftea · Yesterday 15:28

KnottyAuty · Yesterday 15:14

Stella Creasy does seem to have gone mad for it doesnt she?

Apparently she said she can’t challenge the EHRC Guidance (presumably has been trying hard to do so behind the scenes since last September?) and instead wants to redo the Equality Act in order to remove women’s sex based rights.

So weird after all her campaigning on abortion rights. I mean how can you tell who needs an abortion if you can’t identify the women or run a single sex service?

I do find her mystifying.

In the past she has been very vocal on the indirect discrimination of a parliament designed around men who will never need to go on maternity leave or breast feed babies.

But she doesn't seem to understand that she is suggesting removing the legislation that protects women from sex based discrimination.

FlirtsWithRhinos · Yesterday 15:29

KnottyAuty · Yesterday 15:14

Stella Creasy does seem to have gone mad for it doesnt she?

Apparently she said she can’t challenge the EHRC Guidance (presumably has been trying hard to do so behind the scenes since last September?) and instead wants to redo the Equality Act in order to remove women’s sex based rights.

So weird after all her campaigning on abortion rights. I mean how can you tell who needs an abortion if you can’t identify the women or run a single sex service?

Oh, they don't want to do away with "women" as mostly as sex class. That would be too honest and rational.

What they want is for woman to mostly mean the sex class in practice and women's rights and needs mostly be defined by our sex, but also that we are all compelled to pretend some men are also in that sex class based on non-physical feely reasons.

To square that circle,

  1. We mustn't draw attention to the fundamental mismatch between "woman" based on the body sex and "woman" based on feely reasons, nor highlight the contradiction between Feminism saying women should not be limited by the cultural stereotypes assigned to our sex and accommodating as women people who, not sharing our sex, can only be differentiated as woman by sharing in those stereotypes.
  2. We mustn't have any of the basis for women's rights explicitly tied to our sex, even the ones directly linked to biology like abortion, because having that written down officially means the pretend women get undermined.

Genderist politicians see no issue with this because of course people really know who women are so there's no need to actually have that written into the laws that protect us, handwavy ones that lump us in with feely men are all we need.

Basically, we should trust they will continue to support female people as long as we are never so gauche as to talk about our sex openly.

ItsCoolForCats · Yesterday 15:38

It will be interesting to see who doesn't sign it.

And I suspect some are signing it because they don't want to face the wrath of their TRA constituents.

nicepotoftea · Yesterday 15:43

FlirtsWithRhinos · Yesterday 15:29

Oh, they don't want to do away with "women" as mostly as sex class. That would be too honest and rational.

What they want is for woman to mostly mean the sex class in practice and women's rights and needs mostly be defined by our sex, but also that we are all compelled to pretend some men are also in that sex class based on non-physical feely reasons.

To square that circle,

  1. We mustn't draw attention to the fundamental mismatch between "woman" based on the body sex and "woman" based on feely reasons, nor highlight the contradiction between Feminism saying women should not be limited by the cultural stereotypes assigned to our sex and accommodating as women people who, not sharing our sex, can only be differentiated as woman by sharing in those stereotypes.
  2. We mustn't have any of the basis for women's rights explicitly tied to our sex, even the ones directly linked to biology like abortion, because having that written down officially means the pretend women get undermined.

Genderist politicians see no issue with this because of course people really know who women are so there's no need to actually have that written into the laws that protect us, handwavy ones that lump us in with feely men are all we need.

Basically, we should trust they will continue to support female people as long as we are never so gauche as to talk about our sex openly.

Genderist politicians see no issue with this because of course people really know who women are so there's no need to actually have that written into the laws that protect us, handwavy ones that lump us in with feely men are all we need.

Ironically, their case is much more difficult to argue because they have abandoned any argument that is possible to define what trans people really are.

BridgetPhillipsonIsACowardlyJobsworth · Yesterday 15:45

nicepotoftea · Yesterday 15:28

I do find her mystifying.

In the past she has been very vocal on the indirect discrimination of a parliament designed around men who will never need to go on maternity leave or breast feed babies.

But she doesn't seem to understand that she is suggesting removing the legislation that protects women from sex based discrimination.

I think some politicians have dug themselves into a hole so deep that they couldn't get out even if they wanted to. (I'm being generous here).

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · Yesterday 15:52

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 14:19

AR is reasonable. EC is not.

EC supports the puberty blocker trial too.

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay · Yesterday 16:02

Tim Farron has now withdrawn his signature. Embarrassing for him that he signed in the first place - a former party leader.

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 16:03

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay · Yesterday 16:02

Tim Farron has now withdrawn his signature. Embarrassing for him that he signed in the first place - a former party leader.

Oooh. I love the smell of ferrets reversing in the morning.

Ereshkigalangcleg · Yesterday 16:07

Haha what’s going on in Lib Dem towers?

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · Yesterday 16:09

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay · Yesterday 16:02

Tim Farron has now withdrawn his signature. Embarrassing for him that he signed in the first place - a former party leader.

Weird. Do they sign by accident and then realise their mistake? Or does the long arm of the party whip extend the Tippex?

ItsCoolForCats · Yesterday 16:10

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay · Yesterday 16:02

Tim Farron has now withdrawn his signature. Embarrassing for him that he signed in the first place - a former party leader.

Unless someone on his team signed and he withdrew it when he became aware?

Also, what the fuck is wrong with the Lib Dems? They are even worse than the Greens now.

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 16:16

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/05/31/lib-dems-split-over-trans-guidance/

Civil war, apparently!

Shedmistress · Yesterday 16:20

ItsCoolForCats · Yesterday 16:10

Unless someone on his team signed and he withdrew it when he became aware?

Also, what the fuck is wrong with the Lib Dems? They are even worse than the Greens now.

They had a large donation from the makers of puberty blockers a few years back.

FlirtsWithRhinos · Yesterday 16:40

nicepotoftea · Yesterday 15:43

Genderist politicians see no issue with this because of course people really know who women are so there's no need to actually have that written into the laws that protect us, handwavy ones that lump us in with feely men are all we need.

Ironically, their case is much more difficult to argue because they have abandoned any argument that is possible to define what trans people really are.

Ah, but they also consider being expected to argue the case to be incredibly gauche and unsophisticated. We should just ... know.

singthing · Yesterday 17:05

It feels like this was just a bunch of them getting their own receipts set up for something to point at when the inevitable happens and the law has to be (GASP!) adhered to.

They can all point at this (and the gaping absence of their other party colleagues) as reasons why they should not be hauled up onto the wall for activists' retribution. Or at least not at the front of the line.

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 17:22

'Alongside colleagues, I have tabled a motion to disapprove the Equality Act 2010: Draft Code of Practice for Services, public functions and associations. We cannot support it, and we have a responsibility to our trans constituents to resist it. This motion is currently the only available mechanism through which Parliament can reject the EHRC’s Code of Practice; if it is debated and passed within the 40-day scrutiny window, it would prevent the Code from being issued by the EHRC and coming into force. Please email your MP asking them to sign EDM 240.'
...
'This guidance must not become statutory; the government should withdraw it and instead legislate to clarify and protect trans people’s rights, privacy and inclusion.'

Nadia Whittome

https://x.com/NadiaWhittomeMP/status/2061762711189414024

Nadia Whittome MP (@NadiaWhittomeMP) on X

Alongside colleagues, I have tabled a motion to disapprove the Equality Act 2010: Draft Code of Practice for Services, public functions and associations. We cannot support it, and we have a responsibility to our trans constituents to resist it. This m...

https://x.com/NadiaWhittomeMP/status/2061762711189414024

OpheliaWitchoftheWoods · Yesterday 17:25

I seriously want to sit down with this bunch of absolute muppets and show them a quick powerpoint of the social media of the ones who wank in the women's loos with the door open, the ones who wank on toilet paper in the hope of women using it, the ones who wank on the floor of M&S changing rooms hoping women walk in it, the ones who put on lingerie and hang around with the curtain half open hoping a woman walks in on them and better still reacts excitingly with fear or anger...

the ones with swords and machetes in women's toilets

the ones chalking threats of sexual violence and sexual murder

the ones pushing used sanpro up their anuses for thrills

and ask why the actual fuck do they think women should be forced to put up with it, and why women who can't deserve exclusion from public life?

I know, cue much whining about NAMALT but it's not fucking convincing is it?

Edited to add: I wouldn't even start with the women injured and raped in prisons, mental health wards and hospital wards by being forced to endure men performing there using them and stupid, gullible middle class fools busy being Lovely. They stuff their fingers in their ears and run away when faced with that much harsh reality.

BrownBookshelf · Yesterday 17:32

I've actually got more respect for the ones who acknowledge that the Code can't be challenged given what the law says, and admit that what they want is incompatible with the Equality Act. They're at least saying the quiet part out loud. On balance I think I prefer that to pretence.

RubberDinghyRapidsBro · Yesterday 17:37

One positive - and it's hard to find any positives in these turkeys voting for Christmas - is that my Lib Dem MP who was previously very much #bekindsillywomen didn't bother his arse to sign it or stand up for it.

EdithStourton · Yesterday 17:37

OpheliaWitchoftheWoods · Yesterday 17:25

I seriously want to sit down with this bunch of absolute muppets and show them a quick powerpoint of the social media of the ones who wank in the women's loos with the door open, the ones who wank on toilet paper in the hope of women using it, the ones who wank on the floor of M&S changing rooms hoping women walk in it, the ones who put on lingerie and hang around with the curtain half open hoping a woman walks in on them and better still reacts excitingly with fear or anger...

the ones with swords and machetes in women's toilets

the ones chalking threats of sexual violence and sexual murder

the ones pushing used sanpro up their anuses for thrills

and ask why the actual fuck do they think women should be forced to put up with it, and why women who can't deserve exclusion from public life?

I know, cue much whining about NAMALT but it's not fucking convincing is it?

Edited to add: I wouldn't even start with the women injured and raped in prisons, mental health wards and hospital wards by being forced to endure men performing there using them and stupid, gullible middle class fools busy being Lovely. They stuff their fingers in their ears and run away when faced with that much harsh reality.

Edited

Upthread someone quoted Sarah Owens (MP for Luton) saying
Does the Minister share my concern that the new code of practice will only further the UK’s now hostile environment for trans people and not calm it?

Perhaps Sarah might like to attend your presentation and realise why women have become increasingly 'hostile' to TW in their spaces.

'Muppets' is too kind a word...

GargoylesofBeelzebub · Yesterday 17:38

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 14:18

Hmm. I think MPs challenging legislation is a big part of government!

They’re not challenging legislation though. They’re just trying to throw a spanner in the works.

moto748e · Yesterday 17:45

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 17:22

'Alongside colleagues, I have tabled a motion to disapprove the Equality Act 2010: Draft Code of Practice for Services, public functions and associations. We cannot support it, and we have a responsibility to our trans constituents to resist it. This motion is currently the only available mechanism through which Parliament can reject the EHRC’s Code of Practice; if it is debated and passed within the 40-day scrutiny window, it would prevent the Code from being issued by the EHRC and coming into force. Please email your MP asking them to sign EDM 240.'
...
'This guidance must not become statutory; the government should withdraw it and instead legislate to clarify and protect trans people’s rights, privacy and inclusion.'

Nadia Whittome

https://x.com/NadiaWhittomeMP/status/2061762711189414024

Might have known that the mighty intellect of Nadia would soon show itself on this. The absolute bird-brained muppet.

singthing · Yesterday 17:45

KnottyAuty · 01/06/2026 23:51

I’ll listen tomorrow but if they don’t expect much to change i think they’re in for a shock. Women still won’t directly challenge men in the ladies but there will be a slew of complaints, tribunals and court claims…. And increasingly common out of court settlements… How much public money will they be prepared to sign off to pay all the claims before they have to go kicking and screaming with 4th spaces?

maybe they are in a weird bet with ol' Jolyon about who can generate the most case law against themselves?

singthing · Yesterday 17:51

ItsCoolForCats · Yesterday 13:58

Hopefully the government will stand firm. Afterall, their excuse for sitting on the guidance for a year was that they wanted to ensure it was legally robust before laying it before parliament. So, it's a bad look if they u-turn.

Well they fucked that excuse when it turned out they didn't even bother to get the data category for !

Were they all playing quoits in the corridors or something for that year to justify the delay?

Sex is not “special category” data

The new Code of practice for services, public functions and associations from the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC), which was laid before

https://sex-matters.org/posts/updates/sex-is-not-special-category-data/

ArabellaScott · Yesterday 17:53

EDMs:

'Early day motions (EDMs) are motions submitted for debate in the House of Commons for which no day has been fixed.
As there is no specific time allocated to EDMs very few are debated. However, many attract a great deal of public interest and media coverage.

What are EDMs used for?

EDMs are used to put on record the views of individual MPs or to draw attention to specific events or campaigns. Topics covered by EDMs vary widely.
By attracting the signatures of other MPs, they can be used to demonstrate the level of parliamentary support for a particular cause or point of view.

How many signatures do EDMs attract?

In an average session only six or seven EDMs reach over two hundred signatures. Around seventy or eighty get over one hundred signatures. The majority will attract only one or two signatures.

There is no rule whereby the number of signatures affects the likelihood of an EDM being debated.'
...
'A 'prayer' is a particular type of EDM that is used, by convention, when MPs wish to object formally to a statutory instrument. If a motion 'praying' that an instrument 'be annulled' is tabled within 40 days of it being laid before Parliament, a debate may be arranged in a Delegated Legislation Committee or, more rarely, in the Chamber.'

https://www.parliament.uk/about/how/business/edms/

So. This whole exercise doesn't even mean anything unless a debate gets tabled, and a vote taken to reject the Guidance.

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