Help end medical misogyny. Sign our petition.

Help end medical misogyny.
Sign our petition.

Sign the petition

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

S fetish and/or s fantasy coersion.

21 replies

logiccalls · 24/05/2026 19:55

Call it coersion: Forcing workmates or the public to collude with any fantasy or fetish is not legitimate: The earth is not flat. Anyone saying the earth is round is not 'flat-earth critical'. Humans cannot change sex. Anyone saying sex is fixed from conception is not 'gender-critical'. Nobody can change sex. Therefore nobody can be 'trans'. Therefore nobody can be 'transphobic'. Just as nobody can be 'flat-earth phobic'.

OP posts:
OneDreamyGreenMentor · 24/05/2026 20:13

I don’t think it’s possible to force someone into believing either of the above.
In terms of those beliefs, let’s take flat earth for example, I believe this is a form of mental illness or perhaps those who are easily influenced and don’t have the mental capacity to comprehend logic. No one of minute intelligence is believing the Earth is flat.

I don’t think a person of sound mind would be, without emotional influence, be coerced into believing the Earth is flat/you can change gender.

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

Wearenotborg · 25/05/2026 06:49

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

But as discussed on another thread, trans people rely on others to validate their existence. If no one goes along with their pretence they are not their real sex, and are in fact just GNC people, surely that might help their mental health. Rather than the demanding others see them as they see themselves, they world just be able to accept they can never be what they wish to be, and accept themselves for who they are.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/05/2026 07:33

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

Why do other people have to go along with it?

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 25/05/2026 14:12

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

Is that a promise?

After all, they winked into existence less than a century ago....

logiccalls · 25/05/2026 15:58

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

No. They don't exist in the first place. They cannot exist. Like confirming the planet is round, it should never have been necessary for Supreme Court to formally declare what is obvious.

Try to comprehend this : Nobody can change sex.

A fox dressed in a chicken costume is not a 'trans-chicken'. From the moment of conception, every cell in his body is that of a fox. Not one cell is chicken. Even if a vet has given him implanted feathers and a plastic beak, he can never, never be a chicken. There is no such thing as 'trans' from one species to another, nor from one sex to the other.

OP posts:
logiccalls · 25/05/2026 16:05

Wearenotborg · 25/05/2026 06:49

But as discussed on another thread, trans people rely on others to validate their existence. If no one goes along with their pretence they are not their real sex, and are in fact just GNC people, surely that might help their mental health. Rather than the demanding others see them as they see themselves, they world just be able to accept they can never be what they wish to be, and accept themselves for who they are.

Thank you. Exactly. Anorexic people look at themselves in the mirror and due to a mental illness, they can see an obese version of themselves looking back, even though they are close to death through starving themselves. They are not encouraged to stick to their delusions. They are not given weight loss drugs which they would crave, they are not given 'fat-reducing' surgery. School teachers will not agree with a thin child that s/he is very obese, and do everything possible to encourage the child to lose weight, secretly from the parents.

OP posts:
Igmum · 25/05/2026 18:01

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

Trans people are not Tinkerbell. Pointing out that they haven’t changed sex doesn’t mean they disappear.

logiccalls · 25/05/2026 18:33

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

teawamutu · 26/05/2026 06:29

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

A useful summary for you. HTH.

S fetish and/or s  fantasy coersion.
lornad00m · 26/05/2026 06:52

FarewelltotheHorse · 24/05/2026 21:48

Well then I guess you've solved the problem and trans people will now obligingly just wink out of existence.

Trans people can believe they're the opposite sex.

The problem is they demand that other people believe it too. We must all participate in the validation of their trans identity.

You can believe you're a woman if you're a man. Good luck to you. Just don't expect me to buy what you're selling. Or to welcome you into spaces reserved for women and girls.

WarriorN · 26/05/2026 07:44

A significant issue here, that we did not have in the past, is that social media validates the belief over and over and over again. It even uses “scientific” papers to evidence the belief.

A 5 min scroll on reddit transgender uk demonstrates this. They’re all repeatedly encouraging others to ignore the law, stating most people don’t care.

Mis / disinformation is an epidemic of the digital age.

Indeed, it may be that we have entered an age of misinformation and disinformation. The ante-thesis of the renaissance.

Ideology is once again, (a self identified) king/queen/NB (pronouns we/I/myself/nodebate.)

WarriorN · 26/05/2026 07:46

They’ve noticed that the “guardian has fallen” and “even pink news.” No idea if that is significant or not. In this new age anyone can set up a news source or research study to say what ever you want it to say and there are thousands of eager readers ready and willing to financially support it.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 26/05/2026 09:10

teawamutu · 26/05/2026 06:29

A useful summary for you. HTH.

Haha that’s excellent 😂

KnottyAuty · 26/05/2026 09:18

Igmum · 25/05/2026 18:01

Trans people are not Tinkerbell. Pointing out that they haven’t changed sex doesn’t mean they disappear.

Perfect reply!

AStonedRose · 26/05/2026 09:22

Sigh. No transphobia on mumsnet, is there?

quantumbutterfly · 26/05/2026 09:25

AStonedRose · 26/05/2026 09:22

Sigh. No transphobia on mumsnet, is there?

cary elwes GIF

Phobia? No

Safeguarding concerns. Yes

KnottyAuty · 26/05/2026 09:47

AStonedRose · 26/05/2026 09:22

Sigh. No transphobia on mumsnet, is there?

It’s feminism dear.
why aren’t you over on Reddit making passive aggressive remarks about misogyny?

AreYouSureAskedNaomi · 26/05/2026 10:10

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 25/05/2026 14:12

Is that a promise?

After all, they winked into existence less than a century ago....

I disagree with this. Gender non-conforming people and people with gender dysphoria have always existed. They are not the same as the current wave of activists.

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 26/05/2026 11:54

AreYouSureAskedNaomi · 26/05/2026 10:10

I disagree with this. Gender non-conforming people and people with gender dysphoria have always existed. They are not the same as the current wave of activists.

Gender non-conforming? Do you mean homosexual, or just people who failed to conform to the society's expectations of the behaviour and dress appropriate to their sex?

Yes, body dysphoria in many forms has existed for a very long time; but people being horrified with and uncomfortable about having two legs has never meant anyone felt their healthy limbs should be cut off to gratify their delusions; they have been treated as having a mental rather than a physical affliction, as have people who have believed in the face of all evidence that they were horribly fat. Belief that you are Napoleon doesn't mean that you actually are a Corsican dictator, as far as I know.

Also as far as I can tell, a vast majority of the activists are no more trans-sexual than I am, and the vast majority even of those who claim to be trans-sexual have not the least intention of having any actual surgery to modify their bodies even though that surgery is available (many of them appear to think that hormone treatments are all reversible, which is not the case). Tragically, it has been made altogether too easy for troubled young women who have had abusive childhoods or have mental conditions which make female puberty abhorrent to them to have their healthy breasts removed surgically, something which makes the "de-transitioning" which seems to be what is done by a high proportion of troubled adolescents a few years down the line a great deal more difficult for them to do.

I am reasonably certain that before the interval between WWI and WWII (ie some time in the thirties) it had never even been suggested that any human being could change their sex without divine intervention (nobody was talking about gender then apart from linguists who used the word for a fairly specific purpose nothing to do with the sex of an individual). And I am also fairly sure that there may have been cosmetic operations done before 1952, but that was when the first one involving both castration surgery and hormone treatment was carried out in order to attempt to make a male person appear female in all respects. (I am unsure how successful the attempt was: I look at photographs of George/Christine Jorgensen and the person still looks pretty male to me. Male making a good attempt to look like a female vamp. to be sure, but that wasn't new.)

I do not regard men having their genitals cut off as "transitioning" (eunuchs and castrati made no such claim) any more than women cutting off their breasts is (religious frenzy can have a lot to answer for). Mutilation, voluntary or involuntary, has existed for as long as history has been being written down, but it's an unfortunate fact rather than evidence that people transitioned. Similarly, men dressing as women or women dressing as men may have all sorts of reasons but is not evidence of transitioning, and nor is a woman claiming in a speech to have the heart and stomach of a king of England.

Yes, there have been people who would have liked to be members of the other sex from the one they actually belonged to, but there was nothing to be done about this desire until less than a century ago – apart from leave home for a distant town, dress differently, and hope nobody noticed that your were deceiving them. And lord lord I am tired of homosexuals (or actors) having dressed up as members of a different sex from their own being taken as evidence of transsexuality rather than transvestism.

WarriorN · 26/05/2026 13:42

AreYouSureAskedNaomi · 26/05/2026 10:10

I disagree with this. Gender non-conforming people and people with gender dysphoria have always existed. They are not the same as the current wave of activists.

specifically in very sexist and homophobic societies.

cultures that were less homophobic but still very sexist “allowed” these people to “exist” and indeed give them a purpose, in a socially invented culture concept such as “two spirit.”

The more homophobic cultures would kill them. Or now, allow or even force transgender surgeries.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page