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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Tribunal discussion thread supporting FayeRC in case against NHS England part 2

130 replies

Jimmyneutronsforehead · 20/03/2026 23:00

Today the tribunal concluded it's oral submissions 20/03/26 for the case of Faye Russell-Caldicott v. NHSE

Gardening is still underway, please search Faye Russell-Caldicott Crowd Justice to offer seeds of support. Less than 12 days left to get to target. If you're a woman, you know a woman, and you value women, this case does affect you as we could all find ourselves in this position with our employers and we need to send a message that we won't tolerate having our rights removed. Please if you can, send some gardening funds to the CJ page to help cover the legal fees associated with this case.

This is a continuation thread from: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5504170-tribunal-discussion-thread-supporting-fayerc-in-case-against-nhs-england-starting-160326?page=1

Thank you to everybody for showing your support to the wonderful @FayeRC. ❤️

It will be approximately 1 month before there's a verdict, and a provisional date set in August for a remedial hearing should the court find in FayeRC's favour.

Tribunal discussion thread supporting FayeRC in case against NHS England starting 16/03/26 | Mumsnet

Thanks for joining in this discussion in support of {mention:FayeRC} and the case against NHSE. This is a private tribunal case, so there will be no...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5504170-tribunal-discussion-thread-supporting-fayerc-in-case-against-nhs-england-starting-160326?page=1

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9
GenderlessVoid · 14/05/2026 04:55

It seems to me that the disability and religion claims were rejected because they both involved indirect intersectional discrimination or discrimination on the basis of two protected characteristics instead of indirect discrimination on the basis of a single protected characteristic. Per the Tribunal, such dual discrimination claims are't prohibited by the Equality Act.

pp 45-46 of the judgment deal with those claims

186.1 the Act does not contain any enforceable provisions relating to
discrimination on the basis of a combination of two or more protected
characteristics. There are provisions under section 14 of the Act that relate
to combined direct discrimination only (not to combined indirect
discrimination, harassment or any other complaints under the Act),
however these have never been brought into force;
. . . .
The claimant’s representative . . . clarified that her indirect discrimination complaint related to female Muslims only. . . .
the claimant’s indirect discrimination complaint relating to disability was
pleaded on the basis of women who experienced PTSD as a result of male
sexual violence, rather than individuals (both male and female) who
experienced PTSD as a result of male sexual violence.

186.5 we would have concluded that the claimant’s complaints of indirect
discrimination in relation to religious belief and in relation to disability
amount to complaints of combined indirect discrimination, that are not
protected under the Act. . . .

186.6 section 14 of the Act is not in force. However, it is clear from the drafting
of section 14 of the Act that Parliament intended that complaints of
combined discrimination would (when in force) be limited to those of
combined direct discrimination only. . . .

186.7 in addition, the Explanatory Notes to the Act state at paragraph 68:
“68.Previous legislation only allowed for claims alleging discrimination
because of a single protected characteristic. This section allows those who
have experienced less favourable treatment because of a combination of
two relevant protected characteristics to bring a direct discrimination claim,
such as where the single-strand approach may not succeed.”

The ET isn't saying that there was no harm or indirect discrimination, they're saying that the Equality Act doesn't cover combined indirect discrimination claims. If Faye had shown discrimination to both male and female Muslims (i.e., religion only) or both male and female PTSD victims who had been subject to male violence (i.e., disability only), the Tribunal might have found for her on those claims. They didn't rule on those questions because the Tribunal found that, as a matter of law, Faye's combined claims weren't covered.

I was disappointed with that aspect of the judgment but I don't know if the ET was correct regarding combined claims under the Equality Act.

Needapadlockonmyfridge · 14/05/2026 05:22

SexRealistic · 13/05/2026 23:13

https://rejserin.medium.com/anti-trans-employment-tribunal-cases-e098a8391bf9

This is fresh over from Reddit…. But it’s hard to make head or tail of….

Gender critics are using the UK civil courts to enforce their reductive beliefs because they cannot face the fact that employers and employees are overwhelmingly trans inclusive.

Gender critics cleave to a philosophical belief about biology which has no actual grounding in biological science precisely because it is a belief which do not require any evidence to uphold.

Whaaaaaat? Olympic-standard mental gymnastics!

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 07:52

@GenderlessVoid I agree, I’m not convinced that the indirect discrimination points were well founded.

I think that in fact it was religious discrimination. Policy said trans people could do whatever they wanted in their assumed gender. Would that not follow a non medicated or surgically altered Muslim woman could identity as a trans man and perform washing before prayers with the men? The extent of nudity maybe different between the sexes but I can’t imagine such an outcome would be acceptable to Muslim men.

I think they got easily to out and out Stinewall & Union engineered and org sponsored discrimination of women so fast they didn’t bother too hard addressing those points.

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 07:54

Needapadlockonmyfridge · 14/05/2026 05:22

Whaaaaaat? Olympic-standard mental gymnastics!

Maybe flaying one’s penis and using your scrotum to make a general hole in one’s perineum changes how you generally think about the world. (As our wise writer did).

Sec realists = flat earthers is DAVRO

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 07:55

Conxis · 13/05/2026 20:25

This is what we’ve always said. The workplace is one of the easiest places to enforce this. You just make it a disciplinary offence not to follow the policy

I think the judge reads here 😂

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/05/2026 07:59

Needapadlockonmyfridge · 14/05/2026 05:22

Whaaaaaat? Olympic-standard mental gymnastics!

That guy has tried to post on here before IIRC.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/05/2026 08:01

GreyskySexRealistsky · 13/05/2026 23:18

Some comments on reddit including calling LS names because, you know, the most oppressed are so kind

Interested in PTD’s comments if he’s still posting there as he was worried about this case.

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 08:01

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/05/2026 07:59

That guy has tried to post on here before IIRC.

Poor lad he wouldn’t have lasted long.

illuminada · 14/05/2026 08:10

This is why I absolutely love gardening!
Congratulations Faye!!

teawamutu · 14/05/2026 08:23

illuminada · 14/05/2026 08:10

This is why I absolutely love gardening!
Congratulations Faye!!

I've not regretted a single spadeful or seed planted, but this one is particularly rewarding.

Thank you, Faye. And yes, please let this be appealed, upheld, enshrined in case law and used to spare women future tedious games of Sexist Whack a Mole.

GenderlessVoid · 14/05/2026 08:25

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 07:52

@GenderlessVoid I agree, I’m not convinced that the indirect discrimination points were well founded.

I think that in fact it was religious discrimination. Policy said trans people could do whatever they wanted in their assumed gender. Would that not follow a non medicated or surgically altered Muslim woman could identity as a trans man and perform washing before prayers with the men? The extent of nudity maybe different between the sexes but I can’t imagine such an outcome would be acceptable to Muslim men.

I think they got easily to out and out Stinewall & Union engineered and org sponsored discrimination of women so fast they didn’t bother too hard addressing those points.

I agree with this
I think they got easily to out and out Stinewall & Union engineered and org sponsored discrimination of women so fast they didn’t bother too hard addressing those points.

NHS conceded group disadvantage to women who were Muslims, but not to Muslims as a whole. FayeRC "did not provide any evidence that male Muslims (as well as female Muslims) were disadvantaged by the application of the PCPs [Provision, Criterion or Practices]." Further "[t]he claimant’s representative stated at the start of the hearing that the claimant did not wish to make a formal amendment application but clarified that her indirect discrimination complaint related to female Muslims only."

It seems like FayeRC's team believed that indirect combined discrimination was prohibited by the Equality Act. If they didn't provide evidence that Muslim men as well as Muslim women suffered indirect discrimination from NHS's PCPs, I don't understand how they could prevail on the claim that Muslim men were also discriminated against. Maybe I'm missing something.

The next person who sues for indirect discrimination as a result of religion should demonstrate that the policy harms both men and women. As you say, they might have been able to show that here. But they didn't provide any evidence so they lost.

Leavesandthings · 14/05/2026 08:28

I just saw this and haven't read it yet but

Amazing News Faye!!!! Congratulations!!
And thank you for your bravery bringing this forward. ⭐

Dancingsquirrels · 14/05/2026 08:32

Great result. The tide is turning

BeKindWisely · 14/05/2026 08:33

SexRealistic · 13/05/2026 22:16

As to genital inspections - the Judge must read these boards - no need to look for willies - just enforce policies against your employees whose behaviour you can control.

“We accept that it would not be possible for the respondent to guarantee that the single-sex toilets would only be accessed by women. However, this does not mean that the respondent could not take reasonable steps to ensure that such a policy was complied with by its employees and visitors, for example by making it a disciplinary offence to breach any employee policy or by requiring visitors to comply with appropriate policies.”

Not being able to enforce doens't give you permission for a free for all.

This response to that frequent old chestnut is so good and clear to have recorded
in the judgement!

Well done, well done, well done, Faye!

SexRealistic · 14/05/2026 08:46

GenderlessVoid · 14/05/2026 08:25

I agree with this
I think they got easily to out and out Stinewall & Union engineered and org sponsored discrimination of women so fast they didn’t bother too hard addressing those points.

NHS conceded group disadvantage to women who were Muslims, but not to Muslims as a whole. FayeRC "did not provide any evidence that male Muslims (as well as female Muslims) were disadvantaged by the application of the PCPs [Provision, Criterion or Practices]." Further "[t]he claimant’s representative stated at the start of the hearing that the claimant did not wish to make a formal amendment application but clarified that her indirect discrimination complaint related to female Muslims only."

It seems like FayeRC's team believed that indirect combined discrimination was prohibited by the Equality Act. If they didn't provide evidence that Muslim men as well as Muslim women suffered indirect discrimination from NHS's PCPs, I don't understand how they could prevail on the claim that Muslim men were also discriminated against. Maybe I'm missing something.

The next person who sues for indirect discrimination as a result of religion should demonstrate that the policy harms both men and women. As you say, they might have been able to show that here. But they didn't provide any evidence so they lost.

Yes I’d love to hear from their legal team on that. Maybe a future blog post or podcast from Naomi down the line.

It could have easily be proven as needed.

However who needs and argument in the alternative when she won hands down for all women!

Well done Faye.

ScarlettSunset · 14/05/2026 08:48

Such a great result.

Well done Faye!

ArtShow · 14/05/2026 08:54

I'm wondering if finding in the grounds of being a Muslim would have diluted the judgement for all women. Ie you'd have to be a Muslim to be discriminated against , atheists have to suck it up.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/05/2026 09:04

ArtShow · 14/05/2026 08:54

I'm wondering if finding in the grounds of being a Muslim would have diluted the judgement for all women. Ie you'd have to be a Muslim to be discriminated against , atheists have to suck it up.

Yes, I think that’s possibly how it would have been interpreted by the NHS etc.

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · 14/05/2026 09:05

ArtShow · 14/05/2026 08:54

I'm wondering if finding in the grounds of being a Muslim would have diluted the judgement for all women. Ie you'd have to be a Muslim to be discriminated against , atheists have to suck it up.

Yes, and the Telegraph article linked upthread is 'presenting' this as a win because she is Muslim thereby prompting anti-Muslim sentiment in the comments.

MassiveWordSalad · 14/05/2026 09:46

ArtShow · 14/05/2026 08:54

I'm wondering if finding in the grounds of being a Muslim would have diluted the judgement for all women. Ie you'd have to be a Muslim to be discriminated against , atheists have to suck it up.

I was wondering that too.

Go on Faye, you fabulous, strong woman 💪🏾
Thank you so much, and thanks as always to your brilliant legal team.

MassiveWordSalad · 14/05/2026 09:47

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · 14/05/2026 09:05

Yes, and the Telegraph article linked upthread is 'presenting' this as a win because she is Muslim thereby prompting anti-Muslim sentiment in the comments.

For fuck’s sake!

MoistVonL · 14/05/2026 09:52

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · 14/05/2026 09:05

Yes, and the Telegraph article linked upthread is 'presenting' this as a win because she is Muslim thereby prompting anti-Muslim sentiment in the comments.

Racists gotta racist

moto748e · 14/05/2026 11:24

HenriettaSwanLeavitt · 14/05/2026 09:05

Yes, and the Telegraph article linked upthread is 'presenting' this as a win because she is Muslim thereby prompting anti-Muslim sentiment in the comments.

The headline in the Times piece was similar. The fact that she is Muslim was not the reason she won her case. The implication is clear.