Telling pregnant colleague a kick in the testicles is worse than childbirth was harassment - tribunal

[IwantToRetire]

Judge finds claimant felt ‘hurt and belittled’ by comment made in work group chat, deeming it an ‘ill-judged attempt at humour’

A pregnant employee at an electric vehicle manufacturer was judged by a tribunal to have been harassed by a colleague who said being kicked in the testicles is more painful than childbirth.

In a company group chat, the male employee said that the fact women chose to have subsequent babies was proof it was less painful to give birth, adding that you would never hear a man say they “wouldn’t mind another kick in the bollocks”.

The Birmingham tribunal heard the message received several thumbs up reactions, including from the claimant’s line manager.

Employment judge Maxwell found that the message constituted harassment related to sex, stating it was “crude and made light of the claimant’s circumstances and the risks [the claimant] faced”.

The claimant, Amy Hope, was “very upset” and felt “hurt and belittled” by the “ill-judged attempt at humour”, the judge added.

However, Hope’s claims of direct sex discrimination, pregnancy discrimination and detriment, and unfair dismisal all failed.

News story continues at https://www.peoplemanagement.co.uk/article/1949926/telling-pregnant-colleague-kick-testicles-worse-childbirth-harassment-tribunal-rules

Pretty sure that is a whole routine by Jason Manford. Not that that's particularly relevant but the guy wasn't even being particularly original 🙄

It sounded more like a string of comments that did it, not just this one comment... that's the reality of working with a load of blokes. Not sure what the answer is. There might be backlash in that employers in male dominated industries want to hire women less. But i do think it's tiresome having to deal with that all the time. Let's just say I'm glad i left.

What’s your take then op? Any comment to pass? Or even the context maybe, which is clearly stated in the article.

Not really. I only skim read it and thought I would think about it over night.

But just thought as said by PP having to put up with men you haven't chosen to be with but have to endure because of work makes me glad I now work on my own.

And did think I was glad she felt able to raise it as an issue.

I wonder if she is still working there and if so what the work environment is like.

Although still not read properly but re-skimming has she in fact left, or been sacked?

However, Hope’s claims of direct sex discrimination, pregnancy discrimination and detriment, and unfair dismisal all failed.

I think she was made redundant after her mat leave.

Have just found this. Certainly cant be skim read.

Looks like she made 6 claims and 5 were dismissed.

Good reminder to never let a newspaper going for a catchy headline distort a story.

She was made redundant during her maternity leave. So she won the harassment element but not the other claims.

Far worse than the testicles comment, imo, was responding to her concerns about her baby bump not growing with a comment about the ‘boob fairy’.

Not sure if I would take this to tribunal, but this is one of the most stupid comments that (some) men make.

NO pain is like labour and childbirth. Some say internal/kidneystones type of pain is, but I dispute that. A woman I know said it was worse than childbirth for her. It may have been FOR HER. Doesn't mean it is for everyone. I was in so much pain during labour and childbirth that I would have chosen death at that time to stop the pain. I had kidneystones. Very painful, but not as painful as labour and childbirth.

ALSO, the comment 'women go on to have more babies, but men don't ask for another kick in the bollocks, so it PROVES childbirth can't be as painful as a kick in the bollocks' is STUPID. Women are NOT getting pregnant again, and having a second (and maybe third child) because it wasn't really that painful, and it was less painful than a man being kicked in the bollocks. They are not getting pregnant again because they loved the fucking pain. They are getting pregnant again because THEY (and the man they are with) WANT ANOTHER BABY. And getting pregnant and going through childbirth is usually the only bloody way to get one!!!

It's really not that hard to work out!

Some men are really not very bright!

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Yes quite.

I'm sure if (the men who wanted children anyway) popped a baby out the day after being kicked on the balls, there would be plenty who would do it. There's no upside to being kicked on the balls it's really stupid comparison.

I wonder what the stats are for men dying after being kicked in the balls? Probably a lot less than the maternal mortality rate.

women go on to have more children, not because it’s less painful than being kicked in the balls but because they have an almost primeval need to have more. I have several friends who had further children even after being explicitly told that it could endanger their life

women have more children because they’re a shit load stronger, emotionally, that men and can do things they can’t.

Its a joke, the identical one has been made at our office, along with "if men had to give birth noone would have siblings"
Noone got offended and there was some back and forth jokes between the men and women.

Ive also had a conversation with a collegue who has given birth and said appendicitis was far worse. People are entitled to opinions even if it isnt meant as a joke.

I think we need to do definitive research on this. Wondering if the claimant is up for being kicked in the testicles for 20 seconds at a time, 2 minutes apart, for 12 hours. I’m happy to conduct the research if he’s game….

I think this case relates to other discussions about the working of the Equality Act. A claim for unfair dismissal is garnered by many other claims of harassment and discrimintion in the hope something sticks.
It's the kind of thing that brings the Act into disrepute.
"However, Hope’s claims of direct sex discrimination, pregnancy discrimination and detriment, and unfair dismisal all failed."

In my personal experience of having given birth with no pain relief and having had gallstones, I'd say for me pain-wise it was a very close run thing!! I guess the difference (much like the kick in the testicles) is that there's no positive outcome to look forward to from a gallstones attack, whereas hopefully there is from childbirth.

A man said to me 'it's been scientifically proven that having gallstones is more painful than childbirth'.

I was agog that a man could casually inform a woman how painful childbirth is in relation to anything?!

I think the problem is that the newspaper article headlines which I used to the OP actually do NOT convey the totality of the situation.

And in fact this was just one part of a 6 part complaint.

And as I said up thread the newspaper distortion should be set against the actual tribunal

And although I now see I forgot to post the link anyone could find it, as it is so recent.

At this point (and I am still ploughing through) dont see how this as 1 of 6 complaints was upheld.

Maybe someone with better knowledge of employment law and the EA can explain.

So here is the link https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/69904098ceeaa48d377f6b7a/Ms_A_Hope_v_OLA_Electric_UK_Private_Limited_-1306178_2024-_corrected_reasons.pdf

(6 complaints itemised in the attached image)

Mr Lippet was wrong in any case, a lad I used to know was paid good money to kick men in the balls, elsewhere too, but always the balls & no shortage of customers.
Male sexuality never tires of finding ways to be messed-up.

That figures. After all giving birth is such a walk in the park (according to her colleague) she'll probably want to do it again which we know some employers find very inconvenient