The disgraceful RCN and Nurse Jennifer Melle

[ArabellaScott]

The Darlington Nurses Union has now formally intervened to ask the RCN to step up and do its actual job:

'Suspended nurse Jennifer Melle says her gender row with the NHS has left her abandoned, vulnerable and alone.
The medic claims she has been cast into the wilderness and feeling like a pariah over her unshakable and religiously-held beliefs on biological sex.
She has been suspended from work for four months for breaching patient confidentiality after “misgendering” a convicted sex offender.
Single mum Ms Melle, 40, now faces being struck off but says the silence from those with a duty of care towards her has left her broken. '
...
'Ms Melle was hauled before a disciplinary hearing after an incident in May last year during which she refused to use female pronouns for a patient under her care.
She remains unable to work after Patient X, who was born male but identifies as a woman, was taken to St Helier Hospital in Carshalton, Surrey, from a male prison for treatment for a urinary condition.
Ms Melle was called a n*** multiple times after the inmate overheard her using biologically accurate pronouns during a phone call with a senior doctor.
She was suspended by the trust on April 2 for breaching patient confidentiality after speaking about the racial abuse and referred to the Nursing and Midwifery Council.'

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/2090368/gender-biological-sex-trans-NHS-nurse

'A paying RCN member for 12 years, Jennifer says that when the incident happened the union dismissed her case as not “meritorious” and told her to complete a “reflection” exercise to avoid future ‘misgendering’. She received no support despite the RCN recognising the abuse she experienced.
The Darlington Nursing Union (DNU), which represents Jennifer, has now formally appealed to the RCN to intervene.'

https://christianconcern.com/ccpressreleases/christian-nurse-in-trans-paedophile-misgendering-case-says-royal-college-of-nursing-abandoned-her/

TBH on a busy ward I wonder how many nurses would perform the verbal gymnastics to do all that. I suppose these days they have to.

Although gender-critical beliefs are protected under the Equality Act, this does not mean that those with gender-critical beliefs can ‘misgender’ trans persons with impunity.

Yes it does. The only exception would be if it was part of a campaign of harassment. e.g, shouting it through his letterbox at 3am.

I have no intention of calling a man a woman. Pronouns are part of my language not the subject. You don't have your own.

Agree. This will be very interesting to see.

Thanks, I've archived that link.

The page was 'Last Updated 11/12/2023' - that's a long time in gender politics.

Seems the NMC are in danger of getting themselves into bother just as badly as NHS Fife are currently doing.

Edit: quote dropped off, was replying to post about no definition of misgendering.

Yes that's a very good point. I would prefer what misgendering is to be hammered out outside of court though honestly as it costs a fortune and normal people get caught up in it.

I am aware it was discussed in some degree in Forstater v Centre for Global Development Europe and Forstater used "preferred pronouns" sometimes.

Even if it was agreed there's a general right to use "real sex" pronouns it might still be acceptable for employers to require employees to use "preferred" or "neutral" where there is a perceived need. The later avoiding untruths.

There's quite an interesting philosophical article on here about it: <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/2024.11.03-091945/philosophersmag.com/the-transgender-rights-issue" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.is/2024.11.03-091945/philosophersmag.com/the-transgender-rights-issue/

Which tries to distinguish "equality" claims from "rights" claims. It's a bit unfair to Catholics but nm. However doesn't extend to medical ethics.

You would have every conversation about every patient being a game of hints and leading questions. Every patient because the others on the call have to ask the trick questions every time in case this is one of those times.

It may be a fun game and you could include it at the next dinner party you throw, but keep it well away from hospitals.

Also that is a breach anyway as by joining in the hinting game the nurse has revealed to the doctor that the patient is a man anyway and must be punished.

Role playing games should be left at home where they won't endanger patients and the careers of those trying to help them.

As well this wasn't her explanation to the patient, according to her own lawyers, after patient was angry about overheard being called "Mr X".

"Jennifer politely said: ‘I am sorry I cannot refer to you as her or she, as it’s against my faith and Christian values but I can call you by your name."

So it wasn't a case about talking about male bits on the phone. Also not very efficient if patients get very angry and then don't listen 🤷‍♀️

Well that was still about the phone call because she would not be calling him he to his face would she. That's not how our language works.

You just demonstrated that with your quote " I cannot refer to you" see? She said 'you'

Try again.

I'm afraid I'm not sure what you are referring to.

"I honestly do not know how she could possibly describe a urological /catheter problem to a doctor on the phone without specifying the sex of the patient."

Was the comment I was referring to. As can be seen, if wasn't about biology.

Evidently yes, he/she pronouns are generally used when discussing a patient with others or writing a report. I'm not sure what your point is.

Saying he was male ie using he to denote his sex is “about biology” to 90% of the population.

This really is utterly ridiculous. The nurse can refer to male genitals but cannot say "he"? How the heck have we reached this place?

I agree. NMC also need to be clearer about the difference between "misgendering" by not using preferred pronouns (where someone feels that is lying) and a nurse deliberately using gendered pronouns someone finds upsetting.

From those who have been following this for longer than I have, I get the impression both sorts of misgendering are no longer being seen automatically as harassment? I.e. posts getting deleted on Mumsnet.

That said NMC requires nurses to be kind. The rest of us are under no such requirement!

So true. Additionally in my NWLondon hospital the staff are from such diverse backgrounds, often with English as a second language. It is vital that all communication is easy to understand, unambiguous, factual and as uncomplicated as possible.

I watched her interview and I thought she may have got in trouble for it.. I am an RCN member and have contacted them to say they were unreasonable about Sandie Peggie. Jennifer was treated terribly but in my opinion she went to the press with too much patient detail . Don't want to sound like I am defending the RCN, I need to research other unions and leave them as the RCN are useless.

That would be an unnatural way of speaking that takes up considerable mental effort for already over stretched NHS staff that should be allowed to focus on patient care and safety rather than pander to a delusion.

Remember these people are dealing with serious things like administering correct doses of medication which could have very serious consequences for a mistake. We should let them do their jobs not force ideological nonsense onto them.

Another straw man fallacy you have there, people agreeing or not with same sex marriage or respecting someone’s religious beliefs doesn’t involve any kind of participation or force teaming as is demanded by people who identify as something they’re quite clearly not. I have friends who hold religious beliefs, I hold none, at no point have they demanded that I pretend to believe in their religion in order to remain friends. Why on earth should affirmation of people’s delusions be expected of anyone?

Tell me you have no experience of working in a busy medical environment, without telling me you have no experience of working in a busy medical environment.

With all the pressure on the NHS at the moment and they are supposed to pander to this utter nonsense, give me a break!

Luxury belief 101.

@LadyBracknellsHandbagg r.e. same sex marriage sure it's relevant I would expect a medical professional to treat an individual of the same sex as married, regardless of their personal belief that marriage is a Christian sacrament between a man and a woman.

A different article, probably another you will dismiss as a straw man suggests religious beliefs impact on end of life care. That shouldn't.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-11083891

If you don't like these style of arguments, what possibly would convince you that medical professionals shouldn't be misgendering transgender patients?

Evidence it causes them to avoid healthcare? That it's distressing for them and that results in worse outcomes? That if first they agree that they aren't literally biological woman but find it helpful for gender dysphoria to be treated as such? Should they sign a "delusion disclaimer"?

R.e. "luxury belief" are you saying you wouldn't get a dying Catholic woman a priest for last rites? Because you are too busy and as an non Catholic you see it as pandering to utter nonsense? Who gets their beliefs respected in your view? Who is worthy of consideration?

I'm so bored of false equivalences and the lazy substituation of words like some sort of gotacha.

I don't know about you, but I am perfectly capable of thinking something that is reasonable in the context of one belief is not reasonable in the context of a totally different belief, because I think about what those beliefs actually are and what the implications of endorsing them are not just for the believer but for other people as well.

And for that reason, I am very sure that it is never ok to validate cross sex identities, even to be kind, because it goes beyond how one person sees themself and into validating sexist ideas that have no place being part of our culture.

Plus in this instance, dealing with a convicted criminal who was clearly aggressive and abusive.

Right so you and you alone personally are allowed to decide a medical professional should never use preferred pronouns because it "go beyond how one person sees themself and into validating sexist ideas that have no place being part of our culture."

You get to decide what is part of British culture and what is and isn't sexist. You've got no objective way of distinguishing between beliefs that are and aren't okay other than you say so and moaning about false equivalences. So you don't like trans, basically.

I presume like the nurse you are so entitled to your views you will completely ignore employer code of conducts for your own views.

I really hope you aren't a medical professional. I wouldn't want you treating me with that staggering level of arrogance. I'm not transgender and I'm an atheist.

@BeLemonNow people are allowed to disagree with you.

I agree and if religious people did try to coerce me to mouth obeisance to their creed I would push back in pretty strong terms.

Okay so you finally have a proper argument that you don't think anyone should be expected to use anything other than correct sex pronouns because supposedly it requires belief in something some don't believe in...

I don't incidentally agree that everyone who is transgender is delusional. But that's not central.

That still isn't an argument in favour of the nurse however, as she was required not to misgender under the NMC which I've quoted a section of. Noone is compelling her to become a nurse if it would require her to act contrary to her personal interpretation of Christianity.

You still need an argument that it's not acceptable for employers who are treating transgender individuals to require their employees not to misgender transgender patients. That's trickier. It's not a personal matter and they also have responsibilities to the transgender individuals and their needs.

That is what Mackereth v DWP considers.

There's broader issues in this case though:

• the way she approached her alleged religious objections with a patient rather than with management unlike Mackereth;
• releasing detailed medical information about the patient, which is what she was suspended for according to all reports.