Happy Birthday to the Irish Gender Recognition Act 2015!

[BeeSouriante]

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2015/act/25/enacted/en/html

Ten years ago the GRA 2015 was enacted - self-ID legislation far more progressive than anything even proposed in the UK, allowing trans people to get legal recognition for their gender. The skies did not fall in and many other European states have followed suit*

Keep embarrassing the socially conservative Brits, Ireland..Switzerland, Belgium, Denmark, Germany, Portugal etc etc

It is not so much about being 'socially conservative' , as much as we here in the U.K having forced a proper discussion of the issues involved. Many of those places just passed the legislation alongside gay equality legislation without the public being any the wiser. They will now live with the consequences. It is far easier to not pass poorly drafted legilation in the first instance, than to have to repeal and undo it at a later date. The U.K leads the way.

Nobody should be given official paperwork that is false. No man should have a government issued certificate that says he is a woman, because no man is a woman.

"Self-declaration in Denmark
Self-declaration was legislated for in Denmark in 2014. As we described in an article in Edinburgh Law Review, a report by the solicitors Dentons described it as one several countries where “changes to the law on legal gender recognition were put through at the same time as other more popular reforms such as marriage equality legislation.”

We noted in the same article that: We have been unable to find evidence that any mechanism was put in place for evaluating the impact of the change on the experience of women and girls, for example in relation to single sex services and spaces. This may reflect the wider context: in 2014 the European Agency for Fundamental Rights ranked Denmark as the EU country with the highest occurrence of male physical violence and sexual assault against women.

Discussing the hostile reaction in Denmark to this report, Leine, Mikkelsen and Sen (2019) argue that “the invizibilisation of Danish male violence, as well as the projection of sexual aggression onto minority communities, produces a peculiar politics of denial and denialism in Denmark.”

https://murrayblackburnmackenzie.org/2022/06/18/lessons-from-denmark/

"Here in Ireland we are watching events unfold in Scotland with a sense of dread. We recognise all too well, the unfortunate model of only hearing from one stakeholder group; those people who are trans identified, their lobby groups and their allies. We urge parliamentarians not to make the same mistakes that we made here in Ireland.

"We are living with the unintended consequences of the legislation which has no safeguarding whatsoever built in and is predicated on a fiction; that a person can fill out a form and change their sex. In Ireland, this has meant that a man convicted of threatening to murder then rape his own mother is currently being housed in a women’s prison," said The Countess women's group.

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/scotland-warned-not-follow-irelands-27302861

Some countries care a little more than others about women. Sadly Ireland doesn't have a very good record on that subject.

Yes, indeed. The Tuam babies dumped in their hundreds in a disused sewage tank just the latest in a never ending series of cruelty enacted upon women and children.

Legal recognition that they have special inner feelings? Bit weird, can I have a special government authorised certificate to say I like disco music?

More about the problems with the Irish GRA here.

Transgender prisoner policy delayed as officials struggle to find appropriate model – The Irish Times

The issue of the housing of transgender prisoners came to a head in early 2023 following the imprisonment of Barbie Kardashian, a transgender woman, for threats to torture, rape and murder.

In response to queries, an IPS spokesman said under the current system it must place prisoners in “whichever prison is specified by the court. All prisoners committed are accommodated in accordance with their legal gender”.

Rapists and other violent males can now get a certificate to say they are women and end up in women's prisons. The OP obviously has his own reasons for supporting this. Perhaps he could explain what they are, just so that we don't have to speculate.

Yet another TRA who presumably doesn't speak any language other than English so assumes that everything's hunky dory in other countries because they can't read or understand any local reporting that's not in English.

This article implies that the Irish government didn't have a clue what they were doing when they passed the GRA.

https://www.lawsociety.ie/gazette/top-stories/2019/10-october/male-bodied-transgender-inmate-housed-with-women-prisoners

Criminal defence lawyer Robert Purcell says that the Gender Recognition Act 2015 has placed the State in an impossible position with regard to transgender prisoners.

Currently, a pre-operative, pre-hormone therapy, male-to-female transgender prisoner is being held in Limerick women’s prison.

Robert Purcell is chair of the Law Society Criminal Law Committee: “The law that was enacted in 2015 did not envisage this situation, and it puts the Prison Service and the courts in a difficult position because, obviously, if somebody is self-declaring that they have to be recognised, then they have to be dealt with on that basis, even though physically, they have not have made the [physical] transformation.

“I don’t think the legislation envisaged the ability of transgender people to be able to self-declare; and it didn’t foresee the problems it would cause if a transgender, self-declared person was held in a mixed prison,” he said.

If this is an accurate quote, this seems quite astonishing. The Irish government passed a law which said that anyone could change their legally recognised sex, on demand, with no gatekeeping, i.e. self declare their sex, yet they didn't envisage "the ability of transgender people to be able to self-declare". What on earth did they think the legislation was designed to do?

What sort of government passes a self-declaration law but doesn't understand that this means that they have passed a self-declaration law?

How many of those governments have investigated the impact on womens participation in society now that everything incl sports and prisons, are miced sex?

Answer: none.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Keep embarrassing the socially conservative Brits, Ireland..Switzerland, Belgium, Denmark, Germany, Portugal etc etc

Can you explain this bit please @BeeSouriante , I don't understand what you're meaning.

Yeaaa

Male child rapist was one of the first to benefit.

Got his GRA about the same time as he was arrested for sexually and physically abusing a 5 year old.

And got sent to the only prison in the country with a mother and baby unit.

The Governments have been shitting themselves ever since worried that the child rapist would go to court to try force the Prison Officer Union to back down and allow their female members to be sexually harrassed at work.

Then the violent bar figher got governmental approval

And then the nice bloke who wants to stab and rape his mother

3 per 500 of a population turn out to be dangerous male given free access to what should be single sex female only spaces and services.

Shining example of nothing to see here.

@mumsnet could I get an explanation for why my post has been deleted?

I don't think tagging MN works?

Just guessing re the deletion but I imagine the reason was personal attack or something? I saw your comment and it wasn't. But some posters have thin skins...

That tag doesn't go anywhere. Report your deleted post and ask in the box if they could let you know why it was deleted.

And as for the 'yay for the Irish GRA!', two words.

Barbie Kardashian. And yes, he's got a GRC.

https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/courts/2024/10/23/prison-officer-left-terrified-by-inmates-threat-to-rape-her-trial-hears/

But according to Bee, it's 'socially conservative' to believe that this man should not be locked up with female prisoners.

Ah yes, Ireland, where the violent paedophile who threatened to rip his young victim’s arms and legs off to keep him quiet about the repeated rapes has his ‘identity’ respected and is placed in a low security women’s prison with a baby unit. Genius.

I think only a psychopath would celebrate a law that explicitly enabled that. I have to assume you are unaware of this OP?

Bingo.

I doubt the OP actually lives in Ireland, so has no idea how this is really playing out here. OP seems to spend their time spouting nonsense on MN.
This legislation was brought in by stealth, without public approval, hopefully it will be repealed in the next few years.

Aw Ireland! That bastion of women’s rights and freedoms! They seem to hate women and girls as much as Australia does.

Long live the UK, proud of TERF island 😁😁😁❤️ 🇬🇧

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cpwqnwrkd1go.amp

And yet men can still never become women.

TERF Island rocks! There’s even a book about it.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5373427-terf-island-the-book?utmcampaign=thread&utmmedium=appshare

What sort of government passes a self-declaration law but doesn't understand that this means that they have passed a self-declaration law?

A Confederacy of Dunces?