Page 2 | Interesting case re PBs in Australia

Justme56 · 2025-04-09T10:03:29+00:00

[[https://x.com/profpparkinson/status/1909863509779005644?s=46&t=ZX_bLozRqm8etdGICMcAvA https://x.com/profpparkinson/status/1909863509779005644?s=46&t=ZX_bLozRqm8etdGICMcAvA]] If you are not on X this is the actual report [[https://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/FedCFamC1F/2025/211.html https://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/FedCFamC1F/2025/211.html]] Parents go through bad divorce. Boy lives with mother. Mother claims child is dysphoric and affirms as girl. Wants PB’s, father doesn’t so ends up in court. It’s a really long read but covers lots of things from diagnosis, affirmation, conversion laws, mother’s actions (paragraphs 75+), Cass etc. Seems the judge isn’t impressed - very critical of clinicians, child is moved to father’s custody and no more visits to the gender service.

NotYourCisterinAus · 10/04/2025 12:29

<a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/2025.04.10-051005/www.theaustralian.com.au/health/medical/judge-lashes-child-gendermedicine-experts-in-blow-for-clinic/news-story/99255ab7dc3461bd5522f2a25ff32dec?amp&nk=02f5c7eafedf7036850aaa1adda2ec75-1744261811" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Judge lashes child gender-medicine experts

Article from today's Australian.

popefully · 10/04/2025 12:42

I haven't read the details of this Australian case beyond what's in this thread, but it reminds me of the Child J case in the UK from 2016.

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2016/2430.html

Flutterbees · 10/04/2025 13:25

NotNatacha · 09/04/2025 12:30

I know two people with family in Australia. The families don’t know each other and live far apart. The way they live their lives is completely different. One family lives in a state capital, the father working for a government agency, the other lived off-grid until their children were approaching secondary school age.

Both families have two daughters of secondary school age and no sons. One daughter in each family identifies as a boy. The parents are supportive and if the grandparents (who are the ones I know) have misgivings they would not express them to family, friends or outsiders. They have mentioned their grandchildren’s name changes to me, though, in a neutral way.

They are the only people I know with connections in Australia, apart from another family who only have much younger children.

It’s probably an odd coincidence.

I’m so confused about why you would post this. I live in Australia and don’t know any families with non-binary children or children who identify as the opposite gender to their biological sex. My children go to an all boys school and I teach at a girl’s school. What’s your point?

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 10/04/2025 15:05

nolongersurprised · 10/04/2025 11:21

I do feel sorry for her though. He was 12, I think, at the time of the judgment and she was still co-sleeping with him. Very enmeshed. She’ll be bereft, but for the child’s sake it’s the right decision.

As well as maintaining her social standing in the trans support group, I wonder if she wanted to trans him to stop him growing up?

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Co-sleeping with a 12 year old, that sounds horrendous, it's definitely not good for the child, it's a good job he's been removed from her care.

Helleofabore · 13/04/2025 21:07

NotNatacha · 09/04/2025 12:30

I know two people with family in Australia. The families don’t know each other and live far apart. The way they live their lives is completely different. One family lives in a state capital, the father working for a government agency, the other lived off-grid until their children were approaching secondary school age.

Both families have two daughters of secondary school age and no sons. One daughter in each family identifies as a boy. The parents are supportive and if the grandparents (who are the ones I know) have misgivings they would not express them to family, friends or outsiders. They have mentioned their grandchildren’s name changes to me, though, in a neutral way.

They are the only people I know with connections in Australia, apart from another family who only have much younger children.

It’s probably an odd coincidence.

Out of my friends in Australia, I have three families with teenagers with transgender identities. Although, I believe that one may have now desisted.

Maybe it is the age group of the children. Considering here in London, my teen at one stage had 5 friends (out of a group of 7 friends) with transgender identities. And those Australian friends have teens also.

Longdarkteatimeofthesoul · 14/04/2025 06:07

It seems to be a "teen thing", particularly those of a certain age. As an Aussie with a teen girl in the last year of school my Daughter has a handful of trans kids in her year level (about 200 kids). Less this year than last apparently and less last year than that before. My Daughter seems to think that it is not seen as "cool" or cutting edge anymore and those that still identify as trans are young people who are either on the spectrum or that dont really "fit" into any other scene or group or clique at school (often with self esteem issues). She also has friends at an all girls school near here and many of those girls identify as non-binary as that is still seen as cool there. Luckily trans kids must use the biologically appropriate facilities at her school etc and at a recent camp are not allowed to use the facilities and dorms of the gender they identify with.

I dont think we are much different here in the Antipodes - just a bit behind in recognizing the harm done to young people with pbs and the batshittery of much of the thinking behind it. We also have more of a captured govt - so despite the very heartening court ruling it seems we are still in the middle of it - possibly where the UK was a few years ago.

Helleofabore · 14/04/2025 06:20

“it seems to be a "teen thing”

I expect that has a significant impact. I have a friend in Australia who has friends with 20 something children who are non-binary. One of her friend’s daughters is NB and had a double mastectomy. So there are older age groups as well.

custardcreme · 14/04/2025 07:34

GraduationDay · 09/04/2025 15:00

Yes, the whole gambit. Though somewhat fortunately for the kids the anti vax mums do seem to be in the opposite camp to the transhausen mums, so at least the trans kids seem to be vaccinated and the unvaccinated get to keep their puberty… small mercies… I do find myself clutching at straws to stay in the conversation at ‘mum’s dinners’ with my utterly normal, seemingly reasonably content children with no allergies or major food aversions, no ‘dys’(ins. Bladibla ia), no psychotropic medication regime, no corrective pronouns, no unusual name spellings, etc etc. The most I can offer is that DD sometimes gets quite cross with me about chores and DS might one day need braces. Gawd no wonder 70s mothers were so bored if that’s all they had to talk about…

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Strike allergies from your list please unless you mean „allergies“. I can happily join in with a bit of competitive normality - also had my childhood in the 70s, largely left to my own devices (when devices meant something different) - but despite my and my family‘s solid commitment to averageness, we have a (now-adult) child with a severe nut allergy and it’s not something I would wish on anyone.

He had an allergic reaction last year and it was extremely frightening. I object to being lumped in with anti-vaxxers, Münchhausen-mums and child-transers!!

NumberTheory · 14/04/2025 08:54

GraduationDay · 09/04/2025 14:23

Thanks, super interesting and offers hope. Why does it so often seem to be the mothers who instigate this? What is it about women that has made us so vulnerable to this ideology with respect to children? I know many men seem to follow meekly along and the TRAs are mostly male, but why are so many mothers actively doing this to their kids? Attention? Approval? Community? You’d think a mother’s instinct to protect her children from harm would kick in somewhere, and override these other appeals. But somehow the alert system is being overridden by this. Like the Catholic Church did to mothers who sent their kids off to be altar boys. Or the scouts with their scout leaders who would with hindsight make anyone’s alarm bells go off. Somehow, these mothers have switched off their protective circuitry…

It’s nearly always the mothers in large part because fathers don’t care for young children to anything like the same extent.

I know women are also more pro-trans on average than men are. I’m not suggesting that isn’t also a big part of it. But when we’re talking about young children in enmeshed relationships who seem to be being led down this path - well, men almost never put their lives into their young children the way women do. Even when you have a SAHD, the mum is also usually far more involved than most fathers would be. When parents split up, young kids tend to stay with the mum far, far more than with the dad. And society validates women immersing themselves in their children in a way it doesn’t validate men doing the same.

So mainly the mothers because fathers have far less opportunity and more social barriers. Just as it’s mainly the mothers with virtually everything to do with children.

lcakethereforeIam · 14/04/2025 11:03

I came across this article just now and, although it's a bit derail-y and a few months old, I found it horrifying interesting. I don't recollect seeing it before and I thought it deserved to be more widely read. Hannah Barnes and her work are referenced, but not the Cass Review

https://quadrant.org.au/magazine/health/tyrants-of-trans-the-orwellian-echoes-of-affirmation/

It's about the situation in Australia. This thread was the best, recent fit I could find.

I've never come across 'Quadrant' before, apologies if they're evil.

If the above hasn't upset you enough, I also found this which was published a few days ago

https://quadrant.org.au/news-opinions/free-speech/in-victoria-free-speech-is-dead/

Tyrants of Trans: The Orwellian Echoes of ‘Affirmation’ - Quadrant

Fancy facing 'conversion therapy' charges? Just counsel a child that it's not a good idea to cut off penis or breasts

https://quadrant.org.au/magazine/health/tyrants-of-trans-the-orwellian-echoes-of-affirmation

Helleofabore · 14/04/2025 13:10

lcakethereforeIam · 14/04/2025 11:03

I came across this article just now and, although it's a bit derail-y and a few months old, I found it horrifying interesting. I don't recollect seeing it before and I thought it deserved to be more widely read. Hannah Barnes and her work are referenced, but not the Cass Review

https://quadrant.org.au/magazine/health/tyrants-of-trans-the-orwellian-echoes-of-affirmation/

It's about the situation in Australia. This thread was the best, recent fit I could find.

I've never come across 'Quadrant' before, apologies if they're evil.

If the above hasn't upset you enough, I also found this which was published a few days ago

https://quadrant.org.au/news-opinions/free-speech/in-victoria-free-speech-is-dead/

I have been sent updates on this legislation by a friend Cake. It is very concerning.

Helleofabore · 05/06/2025 15:23

https://archive.ph/ueN9h

"Judge Andrew Strum has criticised the evidence of gender medicine expert Dr Michelle Telfer and allowed publication of her name and of the Royal Children’s Hospital Melbourne following a landmark case."

Just adding this here.

It was Michelle Telfer and it was the RCHM. No surprises there. But great to see how that clinic was run being exposed. How many children harmed all for an ideological view on identity?

lcakethereforeIam · 05/06/2025 16:30

Good on the judge. Dr Telfer's remarks about Cass were disgraceful. It was excellent that Judge admonished her for them so strongly. I'd be tempted to quote the good bits but that would be the whole article so I'll limit myself to this

Health Minister Mark Butler earlier this year asked the National Health and Medical Research Council to undertake a comprehensive review of the Australian Standards of Care and Treatment Guidelines and to develop a new national framework.

Bring it on. I hope it's a genuine, uncaptured review.