Review "Six Conversations we're Scared to have"

[Igneococcus]

I hope this sharetoken works, my laptop has died a lonely death while I was away and I'm doing this from the phone.
Sarah Ditum review if Guilty Feminist book:
https://www.thetimes.com/article/325fffb2-2c93-4dc8-908f-8b9bf22f331a?shareToken

My analogy was clear.

If a person was fraudulently claiming to be disabled, should they be able to access provisions for disabled people? Yes or no?

What women’s provisions should not be sex based?

I wish I could identify out of my long-term health issues. "Socially defined" has very limited utility when you're describing disability.

And I don't think invisible disabilities are a great analogy for trans identity, which is almost always extremely visible.

In what way is a man a “social woman”?

Fishnets, head tilt, oversized fake boobs and yelling "it's ma'am" before demolishing the shop.

You know, like women.

@NecessaryScene🤣

(Sigh)

In the way I’ve explained so many times above

Nice transphobia - this is a celebrity-based caricature of trans people, who just want to live their lives.

Then if we are still asking, you haven’t articulated it clearly at all.

Start with how any male person can experience misogyny?

"Disability is the perfect example because disabilities are socially defined."

Not randomly, though. And not just on the basis of, "I feel like I am disabled." There are studies done to show that a condition is indeed a disability, including in the case of invisible disabilities.

Not only is there no such study about trans people, but there cannot even be. What would such a study observe? Are trans women biological female? No. Then what else? Being a woman is not about behaviour, or interests, or anything observable or measurable.

So really, your analogy is like if a random group of disabled and able people got together and decided that, "Having blue eyes is a disability." Predictably, other disabled people would go to court to fight this, and in the end, it would have to be clearly stated that no, having blue eyes is not a disability.

"For a long time, those with invisible disabilities were not considered allowed to use disabled facilities. "

Which wasn't fair because they do have a disability. That's not at all the same as not having a disability and self-determining that you can go into the disabled toilets anyway.

But in order to protect the privacy of transwomen with a GRC, we would have to treat all men as potentially having a GRC if we want to make sure transwomen can be treated as women in certain circumstances.

Even if we say “forget the paperwork - all transwomen should be treated as women regardless of whether or not they have a GRC”, you can’t assume that someone does or doesn’t identify as a woman because of their clothes or hairstyle, etc. And if we follow the argument in the GRA, it would be a breach of a trans person’s privacy to ask them how they identify.

So in order to ensure we don’t discriminate against any transwoman who chooses to present in jeans and a shirt with short hair and could easily be mistaken for a man, we would have to assume that any man might in fact identify as a woman.

On this basis, we would be compelled to let every man into women’s spaces so that we don’t inadvertently discriminate against a non-passing transwoman.

Nice transphobia - this is a celebrity-based caricature of trans people, who just want to live their lives.

Lol - "trans people" - as if you don't know what sex I'm describing!

And in what way "celebrity-based"? We've been listening to trans people for years, and that is the way we've repeatedly seen transwomen wanting to live their lives.

Sure, they're not all that bad, but from observation it's a far more accurate caricature than your caricature of women, if you're describing what they do as "social women".

Link to it then. Because otherwise it just looks like you are deliberately avoiding answering.

How does a male become a “social woman”? What things have to be present or happen?

So far from @Onetimeonlyftw ’s description, what I can gather is that one particular group of male people who are considered vulnerable, are to be treated as if they are female because they are vulnerable male people.

Why should that group of male people get additional privileges that no other group of male people get?

It’s not really all that “feminist”, is it?

Presumably if men can become this yet-to-be-defined “social woman” that means men can also become a “social lesbian” which would be someone who is a “social woman” (yet to be defined) who is attracted to other “social women”.

And yet somehow it isn’t homophobic to say men can be lesbians…

Those male people who have identified as little girls, are they also to be considered ‘social’ children?

If not, why not? Why only ‘socially women’ not ‘socially children’?

Well, you haven’t really

could you describe the characteristics shared by the people in the social category ‘woman’? I think that would help people understand

Yes - is “Stefonknee” a 6 year old girl? Is he a woman? He surely is in your world @Onetimeonlyftw

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/transgender-father-stefonknee-wolscht-who-left-family-to-be-a-sixyearold-girl-uses-child-s-play-to-escape-adult-life-a6775051.html

Perimenopause sucks.

That would be helpful. I'd not heard the phrase 'social woman ' before and an.expansion would be helpful. And/or what the political category means.

No time to read the thread since I last contributed in March, but I wanted to make sure that everyone knew about Deborah Frances-White's total car crash of an interview on Triggernometry, which I'm just over halfway through, with regular breaks for gin:

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In the comments several people pointed out something that I was aware of — that much of the authentic, untainted aboriginal culture that she relies so heavily on was actually imported and invented from the 1970s onwards. Including the brotherboy-sistergirl concept which she uses to explain why sex is a spectrum. And the famous aboriginal dot paintings, which were introduced by a French-born art teacher who taught students to paint like the Impressionists.

There is something about her — the over-confidence, the passive aggression, the assumption she knows everything and there is nothing useful anyone can add — that reminds me of a friend who had a mental health crisis recently. I've always despised her for her chutzpah in calling herself a feminist when she's not, but I actually felt quite sorry for her watching her on this. She's completely out of her depth.

Regarding “Stefoknee” - using this example is a kind of bad faith rhetorical approach. Most trans women are ordinary people living adult lives—working and contributing to society.

Using a single, highly unusual case to invalidate an entire group is like using a fringe conspiracy theorist to discredit all covid scientists.

Rose West was a women - are all women like her? Would you have wanted to share a prison cell with her?

Thanks for coming back to the thread @Onetimeonlyftw

I think it would really help people to understand where you're coming from if you could tell us a bit more about the social category 'woman'. if you look at or speak to a person, how do you determine if you think they're a member of that group for example?

Beautiful 👏