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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Governor of California Changes His Tune: He Agrees Men and Boys Don't Belong In Women's Sports

64 replies

Delphinium20 · 06/03/2025 20:55

I always believed it would be sports that would peak the U.S. Terf Island has your women's rights activists (love them!) and non-profit medicine (Cass Report). Americans have their sense of fairness for all, especially in sports. If the governor of the largest state in the country ( $4.2 trillion GDP, an economy larger than most countries including the UK), has just said he thinks it's grossly unfair for boys to be in girls' sports, well, that's a pretty big deal.

Newsom can be critiqued for a lot (he put men in women's prisons and supported keeping secret children's transitions from their parents) but his change indicates a massive shift for the Democrats. He, obviously, wants to be president, so he's staking his "I was here first" claim on a topic that he's fully aware shows Americans are 70-80% against transwomen in women's sports. Yes, feminists said it first, but I'll take this win if it means Democrats can stop pretending men can be women. It's obnoxious we had to lose to Trump to get here, but I'm celebrating today.

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20250306183716/www.nytimes.com/2025/03/06/us/politics/gavin-newsom-transgender-sports-democrats.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://web.archive.org/web/20250306183716/www.nytimes.com/2025/03/06/us/politics/gavin-newsom-transgender-sports-democrats.html

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 07/03/2025 14:39

'Politico has not one, not two, but FIVE reporters covering the fallout of Gavin Newsom’s comments about men in women’s sports during my interview with him. Lori Lightfoot says he’s “disgusting.” Sacramento is in an uproar. Democrats all over the country say that this issue is a litmus test for the party going forward. Democrats simply cannot handle taking an L in the culture war.

https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1897800116138131480

https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1897800116138131480

SionnachRuadh · 07/03/2025 14:53

Lori Lightfoot. My word.

Being denounced by the worst mayor in Chicago's history is exactly the kind of reaction Newsom will have wanted to provoke.

TheFlyingHorse · 07/03/2025 14:54

ArabellaScott · 07/03/2025 14:39

'Politico has not one, not two, but FIVE reporters covering the fallout of Gavin Newsom’s comments about men in women’s sports during my interview with him. Lori Lightfoot says he’s “disgusting.” Sacramento is in an uproar. Democrats all over the country say that this issue is a litmus test for the party going forward. Democrats simply cannot handle taking an L in the culture war.

https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1897800116138131480

The hyperbole in that Politico piece is absolutely unhinged. All about how hurt the trans children will be but no consideration for safety and fairness for women.

miri1985 · 07/03/2025 16:26

Amazing isn't it that they can't look over the pond and see how no debate went in the UK. If you declare that even talking about the issue means that you hate trans children that doesn't shut down the conversation but it shows that you have no argument as to why this is fair.

I would respect them so much more if they just admitted that its not fair but that they've chosen to prioritise trans children as a form of affirmative action. Affirmative action is incredibly politically unpopular but I'd respect them much more if they just admitted what they were up to instead of making bad faith arguments about hatred or genital inspections

kiterunning · 07/03/2025 17:36

Wow this could be a game changer.
At last the tide is turning within the Democrat Party.

Delphinium20 · 07/03/2025 18:10

“It’s disgusting,” said Lori Lightfoot, the former Chicago mayor. “There are kids waking up today in California with this news thinking that their governor hates them, and rightly so.”

Frankly, I put a great deal of blame on the adults who tell children that people hate them for their gender identity. This is top-down and is a form of psychological abuse. The vast, vast majority of people do not hate children or young adults caught up in this, especially when it's obvious they may have ASD or ADHD or are just quirky or possibly gay. Many of us see the trans children who've gone through abuse or a traumatic event and have nothing but compassion for them. We don't hate children because we don't want them to cheat (boys in girls' sports) or we don't want them given puberty blockers and hormones.

I do, however, hate the adults who spout these claims.

OP posts:
Helleofabore · 07/03/2025 19:50

Has this been shared? Apologies if it has

https://www.axios.com/2025/03/07/senate-democrats-transgender-womens-sports

Senate Democrats punt on trans rights in women's sports

It is an interesting read. Here also is Cathy Devines tweets about it.

x.com/cathydevine56/status/1897992308416450892?s=46

'Democrats privately admit they need a sharper response to counter Republican attacks on their support for transgender rights, especially when it involves sports.'

'Some Senate Democrats agreed with Newsom on the sports fairness issue, but they said to be careful that the overall conversation doesn't demonize transgender athletes. They also want to avoid federal overreach.'

It's interesting that 'The Democratic messaging effort has been spearheaded by Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-Wis.)'
'Baldwin, the first openly gay person elected to the Senate, faced a barrage of attacks on the topic in her 2024 reelection campaign.'

She seems to have accepted this is an issue. But says 'I trust parents, schools and local sports leagues to make these decisions for their children'. This is a cop out. It means those with the loudest voices will win out.

Parents, schools & local sports leagues should not have to weigh the scientific evidence & navigate tricky political & lobbying waters, school by school & league by league. We already know girls are silenced in this debate.

Please learn from the UK. @SenateDems need to take a leadership position. Come out calmly & clearly for fairness & safety for women & girls in sex-affected sports. In contrast with Republicans insist on anti-bullying policies for boys & men with trans identities in male sport.

As for:
'There's no one set of facts.'
Er ... yes there is. Males take M performance advantage into F sport. Even if T suppressed.
'These are going to be pretty complicated situations.' No. They really are not. There are 2 sexes & 2 sex categories. For very good reasons.

-end-

SnoopyPajamas · 08/03/2025 00:01

Ah, one of the wonders of the natural world - the reversing ferret

SnoopyPajamas · 08/03/2025 00:03

The rarely-spotted Blue Californian variety, no less. My, my.

Lovelyview · 08/03/2025 09:16

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz03ye4j8rzo

BBC report. I actually found Newsom's admission that Trump's they/them campaign was 'devastating' even more significant.

'The governor referred to a viral Trump campaign ad that had the tagline: "Kamala is for they/them. President Trump is for you."
"It was devastating," Newsom said. "And she didn't even react to it, which was even more devastating.'

Sounds like someone within the Democrats has admitted that this issue was one of the major reasons Trump won. They seem to have been in complete denial up to now.

Gavin Newsom speaking at an event wearing a white button-down shirt and suit jacket

California's Gavin Newsom says trans athletes in female sports 'deeply unfair'

Gavin Newsom faces a backlash from within his party as he agrees with a conservative activist on the cultural issue.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz03ye4j8rzo

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/03/2025 09:36

BBC report. I actually found Newsom's admission that Trump's they/them campaign was 'devastating' even more significant.

'The governor referred to a viral Trump campaign ad that had the tagline: "Kamala is for they/them. President Trump is for you."
"It was devastating," Newsom said. "And she didn't even react to it, which was even more devastating.'

Sounds like someone within the Democrats has admitted that this issue was one of the major reasons Trump won. They seem to have been in complete denial up to now.

Wow! That's progress.

Helleofabore · 08/03/2025 10:18

Ereshkigalangcleg · 08/03/2025 09:36

BBC report. I actually found Newsom's admission that Trump's they/them campaign was 'devastating' even more significant.

'The governor referred to a viral Trump campaign ad that had the tagline: "Kamala is for they/them. President Trump is for you."
"It was devastating," Newsom said. "And she didn't even react to it, which was even more devastating.'

Sounds like someone within the Democrats has admitted that this issue was one of the major reasons Trump won. They seem to have been in complete denial up to now.

Wow! That's progress.

It is really interesting.

It is like watching the realisation that gender identity theory was being rejected as the priority over sex when sex matters is a universal belief (ie it is across the political divide) dawn on some MPs influential in the Labour Party.

CaveMum · 08/03/2025 10:22

Looks like someone from the “left” (let’s face it, most Dems would be considered centre right in the UK) is throwing their hat in the ring for 2028.

However, I really do think it would be a mistake for them to nominate another Californian - the Republicans will tar them with the “liberal coastal elite” brush. Whether we like it or not, the next Democratic nominee needs to be white, straight, male and location-wise from “one of the ones in the middle”.

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:30

According to an opinion survey in January by the New York Times/Ipsos, almost all Republicans and nearly seven in 10 Democrats oppose allowing transgender female athletes to participate in women's sports.

Well, well.

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:49

https://nypost.com/2025/01/19/us-news/nyt-poll-finds-majority-of-democrats-oppose-transgender-athletes-in-womens-sports/

Article on the poll.

Data here (scroll down, a link at the bottom that says 'topline' has the survey data in pdf:

https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/heading-trumps-second-term-americans-are-deeply-divided

Some relevant questions:

Society has gone too far in accommodating transgender people - 49%

Society has not gone far enough in accommodating transgender people - 21%

On puberty blockers:

Yes, minors ages 10 to 18 should have access - 10%

No one under age 18 should have access 71%

It's a very interesting survey and well worth a read. The top five issues reported as central concerns to voters were: economy, health care, immigration, taxes, crime.

People saw Democrat priorities as: Abortion; gay/lesbian/trans policy; climate change ; state of democracy; economy

People saw Republican priorties as: Immigration; economy; taxes; guns; abortion.

NYT poll finds majority of Democrats oppose transgender athletes in women’s sports

The issue drew widespread opposition in 2024.

https://nypost.com/2025/01/19/us-news/nyt-poll-finds-majority-of-democrats-oppose-transgender-athletes-in-womens-sports/

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:50

Obviously I haven't disaggregated for voting intent/political leaning, but the survey does and that is also very interesting!

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:53

Helleofabore · 08/03/2025 10:18

It is really interesting.

It is like watching the realisation that gender identity theory was being rejected as the priority over sex when sex matters is a universal belief (ie it is across the political divide) dawn on some MPs influential in the Labour Party.

Yes.

Also what is key is that so many kept saying 'it's a niche issue, nobody really cares that much' - well, yes. Most people don't have 'gender' issues in their top five. However, they see the Democrats as having them as their number two priority.

Whether that's because the Democrats actively campaigned on those issues, or just failed to respond to the issues properly is another question.

Take note, Labour. Staying sheepishly coy and silent and trying to swerve the crucial questions at the heart of the issue does not help you! The sex fudge is way past its sell by date, and nobody is buying it.

If you want the trust of the majority and the votes of the majority, you are going to need to face the issues head on.

RoyalCorgi · 08/03/2025 10:55

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:53

Yes.

Also what is key is that so many kept saying 'it's a niche issue, nobody really cares that much' - well, yes. Most people don't have 'gender' issues in their top five. However, they see the Democrats as having them as their number two priority.

Whether that's because the Democrats actively campaigned on those issues, or just failed to respond to the issues properly is another question.

Take note, Labour. Staying sheepishly coy and silent and trying to swerve the crucial questions at the heart of the issue does not help you! The sex fudge is way past its sell by date, and nobody is buying it.

If you want the trust of the majority and the votes of the majority, you are going to need to face the issues head on.

It really takes some chutzpah for a political party to say "voters don't care about this issue" while aggressively pushing this very issue.

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 11:03

Yes. The disconnect there was 'people don't care, therefore they don't care what we do on the issue'.

The reality looks closer to 'people don't care, therefore they see us as being ridiculously out of touch for our actions on the issue'.

But I think more than that, it's not that the majority of people care so much about, say, men going to women's prisons (I find it utterly galling, but you'll see it often enough on here, people shrug about that kind of injustice as it doesn't directly affect them).

But if you are claiming that men can become women, you are undermining the most basic trust that voters require in order to take you seriously.

You may as well campaign on a flat earth basis as on a TWAW basis.

In fact, it's worse, because while the earth looks roughly flat to most people, most people are very, very aware that men are not women.

It's an astonishing attempt to upend the most basic elements of reality and understanding. I'm not sure if it's some kind of brainwarp or just actual group chutzpah in successfully undermining 'norms', or what. But somehow, chunks of the populace were convinced for a fairly sustained period of time that it was good, kind, rational and reasonable to chant 'men are women' repeatedly, over and over, and attack anyone who didn't agree.

I suppose that's the point - it's a faith based position, dependent on obedience and willingness to state the absurd.

Helleofabore · 08/03/2025 11:13

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 11:03

Yes. The disconnect there was 'people don't care, therefore they don't care what we do on the issue'.

The reality looks closer to 'people don't care, therefore they see us as being ridiculously out of touch for our actions on the issue'.

But I think more than that, it's not that the majority of people care so much about, say, men going to women's prisons (I find it utterly galling, but you'll see it often enough on here, people shrug about that kind of injustice as it doesn't directly affect them).

But if you are claiming that men can become women, you are undermining the most basic trust that voters require in order to take you seriously.

You may as well campaign on a flat earth basis as on a TWAW basis.

In fact, it's worse, because while the earth looks roughly flat to most people, most people are very, very aware that men are not women.

It's an astonishing attempt to upend the most basic elements of reality and understanding. I'm not sure if it's some kind of brainwarp or just actual group chutzpah in successfully undermining 'norms', or what. But somehow, chunks of the populace were convinced for a fairly sustained period of time that it was good, kind, rational and reasonable to chant 'men are women' repeatedly, over and over, and attack anyone who didn't agree.

I suppose that's the point - it's a faith based position, dependent on obedience and willingness to state the absurd.

Edited

I suppose that's the point - it's a faith based position, dependent on obedience and willingness to state the absurd.

Yes. And at a time when people have so little confidence in politicians and governments, that they are involved in pushing this ‘obedience’, it is remarkable that any political party thinks this was a good long term strategy.

borntobequiet · 08/03/2025 11:34

I’m pretty sure I’ve said it before, but most people are pretty clear where they stand on the “big issues” and will vote accordingly. It’s the undecided or unsure who are most easily swayed by “smaller” but easier to understand issues, or issues where they have personal experience, of which this is one. Hence its effectiveness in the election campaign. There are literally millions of parents of girl athletes in the US.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 08/03/2025 12:12

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 10:53

Yes.

Also what is key is that so many kept saying 'it's a niche issue, nobody really cares that much' - well, yes. Most people don't have 'gender' issues in their top five. However, they see the Democrats as having them as their number two priority.

Whether that's because the Democrats actively campaigned on those issues, or just failed to respond to the issues properly is another question.

Take note, Labour. Staying sheepishly coy and silent and trying to swerve the crucial questions at the heart of the issue does not help you! The sex fudge is way past its sell by date, and nobody is buying it.

If you want the trust of the majority and the votes of the majority, you are going to need to face the issues head on.

sex fudge

Is there a recipe for this sex fudge?

ArabellaScott · 08/03/2025 12:22

Sex Fudge

1 lb self righteous flour
Half a cup queered butter
500 oz feigned ignorance
2 tonnes doublespeak
Spoon of TeQUILA - worm optional
generous handful of humptydumpty
dash of bluster

Assemble ingredients in the form of tame interviewers, preferably in context of Drag Race or other affirming event during Our Endless Month of Pride.

Assume pained expression.

Assure viewers we have always been on the side of real women, including the real certified women with the special feelings.

Mix well. Throw in general direction of the electorate. Run.

TheKeatingFive · 08/03/2025 12:42

Very interesting. He seems slightly more politically astute than the others, so fair play to him for that.

However, I'm not sure of the wisdom of running another Californian candidate.