Has anyone considered the impact on women's mental health?

[teentantrums]

I know that there is a real and compelling argument for shutting males out of female spaces as a physical safeguarding measure but I wondered whether there has been any research into what this immense change being foisted on to us is doing to women's mental health? I spoke to a young activist this week who insisted that women should just accept that trans women are women and be prepared to shower and change with them - how?? This never seems to be addressed. How are we meant to override our instincts even if we all agreed that overriding them would be good for everyone (which it clearly is not!)

On a personal level, gender ideology and the way it attempts to rewrite what being female means and the aggressiveness with which it seeks to eliminate free thought has had a very negative effect on my own mental health. And it seems that it is very difficult to even seek help regarding this as so many therapists will not discuss the issue or worse, actively assert that it is wrong not to believe TWAW. Just wondered whether the psychological impact on women is discussed at all.

Excellent points

Telling people back is white and 2+2=5 is never going to be good for mental health

And those are abstract examples that do not impinge upon feelings of personal safety.

Aren't we supposed to just "be kind" and "reframe our trauma"?

I'm caught (as always).
I'm 20 and "supposed" to be woke and pro-trans. Well, I'm not anti-trans if that's the way somebody wants to go -- BUT I am not showering or changing within sight of anyone with a penis!

The definition of coercive control is always useful when considering the actions and words of those trying to remove safeguards from women and children:

"Coercive control refers to continuous patterns of behaviour that are intended to exert power or control over someone. These behaviours deprive people of their independence and can make them feel isolated or scared. This can have a serious impact on their day-to-day life and wellbeing".

I think the mental health piece is caught up very much in the understanding by people whoare trying to protect women's spaces that it's NOT just about physical safety, but also emotional safety. We can mostly agree that many trans people are not going to be physically abusive in our spaces, but we still don't want them there becuase it is scary and uncomfortable for all of us.

It's actually one of the arguments I make often becuase so often I hear people say, "But why would you force a trans woman to use a men's changing room when it would make her so uncomfortable" and I reply, "but why shoudl I, or 10 year old DD, be uncomfortable, as well as the other 20 women in the space at any given moment?"

This is one reason why this is not a human or civil rights movement. The impact on women's mental health and on safeguarding is catastrophic.
And this is being done at the same time as other negative incidents such as the Pelicot trial, and several high profile murders which also have a negative impact on our feelings of security and mental well being.

How are we meant to override our instincts even if we all agreed that overriding them would be good for everyone

This is what I really struggle with.
I've never peaked because I've never for one second felt that TWAW.
In any way. Ever. In any scenario.
I'm not hateful or scared. It just does not compute.
Why couldnt it be accepted for what it is - rejection of arbitrary gender nonsense which harms everyone. I could so wholeheartedly support that.

I'm definitely opressed regarding what (truths) I can say at work. I feel very negative and frustrated by all the policies citing gender, not sex, and a transwoman taking up 25% of the presentation on international woman's day agenda.
I see Sandie Peggie being told to 'get undressed or fuck off' by a huge public body and it makes me scared and angry.

Not great for my MH but who gives a shit.

It’s institutionalised gaslighting, with the state acting as a coercive and malicious partner towards women.

Of course it’s bad for our mental health, as we either submit to the gaslighting and feel worthless or rebel and are judged, punished and shunned.

I've been sexually assaulted in a female changing room by a biological male presenting as a woman.

I get annoyed when people tell me I have to "be kind" and "be inclusive" of people with penises who want to be in female safe spaces.

If a man walked into a female space, it would be a natural reaction to be scared. Somehow we've got to turn these gut reactions off and be accepting of biological men who claim they are women in our spaces.

The safety of women and children should be a much higher priority than validating the feelings of men who think they are women.

The problem trans Beaumont Society at one point were saying that they'd been some sort of survey / research on the partners of men who transitioned.

It came up with a astronomical rate of them having a psychological breakdown.

When I saw this, my jaw hit the floor. This was dated mid 90s I think and even in the years since I saw it referenced (a few years back), I've struggled to find it again. All information on it seems to have disappeared.

It was referenced and sourced on MN so if you can find it on here please do so and let me know where it is.

Since seeing that, I have had big question marks over the impact on family members.

We know that the patterns for trans widows look very similar to coercive control and we know that mental health problems are related to coercive control and emotional abuse.

We also know identity formation issues are related to mental health issues.

I have been saying for some time that since we know these things we really should be looking at the mental health impact on various other groups APART from trans.

Everything is so obsessed with trans that everyone else in the world, is forgotten. And to hell with the consequences. That's so fucked up.

As someone who has gone through mental and emotional and other intimate partner abuse, I do find the distorting of reality and the treading on eggshells really stressful (triggering even, to use genz speak).

I work in HE. I have lots of trans students. I often slip up with the pronouns. I find it really hard. I also don't want to share toilets with male bodied students. Not because I fear them but for my own dignity and frankly hygiene standards. I hate the assumption at work that everyone is on board with pronouns and sharing our spaces and so on. I hate that I can't be myself or speak my mind. It is psychologically stressful.

Completely agree with all of this, but then, when was women’s mental health EVER prioritised?

If it had been, we wouldn’t have ended up with the society we have. With most women doing the second shift and STILL behind men in pay and opportunities.

The whole thing’s a fucking scandal. The trans bullshit is the bridge too far, though.

So OP, no, women’s mental health hasn’t been considered in this and won’t be. They’ll just shout ‘bigot’ and expect that to cow us into submission once again.

Lol no of course not! Why would anyone bother to consider the impact on the support humans??

my mental health, like many here, has at times really really struggled with this. Just knowing that men and women happily signed away women’s rights without a second thought because a tiny amount of men would be sad if they didn’t get what they demanded shook my confidence in public institutions and private bodies to the core. The fact that so many supposedly intelligent people are prepared to straight up lie and be clown themselves about something so basic is fucking terrifying.

I actually know someone (a woman and TRA "ally") who believes that women should have therapy to "counsel" them to override their instincts on this, which she claims are "irrational".

I don't even know where to begin with such coercive, abusive, cult-like and misogynist bullshit.

She claims to be a feminist too...

Nobody gives a shit about womens' mental health.

I have a growing discomfort in moving through the world. Some of it is articulated in what's happening to Sandie Peggie.

Other sources are the ambient horror of Everard, Pelicot, the current wretchedness of the anaesthetist in France.

So many Police Forces seem to have abandoned all notion of policing by consent or an understanding of the social contract. Likewise the CS and the NHS.

So many safeguarding lapses tolerated in the name of supporting the patriarchy.

They don't care. They want women to put up and shut up. If that impacts women's mental health then so what?

They won't consider women's mental health until they accept that women have minds.

The loss of faith in nearly every institution, government, much of the media, and huge chunks of the populace? Watching the NHS, Amnesty, Liberty, DofE, The Guardian, banks, academia, Science magazine, the police, the judiciary, the prison service, leading writers, artists, musicians, push dangerous narratives, or absurd mantras, gaslight, defame, attack and smear feminists?

Losing faith in frankly much of society and seeing the chasm of sexism as well as the enormous damage done to women by men since the dawn of history, and knowing that my daugher now faces this gauntlet in a climate where she will be condemned if she's not KIND enough about it all?

Yeah. It's not good.

Mind you, admit to any of this and the ready-made label of 'hysterical woman' awaits.

I'm fine. Totally fine.

That is shocking. I don't know where you start with someone like that.

That women should 'reframe' our trauma was - and probably still is - the line held by Rape Crisis Scotland.

thecritic.co.uk/reframe-your-trauma/

@YorkshirePuddingsGreatestFan
I'm so sorry to hear what happened to you.
The safety of women and children should be a much higher priority than validating the feelings of men who think they are women.
You'd think so, wouldn't you? So many people are outright saying women and girls count for nothing. This is part of why it's so depressing. I never knew so many people felt this way.

It's definitely affected my mental health. I hate the second guessing that goes on daily. For example, in the gym today there was a man dressed in what might be interpreted as female attire (except no woman would dress so outlandishly to go to the gym) and could only stop worrying about him until I saw him enter the men's changing room.

And as for the madness that all the institutions and people outlined by @ArabellaScott earlier say that they believe (do they? can they? are they insane or am I?) how is it possible?

I am reading "Unkind" by Victoria Smith and she really nails it.
Women are supposed to be the kind, the caring ones so just be a good girl and let the nice trans in your spaces.
Just another way to shut us down and keep controlling us.
Who cares if we spend our lives tying ourselves in knots to kep the peace!