Taliban: NGOs employing women will be banned & building should not have windows that women can be seen

[IwantToRetire]

In the latest crackdown on women’s rights in Afghanistan, the Taliban have announced they will no longer allow any national or foreign NGOs that employ women to operate in the country. In a letter published on social platform X on Sunday night, the Economy Ministry said NGOs that do not comply with the new rule will lose their licenses to operate.
Full article https://www.france24.com/en/asia-pacific/20241230-ngos-employ-afghan-women-face-closure-new-taliban-rule

Afghanistan's Taliban leader has ordered that new residential buildings are constructed without windows looking onto "places usually used by women" and said that existing windows with such views should be blocked to prevent "obscene acts".
Full article https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20241229-taliban-leader-bans-windows-overlooking-women-s-areas

It's free rein. Doesn't refer to monarchs but to letting a horse have its head. Sorry, I see this misspelling so often.

The total control when mixed with an utterly misogynistic ideology is deadly to women. At the moment Islam is the outstanding example.

It is hard to imagine how anyone in the west could have any impact on the attitude and beliefs of the Taliban.

And it is worth remembering, that within families many men, sons, brothers, husbands share the views of the Taliban. This is partly why they are able to go to the extremes they are. Families are happy to enforce it.

Just as some countries who claim to be Christian practice it in a more extreme way than others do, it is no different in countries where Islam is the main religion. They do so at different levels.

It would need someone with a far greater knowledge of the history of the region to suggest what that might be. Whether partly a very public way of rejecting an over reaching west, it still doesn't explain how this is happening (and has in the past).

Not on the same level, but how did Scotland finish up with a Government that so totally swalled the trans agenda, and apparently with the support of many in Scotland. It was only because the UK Government question their right to implement self id etc., that they were stopped.

There is no equivilent political mechanism to stop the Taliban from doing what they want.

I wonder if many women & girls were self-harming/commiting suicide and that is behind the restrictions becoming tighter and tighter. In a few decades there won't be many women who haven't experienced slavery their entire lives.
There's no way they could help themselves without any understanding that life could or should be so different.
It makes my blood run cold the abuse that must happen behind closed doors.

This latest edict stinks of panic - when you see this level of control on an already repressed population, it means something is going very wrong elsewhere.

At a guess, economics. Yes, we can't influence the Taliban but they have no major trade inflows and most aid has stopped. On top of that, there is a border skirmish with Pakistan, a resurgence of ISIS and problems in a lot of tribal areas where farmers are reverting to opium production.

I think it was more likely that they were messaging each other through windows.

The Women's Rights Network who are raising awareness and spreading the word about what is happening to Afghan women want us to boycott.

Then we boycott.

It's worth saying that in SA when all the various boycotts were happening, different sectors cared about different things. The British descent SA and the Boer descent SA people were focused on money and political power respectively. Very broadly (and poorly remembered). So boycotting wine/fruit and sport/free Nelson Mandela targeted different sectors of society.

Cricket may work on certain people. But heroin, I don't know. I believe in wholesale legalisation and I suppose that would mean proper supply chains. Less cash for the Taliban. Get it from Northern Thailand, rather than Myanmar or Afghanistan.

I've put out a request to the RAWA and WRN Afghanistan on twitter as to what they would like us to do, how we can support them. Last time i asked was a few months ago and the answer was boycott as much as poss and pressure our own governments and organisations (like the ICC) into making public statements about how this is apartheid and how it should not be tolerated. and for sports organisations to boycott.

The Taliban, btw, have also introduced severe punishments to any men who facilitate access to smart phones and the like for women, so there is very little help expected there.

I think at this point organisations like RAWA and WRNA are very well aware of the harms that will happen to women whatever we in the west do. The difference is that they would like us to be their voices. I think that is the VERY least our governments can do. Especially governments who participated in military actions over there and then left without a backward glance (to be fair: hard to see what else they could do)

And much as it pains me - i want to see our countries sending men back to Afghanistan and refusing asylum or support. If we don't have Afghan women getting out of there, then we don't accept the men. Controversial view i know, and it makes me uncomfortable to actually articulate that. But it has been at the back of my mind for a while now. (in my home town a pub building that has been empty and falling derelict for about 20 years is to be turned into a meeting-place/cultural centre for Afghans living there. I really really want the council to ensure that Afghan women have equal access to it, and women's areas where they can receive support they may need.)

ETA to add: agree wholeheartedly with @MrsTerryPratchett that different groups want different things. And that is fine because a multi-pronged approach is going to be a) more effective and b) attract more support. People who don't feel they can stand with women on this, may feel more able to stand with cricket teams on this issue etc etc.

I honestly don't think the plight of women is anywhere near the top of any government's agenda. There won't be anything like the support there was for boycotts of SA imports. I am old enough to remember the massive coverage of apartheid and how exercised politicians were and how we all got involved.
As pp have said, what can we boycott other than cricket? There isn't much else.

Filia have written to the English Cricket Board and the ICC.
https://www.filia.org.uk/latest-news/2024/12/31/cricket-and-womens-liberation-afghanistan

Excerpt

We urge the England Cricket Board to withdraw the England team from the forthcoming match against Afghanistan on 26th February, which is scheduled as part of the International Cricket Council Men’s Champions Trophy 2025 tournament. To go ahead with this match, while the Afghanistan government further restricts women’s rights and the ability to have any social existence, implies that the Board and the team are unconcerned about the denial of the most basic human rights for female people.
It has now been announced that there must be no possibility of women being seen by men in courtyards, kitchens, or at a well, and therefore no windows in new buildings should look out over such areas, and where such windows currently exist they must be blocked. We cannot believe that the England Cricket Board regards such extreme restrictions on women as reasonable, and to go ahead with the match would be understood as validation of the Afghanistan regime and its extreme restrictions on women’s lives. The Afghanistan women’s cricket team, formed in late 2020, fled Afghanistan in fear of their lives in 2021 when the Taliban regained control. To support these brave women, the England men’s team must refuse to play the only team that now represents the country. We are writing also to the International Cricket Council, in the hope that they will cancel Afghanistan’s participation in the tournament. However, whether or not this happens, we hope the England Cricket Team will signal the UK’s abhorrence of the appalling treatment of women in that country and withdraw from the match.

Extraordinary Women from the Golden Age of Muslim Civilisation
https://www.1001inventions.com/womens-day/

It is a travesty.

These women in the anrticle are from a little later than the time of Mohammed. Does anyone know about or have pictures of 7th Century Muslim women, who would have been living at the same time as Mohammed and presumably following his edicts?

Maybe if the Taliban could be shown that
they have got it wrong, that might help.

but the Taliban's form of extreme Islam just doesn't allow for any of that.

As i understand it the Quaran/Koran (sorry have seen it spelled multiple ways) lays out respectful treatment of women etc etc. In the practice many muslim men i know adhere to this. The Taliban are a whole other kettle of fish.

The ICC must be made to see that they are breaking their own bloody rules about the cricket. To be a member they have to have structures for women's cricket in place, and for youth training programmes etc. The men's team (the women's for that matter, too) are in exile and are not supported by the actual government of Afghanistan. They do not belong in international competitions for that alone.

It’s a total disgrace, but what can we do?

They are so poor that additional sanctions would only add starvation to their problems, and they would doubtless starve the women first.

Should we (as in the U.S) invade again? There is certainly a case for it, but I doubt they will prioritise it.

We should probably incentivise them to pursue policies on women’s rights and try to arm and help any opposition-but maybe we are already.

What they are doing is sickening and desperately sad, as has been our abandonment of Iraq and Afghanistan since the Cheney/Blair war on terror.

Personally, I think the Blair family should be exiled there en masse, but clearly that isn’t a practical or legal suggestion!

we don't need to invade.

Those women's lives are already unbearable, and their representatives are asking us to boycott. What we need is for governments and organisations to reassure ALL OTHER WOMEN, as well as the Afghani women we can't now reach (i assume RAWA et al have contacts) that they, we, care about all women.

That is all we can do at this stage. But isn't that better than just shrugging and carrying on treating the Taliban like a legitimate government, and letting those <sarcasm> poor Afghan men who can't go home play cricket? </sarcasm>

Or should we just reinforce the message to all women on the planet that nobody cares about us. When push comes to shove, and even before that, women don't matter.

The ICC must be made to see that they are breaking their own bloody rules about the cricket. To be a member they have to have structures for women's cricket in place, and for youth training programmes etc. The men's team (the women's for that matter, too) are in exile and are not supported by the actual government of Afghanistan. They do not belong in international competitions for that alone.

I agree.

Agree with astute observation by @MrsTerryPratchett that different sectors care about different things.

But do bear in mind that a huge difference between South Africa and Afghanistan is that white South Africa cared deeply what the rest of the world thought of it (even those South Africans who claimed they didn't). It was a massive part of white South Africa's underlying myth that they were the bringing Christian civilisation to the continent, and that white South Africans deserved their elite position because they were the beacons of civilisation and virtue in a sea of uncivilised ignorance. (The gulf between this self-image and the reality would be laughable if it weren't so ghastly.)

White South Africans were deeply emotionally wounded by being told they didn't make the grade and weren't "one of us".

The Taliban do not give the shiniest of shits what the rest of the world think of them – other than how manipulation will be useful to them.

A working history of the rise of Rome is never wasted. Always be wary of people who dismiss history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_of_the_Sabine_women

The Taliban do not give the shiniest of shits what the rest of the world think of them – other than how manipulation will be useful to them.

so we... say nothing? that doesn't work for me.
Agree that SA was a whole other thing. But we spoke almost as one, and it worked. It is the "speaking as one" that I'm after, the actual demonstration that women's lives matter.

It is the "speaking as one" that I'm after, the actual demonstration that women's lives matter.

I agree. Every other group makes sure that their objection is heard, even when it's much less of an issue than this. It's an important message. Women's rights are always secondary.

All for banning them from cricket and all other sport and any activity where they can show off their ‘civilised credentials’ internationally.

But there is very little else to sanction. They are dirt poor and do very little trade.

Very true. We had SA rellies and they HATED that we all thought they were complicit in racism. It was incredible cognitive dissonance.

I don't agree with @Newbutoldfather that economic sanctions should be avoided because of the old argument that it's worse for people. That argument was used in SA as well and it didn't hold water there either.

I think cricket and heroin are both important. For very different reasons.

A lot of their other imports and exports are with countries who don't give a shit. Pakistan, China etc.

Oh yes, I agree with you completely that "say nothing" is not the alternative.

It's extremely important to keep speaking up for women's lives in Afghanistan.

"I think this is a good argument for universal human rights and we need to question the option that all cultures are equally vaild."

Whilst a noble idea in principles the issue here is that breaches of those rights are unenforceable.

You also can't dictate to other people what their culture and government should be. Afghanistan itself is testament to that.

one of the reasons i want countries to speak up, and speak up often, is to have it on record that our countries care about what happens to women.

Right now i feel that women's rights are one of those "nice to have" things that nobody in power is really invested in.

@Walkden ,

‘You also can't dictate to other people what their culture and government should be. Afghanistan itself is testament to that.’

I don’t agree with that at all and treating women and girls like brood mares can’t be described as ‘culture’ in any sense of the word.

I do think that we do need to show that we won’t tolerate it by travel bans for the leadership and their families and, ultimately, trying to force regime change by both financial and other means.

I hope Trump will be motivated to do something here after Biden so egregiously dropped the ball.

You also can't dictate to other people what their culture and government should be. Afghanistan itself is testament to that.

There's can't and there's shouldn't.

In Afghanistan's case it's obvious that we can't. Everyone has tried hence 'graveyard of empires'.

It's important though that we should be able to tell other people that if some of them can't express thought, vote, speak, have to dress in a certain way that the other people don't, are owned, are beaten, are raped, then it's not a cultural 'choice'.

If you give all the women of Afghanistan a free choice, unbound by a lack of access and education, and they all choose this, that's one thing. But men imposing this 'culture' on them is quite another.