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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

For Women Scotland heading for Supreme Court

1000 replies

Imnobody4 · 07/10/2024 23:19

You can read the reasons etc in For Women Scotlands crowdfunder. They are launching this review
UK Supreme Court: The Definition of Sex in the Equality Act

The Inner House of the Court of Session Judgment

We believe the Equality Act was drafted on the basis of the ordinary, common law understanding of the biological differences between the two sexes. The protected characteristic of “sex” in the Equality Act is defined as a reference to a man or a woman, where man means “a male of any age” and woman means “a female of any age”. We think it is quite clear that these are distinct and separate groups and that “woman” is not a mixed-sex category.

However, in our recent judicial review, For Women Scotland v The Scottish Ministers [2023] CSIH 37, the Inner House took the opposite view and decided there is a relationship between the Gender Recognition Act 2004 (GRA) and Equality Act 2010 and held that the meaning of sex in the Equality Act incorporated the GRA framework.

The court decision stated that a person with a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC) in their acquired gender has the protected characteristic of gender reassignment. Separately, they also possess the protected characteristic of sex according to the terms of their GRC and have a presumptive right to access the single-sex services of their acquired gender.

The Supreme Court will consider a request brought by For Women Scotland (FWS) who argue there are “strong grounds” for its challenge, which will almost certainly overturn contentious Scottish government legislation if successful.Campaigners for women’s “sex-based” rights reacted with delight to the news, including Magi Gibson, the poet, who posted on X/Twitter, that it was “game on” on in the “fight for the protection of women’s rights within the UK legal system”.Dennis Noel Kavanagh, a lawyer and the director of Gay Men’s Network, said: “Getting permission to go to the Supreme Court is really hard and very rare but FWS have it. The question ‘what is a woman’ in law will now be heard by our highest court. Massive news.”

www.thetimes.com/article/088ae0ce-fba9-4b97-8331-01a32195bef5?shareToken=3ada340957f5d2af2e20b01a7c15da3b

OP posts:
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Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:34

How ON EARTH are Tribunal Tweets gonna make any sense out of this?

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 14:35

musicalfrog · 26/11/2024 14:34

Just to mention journalist Nick Wallis is also in the room and tweeting along.

https://x.com/nickwallis/

x.com

https://x.com/nickwallis

nauticant · 26/11/2024 14:36

Does that mean the subpostmasters were villains all along then?

Signalbox · 26/11/2024 14:40

AlbertCamusflage · 26/11/2024 14:34

Because that exception is explicitly written into the law, I guess that it doesn't have an impact on how possible-exceptional-situations are dealt with when they are not explicitly written into the law?

All that the hereditary peerage get-out does is demonstrate how utterly cynical some of the processes were when the law was made; rather than having a bearing on how the law can be interpreted?

Sports also written into the GRA but this is widely ignored. I wonder if hereditary peerage would be ignored in the same way if a woman tried to take advantage of it.

SinnerBoy · 26/11/2024 14:44

Blimey, 992,000 views and 243 likes on that Amnesty tweet!

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 14:48

'The GRA is about vertical relationships between the individual and the state. The EA is about horizontal relationships between individuals'

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:48

Even this v capable lawyer seems to be losing the will to live!

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 14:49

Conclusion now.

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:54

So in conclusion he's just saying, use your common sense!

Olderbadger1 · 26/11/2024 14:54

Maybe I'm over-critical because it matters so bloody much but I'm not convinced that the rapidity of his presentation and (understandable) WTAF-style approach have been helpful. I realise he only has a limited time but this is so complicated/confusing, it really does need a more careful approach.
The conclusion is strong though - provided reasonable rationality holds sway.

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:56

Agree, he started out so well, but it all got v garbled at the end.

dunBle · 26/11/2024 14:56

Loving his derisive tone mentioning that "Amnesty International didn't bother to tell us" about the issues of men with GRCs in women's prisons.

Harassedevictee · 26/11/2024 14:57

He’s getting tired and rushing his points. They are good points but not having chance to sink in.

dunBle · 26/11/2024 14:58

To be fair, at this point he's summing up stuff he mentioned earlier as far as I can tell, so it's more about flagging up things he wants them to think about rather than going into the detailed arguments relating to it.

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:59

I wish he hadn't taken so long blathering on about patriarchy at the beginning tbh.

MissSueFlay · 26/11/2024 15:00

Will his submission written down go to the judges so they can read it later? He seems to be reading it out so it's obviously a script.

Harassedevictee · 26/11/2024 15:00

@dunBle fair point. I admire his stamina.

dunBle · 26/11/2024 15:00

Ben Cooper up now.

ArabellaScott · 26/11/2024 15:00

It's Ben!

chilling19 · 26/11/2024 15:00

Ben!!!

highame · 26/11/2024 15:01

I really hope Bridget Phillipson, Anneliese Dodds et al are listening. Self ID is an abomination, glad it's being covered

Harassedevictee · 26/11/2024 15:01

Appalonia · 26/11/2024 14:59

I wish he hadn't taken so long blathering on about patriarchy at the beginning tbh.

I think this was really important.

CriticalCondition · 26/11/2024 15:01

Ooh, it's Ben.😁

Signalbox · 26/11/2024 15:01

♥️

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