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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

BBC claim 'Grover is a self-declared ‘TERF’ - an acronym that stands for “trans-exclusionary radical feminist.” TERFs’ views on gender identity are widely considered to be hostile to trans people.'

84 replies

ArabellaScott · 23/08/2024 12:56

Bullshit, BBC.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c07ev1v7r4po

Make a complaint here:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/contact/complaints

Roxanne Tickle (centre) looks on as she is surrounded by people while speaking to press outside the Federal Court of Australia in Sydney on 23 August.

Australian court rules in case that asked 'what is a woman?'

Roxanne Tickle has won a landmark case which questioned who can legally claim to be a woman.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c07ev1v7r4po

OP posts:
Catsmere · 10/09/2024 22:37

theilltemperedclavecinist · 10/09/2024 22:34

Well, she is claiming to be a TERF, and that's what it stands for. But maybe she thinks it just means sex-realist?

Thanks, and goodness knows. Either would do. We need everyone to fight against these men.

theilltemperedclavecinist · 10/09/2024 22:44

Catsmere · 10/09/2024 22:37

Thanks, and goodness knows. Either would do. We need everyone to fight against these men.

Actually on reflection (and massively overthinking this now), what I said about TERFs, viz:

They believe that women are disadvantaged because of their female-sexed bodies (smaller and weaker; able to give birth), and that ... that disadvantage is not relevant to transwomen, because they do not have female-sexed bodies.

is just as true for conservatives who believe in different roles for men and women as it is for feminists. Neither wants to see men in women's spaces.

ArabellaScott · 13/09/2024 09:43

For comparison, here is an article from the BBC reporting on a man using a slur that he said he was 'reclaiming'.

They don't use the word, but say 'the P word' when referring to it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62r20907yeo

cricket ball

Cricket Scotland probe as board member apologises over 'P' word

The governing body investigates historical tweets in which the word was used in reference to Pakistanis.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62r20907yeo

OP posts:
Grammarnut · 13/09/2024 15:49

I complained about the BBC article. I got this back:
Dear

Thank you for getting in touch about our BBC News website article on the landmark Australian court ruling where a transgender woman won a discrimination case against a women-only social media app, after she was denied access on the basis of being male.

We reported on the background and explained the case had been brought against the app “Giggle for Girls” and its CEO Sall Grover by Roxanne Tickle. We described Ms Grover as a “self-declared Terf”.

Some readers felt our article was biased against women. They objected to our use of the term “Terf” saying it was offensive, which we acknowledged. We explained it stood for trans-exclusionary radical feminist. We later added more context: “Typically used as a derogatory term for those considered hostile to transgender people, it has also been claimed by some to describe their own gender-critical beliefs.”

Grover does indeed use the term to describe herself and has set up an online TV channel called “Terf TV”. She is on record as saying she understands the term is controversial but believes it will become acceptable over time. We believe our reporting was fair and balanced.

Thank you again for contacting us to make your views known. All feedback from readers is shared with senior editors so that they are aware of audience concerns.

Kind regards,

ArabellaScott · 13/09/2024 16:19

If anyone wants to keep going to the next stage, you need to go back and re-complain via the BBC website.

If after that you are still not satisfied, there is the opportunity to escalate to Ofcom.

OP posts:
Nellodee · 14/09/2024 07:38

Surely if you’re having to define the word terf, you’re probably speaking to an audience that also requires some explanation of the term gender critical. However, to explain that term would have placed anyone new to the topic on the side of the terf, so better (in the eyes of the bbc) to just leave it as them being hostile to trans people.

ArabellaScott · 14/09/2024 08:03

Nellodee · 14/09/2024 07:38

Surely if you’re having to define the word terf, you’re probably speaking to an audience that also requires some explanation of the term gender critical. However, to explain that term would have placed anyone new to the topic on the side of the terf, so better (in the eyes of the bbc) to just leave it as them being hostile to trans people.

Or even an expansion of the acronym and explanation.

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 14/09/2024 08:06

Sorry, to be neutral one should expand the acronym and explain it stands for 'trans exclusionary radical feminist'.

And further that this means women who don't include men in the definition of women.

It's not accurate though as many who have the word applied are not RFs or even feminists.

It's a complex term with many layers of history - as.are many slurs. If the BBC wants to use it they'll need to explain it properly.

OP posts:
MissScarletInTheBallroom · 14/09/2024 08:10

I don't think explaining the acronym helps much because "trans exclusionary radical feminist" sounds like an angry bra burning activist with a forest full of armpit hair who thinks trans people should be sent to live in ghettos, rather than simply someone who thinks that women's human rights matter and that we should be allowed to have some single sex spaces and sports of our own without being forced to include men who want to be women.

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