Cervical cancer screening advice for gypsies and travellers

[RoyalCorgi]

This is fascinating. A very short leaflet with advice on cervical cancer screening.

https://www.gypsy-traveller.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/Cervical-Cancer-Leaflet.pdf

Absolutely nothing to say who the leaflet is aimed at, apart from the need to be aged over 25.

The parents have the same rights as any other to withdraw their children for Home Education of a type they deem fit. They have an additional right to attend schools for shorter periods under the T attendance code so that they can attend without being automatically offrolled when travelling for the parents' work.

To say all parents have a right to EHE unless they are in a specific ethnicity category would constitute racism. Which we see plenty of towards Gypsy, Roma and Travellers all too often anyhow.

The advantage of such a vaguely worded leaflet is that they are likely to be handed it by somebody who is actually able to explain more verbally and be more reassuring.

I have experience from working in Gynae/Antenatal (and having an appearance that is consistently associated with one particular group, despite being of very mixed background - thanks to my grandfather's origins) - I'd go over and chat to the patients in a quiet area before they went in to see a doctor, nurse or midwife. They were, frankly, unsure, a bit scared and were already taking a huge step by being there with or without their Mums or an older friend, so the last thing they needed was an incredibly detailed leaflet that might put them off.

Some people just need an actual human to talk to, just like some people learn better from doing than reading or from seeing rather than being told (I'm one of those - didn't stop me getting high level qualifications and my visual learning aids/posters/resources are bloody amazing). An incredibly brief leaflet like that would be better at encouraging them to ask in the first place.

Better still, if a pharmaceutical company sponsored an outreach nurse bus, for women and children, where children could get their jabs, and a nurse can explain the need for cervical screening/ breast screening and what it means and how to get on to the recall system.

Some posters on this thread have responded aggressively to people critiquing the leaflet, calling us 'You lot' and suggesting we're talking about it because we're offended is just downright odd, frankly.

If you are correct that only 40% of women know what a cervix is (and I imagine G/T women make a good number of those), why is everyone getting so agitated that it's not mentioned ?

why is everyone getting so agitated that it's not mentioned ?

They aren't. The cervix is mentioned.

It's the absence of everything else - the information that would help all the people who don't know what a cervix is understand the point of the leaflet and what actions they need to take - that people are concrned about.

I understand your thinking, but wanted to offer my perspective.
My mum worked as a district nurse for years, and as part of that she regularly needed to visit a settled romani site to provide necessary healthcare to people there. They were very suspicious at first, but she worked to gain trust, so that she could do her job there, but it took time.
This is probably the sort of leaflet she'd have taken with her, and would likely then explain in person. As anything too formal, authoritarian or taboo would be outright rejected. The hardest thing was to build that initial relationship, and then you could work up.

It is interesting that they chose to depict the female patient looking androgenous wearing trousers. In some Roma communities married women do not wear trousers ever. It is considered inappropriate.

My friend currently has anal bleeding with stomach pains and "other unusual changes". For those, who don't know what a cervix is - according to Jo's cervical cancer trust that is 44.2% of women -, this leaflet is completely useless.

I don't see how this could work. It is totally unclear what this is and for whom.

I think the rights of children to an education should trump the rights of any parent to home educate in 'any way they deem fit'.

Many people on this thread have pointed out that gypsy and traveller girls may be less educated or literate. We are talking presumably about young women in their twenties or thirties. So British women growing up in the 21st century who have not had a proper education.

It's not racist to find that obscene. It's racist to allow it to continue out of misplaced 'cultural sensitivity'.

It is interesting that they chose to depict the female patient looking androgenous wearing trousers. In some Roma communities married women do not wear trousers ever. It is considered inappropriate.

That thought struck me too, but I didn't say anything about it because I really don't know enough about it. There is a statement on the leaflet that it was created in collaboration with members of the community, which makes it all the more puzzling.

@NeverDropYourMooncup What makes you think this leaflet will be handed in by someone who can explain more? What is the purpose of the leaflet if it needs explanation by a person? That surely demonstrates how bad this leaflet is.

I think there is a lot of room between this leaflet to an "incredibly detailed" one. This one does not even specify the sex of the person it is aimed at.

The purpose of a leaflet + verbal messaging combo is to reinforce information through multiple semiotic channels. You don't want to overwhelm people with little formal schooling with lots of written information that is hard for them to access, but nor do you want to just tell them stuff and trust they remember it. You give them the info they need verbally, adjusting the amount of detail in the message to their reactions in real time, and you give them a leaflet with key points in plain language to take away and digest and refer back to.

Yes, this is right. I worked with a large Irish traveller group a few years ago and t very few could read anything more than the most basic words. The women used to bring me letters ask I could read them for them. There were a lot of taboos around cleanliness and medical issues

you give them a leaflet with key points in plain language to take away and digest and refer back to.

Yes, this is an absolutely sound principle. But, once again, the point is that this leaflet does not cover the key points in plain language.

Cool. Let's ban all middleclass parents from 'unschooling' or 'homeschooling' their children too. None of that EHE from infancy or deferring admission an extra year for summer borns, either. All children must go to their nearest State school in the September preceding their 5th birthday, fulltime, no exceptions.

You cannot remove a universal right for one ethnic group. So it gets removed for everybody.

* What makes you think this leaflet will be handed in by someone who can explain more? What is the purpose of the leaflet if it needs explanation by a person? *

Because somebody like me would be handing them out. Not all people are happy to start a conversation straight away, but having this could be the thing that encourages them to ask. Might not even be something gynae related that they ask about, but that's fine, asking for advice/help/what it means is a huge step in itself.

I would be quite happy to remove the 'right' to deny your children an education from everybody.
Because I think the child's rights are more important than the parents.

As far as I understand it, parents have to ensure their children receive an education, either in school 'or otherwise.'

The issue with gypsy and traveller children is that they are not receiving anything that should be recognised as education once they are removed from school. It's not racist to say this.
If middle class home schooling families are all teaching their children nothing except cleaning for five hours a day, those children should also be in school.

It's possible to allow home education while ensuring that it actually is education, not an open ended 'any way they deem fit'.

Oh FFS yet another dreadful cervical cancer leaflet. Bet the prostate equivalent is clear that it's for men.

@tellmewhenthespaceshiplandscoz it seems really sad doesn't it. My mum grew up in Ireland many years ago and wasn't even told about periods until she had one. Just told 'don't go near boys'. It's pretty upsetting. Especially as abortion was illegal and contraception and consent so limited in Ireland in her day. But she wasn't a traveller. It seems a lot of their culture is based on ways of the past. But I guess I don't know much about a society I'm not part of.
I certainly don't think they should have to conform but women's rights can fall low on the list in some ways. I really hope this doesn't sound inappropriate.

I was curious to see if this is the case, so had a look at the other leaflets on the site. There wasn't one on prostate cancer, but there was a general one on cancer, and one on breast cancer. Both were tremendously vague, which suggests that the decision not to mention certain offputting words is very much a feature, not a bug. So perhaps HumanBurrito and others are right, at least in terms of the intention of the leaflets - though I am still sceptical about the effectiveness of the approach.

Here's the breast cancer one:

https://www.gypsy-traveller.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/Breast-Cancer-Leaflet-1.pdf

Having lived traveller-adjacent for most of my adult life, I'm pretty confident saying this leaflet isn't meant to make sense to us. It's designed for a specific community with specific needs around communication, and if FTT have produced it then it will be spot on for the community it's aimed at.

You'd all have a field day with the mental health leaflet FTT designed a few years ago! But it wasn't for us, it was for Travellers. And it will have been pitched just right to communicate effectively with that group.

But surely whatever community this is meant for it would be helpful to say women at some point?

@RoyalCorgi I think the problem starts with saying it is for "the community". There is no such thing. Travellers originated in Ireland and are a different ethnicity from the Roma who originated in India. Even "the" Roma do not exist.

Just because something is co-produced does not mean it is always good or works. In participation, people often have very different views and preferences and professionals make choices.

That is the biggest fecking issue with the thing! The failure to identify who the target audience is other than via - as I mentioned in my earlier post - deductive reasoning, working back from the information it’s normally done by woman anyway but you can confirm on booking your appointment that you require this 🤦‍♀️